Phyllisstein says:
Sorry to hark back to such an ancient (my, how fast things move here!) post. I got really excited by Faldage's comment and hoped to find some follow up on the etymology of the expression. It seems untenable to me that the logicians express proprietary rights over it when they haven't proven that they are entitled to ownership. Talk about begging the question! I wouldn't say that anyone thinks they "own" it. They only define it. A quick google search comes up with umpty-six very similar definitions with very similar examples. As a matter of fact, no one claims ownership of it at all, more's the pity ...
The real premise that I want to see examined is: what does the phrase mean, or what did it mean when it was first invented. And why that particular construction which, as Faldage points out, apparently defies logic.The meaning doesn't appear to have shifted (and has been expressed very clearly among the mess of this thread). However, here's a good reference:
http://www.drury.edu/faculty/Ess/Logic/Informal/Begging_the_Question.html. But almost any of the others explain it as well.
The etymology is obscure - I haven't been able to track down anything reliable, but from the structure of the expression I would expect that it became entrenched in the language during the 17th or 18th centures, although it probably has much earlier origins. Finding explanations for the origins of expressions is not easy. They are just "accepted". Someone else on the board may be able to find something definite.
I find the threads so labyrinthine and the digressions and tangents so impenetrable (though utterly fascinating) that I'm not sure I will live long enough to check all the posts.We were all trained in obfuscation and sewing genteel-ish confusion by the Byzantine civil service during the 13th century. We can send you back for some instruction in the art if you like!
