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Carpal Tunnel
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Carpal Tunnel
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Posts: 2,636 |
NOTHING CAN BE DONE
Music by Larry Klein words by Joni Mitchell
Must I forgive you
Each time
And say you don't know what your're doing
There are no victimless crimes
I know of
Out here in these graffiti ruins
My love
Oh I am not old
I'm told
But I am not young
Oh and nothing can be done
Don't start
My heart
Is a smoking gun
Oh and nothing can be done
I heard you leaving
Late last night
I heard you screaming down the mountain
Like you were running red lights
(Red lights)
You had some trash-can-rock-band pounding
Oh I am not old
I'm told
But I am not young
Oh and nothing can be done
Don't start
My heart
Is a smoking gun
Oh and nothing can be done
Must I surrender
With grace
The things I loved when I was younger
(Sweet embrace)
Must I remember your face
So well
What do I do here with this hunger
Oh I am not old
I'm told
But I am not young
Oh and nothing can be done
Don't start
My heart
Is a smoking gun
Oh and nothing can be done
Nothing can be done
Nothing can be done
Oh nothing can be done
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Posts: 4,189
Carpal Tunnel
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Carpal Tunnel
Joined: Mar 2001
Posts: 4,189 |
Don't Think Twice, it's Alright
Bob Dylan
Well it ain't no use to sit and wonder why, baby
If'n you don't know by now
And it ain't no use to sit and wonder why, babe
It'll never do somehow
When your rooster crows at the break of dawn,
look out your window and I'll be gone
you're the reason I'm a travelling on
But don't think twice, it's all right
And it ain't no use in turning on your light babe
the light I never knowed
and it ain't no use in turning on your light babe
I'm on the dark side of the road
Well I wish there was something you would do or say
to try and make me change my mind and stay
we never did too much talking anyway
But don't think twice, it's all right
So it ain't no use in calling out my name, gal
like you never done before
and it ain't no use in calling out my name, gal
I can't hear you any more
I'm a thinkin' and a wonderin', walkin' down the road
I once loved a woman, a child I am told
I give her my heart but she wanted my soul
Don't think twice, it's all right
So long honey babe
where I'm bound, I can't tell
goodbye is too good a word babe
so I'll just say fare the well
I ain't a sayin' you treated me unkind
you coulda done better but, I don't mind
you just kinda wasted my precious time
Don't think twice, it's all right
© 1965 by Bob Dylan
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old hand
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old hand
Joined: Feb 2002
Posts: 833 |
Yes, there's nothing in the lyrics to that Beatles tune to suggest gender. I was taking it that it was a man speaking, since it was a man singing. Here's just one place where I reckon he (again assuming a man is speaking) seems to me to be thinking he is right and the woman is wrong: THINK OF WHAT YOU'RE SAYING,
YOU CAN GET IT WRONG AND STILL YOU THINK THAT IT'S ALL RIGHT.
THINK OF WHAT I'M SAYING,
WE CAN WORK IT OUT AND GET IT STRAIGHT, OR SAY GOOD NIGHT."You can get it wrong and still you think that it's all right"? Who the [expletive deleted] is this guy, to tell the woman that she's got it wrong? Of course, it would help to know the whole story.  Maybe the man IS right. But without knowing the whole story, to me, these lyrics imply that the woman is wrong-headed and of course the man is right: she can go on thinking what she thinks, which is naturally wrong, or she can come around to the man's way of thinking, which is naturally right. Then there's the suggestion that if she goes on thinking the way she does, they'll fall apart before too long. What about if he goes on thinking the way he does? Why won't that make them fall apart before too long? Gimme a break. It just seems to me that all the way through, the man is trying to make the woman change, and assuming she's wrong simply because she doesn't agree with him. But then, I've had a lot of men like that in my life, so that definitely colours my perception. I thank God for the ones still in my life, who don't try to FORCE me to think how they do. We celebrate each other's differences - and we certainly change our points of view when it seems right to us to do so, in accordance with each other's opinions. But I've always hated that God damn song! 
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Posts: 6,296
Carpal Tunnel
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OP
Carpal Tunnel
Joined: Sep 2001
Posts: 6,296 |
Well, I must jump back on this:
THINK OF WHAT YOU'RE SAYING,
YOU CAN GET IT WRONG AND STILL YOU THINK THAT IT'S ALL RIGHT.
I'd say that the speaker is simply trying to beseech the person addressed to consider a different point of view--a viewpoint, a realization that they are about to destroy their relationship. The person addressed is apparently entrenched in a point of view and won't acknowledge that there is another side. The speaker obviously doesn't know whether he/she (gender doesn't matter)is right or wrong, but is saying here in the lyric you quote that 'you can get it wrong'--not 'you are wrong.'
What I think you're missing in the lyrics, modestgoddess, is the point that these two have two different viewpoints, and one of them (the person to whom the song is addressed) believes he/she is right to the point that the relationship has been threatened because it is now a fully developed fight. It is the person addressed who apparently won't acknowledge that there is another viewpoint because she/he is entirely sure that her/his viewpoint is right, right, right. And because she/he is so entrenched in the viewpoint, the relationship is threatened.
The person making the plea recognizes that the person addressed has a different viewpoint, but that viewpoint may be incorrect. Again 'only time will tell' which viewpoint may turn out to be correct, but in the meantime the relationship is disintegrating--and the person addressed is so entrenched in being right and winning the fight that the relationship could end. I think the speaker is saying the fight itself is destructive--that they will lose their relationship if they don't try to 'work out' the problem--focus on the relationship itself--find a point of peace and forget the fight, which is in itself a losing battle because their viewpoints are so different.
Can't you remember all those times we all go through in which you've strongly disagreed with someone in the real world--thought the person was entirely wrong--and the other person continued to argue with you--and great pain began to develop in the course of arguing--and at some point you realized, "This fight isn't worth it. My point of view is not worth developing any further because I can see that winning this argument is not more important than the friendship I have with this person. And you cause yourself to back out of your argument--it is no longer important winning it, but preserving the friendship is by far more important.
I think the song is about that kind of situation. In the course of a heated argument between lovers, the speaker sees that they have entered dangerous waters. He sees that they are divided. Or, if seen from a female perspective, she sees that they are divided. And there is a recognition that the fight has become so bad that they may no longer be together if they continue. So the song is a plea to stop fighting. No one will be the winner because their viewpoints are so different--only 'time will tell' who is right or wrong--but that rightness or wrongness isn't important at this heated moment. What is more important is that the fight stop and that they refocus on their love.
They have two viewpoints; both have their heels dug in; neither gives in; one of them realizes, "This fight ain't worth destroying our relationship"; forget the fight; focus again on less controversial, dividing aspects of their relationship.
Question is: Can two people who love each other have diametrically opposed viewpoints? Viewpoints that could be fiercely argued even? Of course they can. Should they argue these viewpoints to the point that they begin to "fight" or "fuss"? Well, why not--sure they can. But suppose their arguments develop to the point that it starts to feel as though they don't love each other anymore? Well, then one of them needs to back down and say, "Let's not fight about this anymore. It's starting to feel destructive."
And that's what I think this song is about.
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Posts: 4,189
Carpal Tunnel
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Carpal Tunnel
Joined: Mar 2001
Posts: 4,189 |
Piece of My heart
Janis Joplin (w Big brother and the Holding Company)
Oh, come on, come on, come on, come on!
Didn’t I make you feel like you were the only man —yeah!
Didn’t I give you nearly everything that a woman possibly can ?
Honey, you know I did!
And each time I tell myself that I, well I think I’ve had enough,
But I’m gonna show you, baby, that a woman can be tough.
I want you to come on, come on, come on, come on and take it,
Take it!
Take another little piece of my heart now, baby!
Oh, oh, break it!
Break another little bit of my heart now, darling, yeah, yeah, yeah.
Oh, oh, have a!
Have another little piece of my heart now, baby,
You know you got it if it makes you feel good,
Oh, yes indeed.
You’re out on the streets looking good,
And baby deep down in your heart I guess you know that it ain’t right,
Never, never, never, never, never, never hear me when I cry at night,
Babe, I cry all the time!
And each time I tell myself that I, well I can’t stand the pain,
But when you hold me in your arms, I’ll sing it once again.
I’ll say come on, come on, come on, come on and take it!
Take it!
Take another little piece of my heart now, baby.
Oh, oh, break it!
Break another little bit of my heart now, darling, yeah,
Oh, oh, have a!
Have another little piece of my heart now, baby,
You know you got it, child, if it makes you feel good.
I need you to come on, come on, come on, come on and take it,
Take it!
Take another little piece of my heart now, baby!
oh, oh, break it!
Break another little bit of my heart, now darling, yeah, c’mon now.
oh, oh, have a
Have another little piece of my heart now, baby.
You know you got it —whoahhhhh!!
Take it!
Take it! Take another little piece of my heart now, baby,
Oh, oh, break it!
Break another little bit of my heart, now darling, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah,
Oh, oh, have a
Have another little piece of my heart now, baby, hey,
You know you got it, child, if it makes you feel good.
© 1967 by Janis Joplin
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Posts: 833
old hand
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old hand
Joined: Feb 2002
Posts: 833 |
Wordwind, maybe the song is about us! I still celebrate our difference. I thought you argued your points very eloquently. And I still hate the song. 
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Posts: 4,189
Carpal Tunnel
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Carpal Tunnel
Joined: Mar 2001
Posts: 4,189 |
WW, maybe the song is about us! Yes, Dub-Dub and mg, here's your song!...  SOMEWHEREThere's a place for us,
Somewhere a place for us.
Peace and quiet and open air
Wait for us
Somewhere.
There's a time for us,
Some day a time for us,
Time together with time to spare,
Time to learn, time to care,
Some day!
Somewhere.
We'll find a new way of living,
We'll find a way of forgiving
Somewhere . . .
There's a place for us,
A time and place for us.
Hold my hand and we're halfway there.
Hold my hand and I'll take you there
Somehow,
Some day,
Somewhere! from West Side StoryMusic by Leonard Bernstein, lyrics by Stephen Sondheim. hi, mg! © 1956, 1957 Amberson Holdings LLC and Stephen Sondheim. Copyright renewed. Leonard Bernstein Music Publishing Company LLC, Publisher.
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Posts: 6,296
Carpal Tunnel
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OP
Carpal Tunnel
Joined: Sep 2001
Posts: 6,296 |
Juan, I don't think mg and dd were fighting. I think we were looking at one song from two different angles. It was a discussion. Those two people in the song--well, they were fighting. I don't like fighting--tears me to pieces to even approach a fight. And mg doesn't like the song that dd does--and that's probably both a matter of taste and hearing the lyrics quite differently from each other.
Wanna talk about some music I cannot stand? Well, anything from West Side Story is already a pretty good contender. I think the gal who sang Natalie Woods' part ruined West Side Story permanently for me--cannot stand that high-pitched, operatic-like voice on the dubs projecting such a conterfeit Maria. Blagh, blagh, blagh!
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Posts: 4,189
Carpal Tunnel
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Carpal Tunnel
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Wanna talk about some music I cannot stand? Well, anything from West Side Story is already a pretty good contender.Well there you go, WW!...you and mg on common grouynd at last! You two guys were meant for each other! you don't know what you just did to me here, Dub-Dub...ducking for cover quick before mg shows up!
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Posts: 13,803
Carpal Tunnel
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Carpal Tunnel
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anything from West Side Story is already a pretty good contender.
Surely you except Officer Krupke and OK by me in America from this blanket undorsement.
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