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I came across a new word, new to me at any rate, the other day: hydrogeology. I know we have several members versed in the earth sciences, so could they explain the difference in subject matter and approach between hydrogeology and hydrology please.
Bingley
Bingley
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Dear Bingley: to display my ignorance, I suspect hydrogeology might refer to understanding major aquifers such as underly immense areas I believe in northeast Texas. Hydrology would be a much wider term, meaning the science of every manifestation of the earth's water. As usual, a URL: http://www.ela-iet.com/el00001.htm
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Praps it's the study of the mineral content of various bodies of water, Bingley. Or maybe the study of sediments and how they eventually form into the various sedimentary rocks due to the action of oceans, lakes, and streams.
Guess we'll have to wait until stales checks in tonight for the "lowdown" on this one.
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Pooh-Bah
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Could "hydrogeology" mean the study of how water has shaped the earth, such as at the Grand Canyon?
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Could "hydrogeology" mean the study of how water has shaped the earth, such as at the Grand Canyon?Tha just may be the ticket, Alex!  Sounds closer than any of my suppositions (amateur geologist that I am). Hopefully, stalesy the pro, will solve it for us.
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A quick Google makes it look as if it has something to do with groundwater, so you may not be too far wrong, WO'N. But as you say, let's wait for Stalesy to dish us up the dirt on it ... 
The idiot also known as Capfka ...
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You mean I'm not allowed to talk about something I know absolutely nothing about? Guys, my wife has been trying to convince me of that for over 25 years, without notable success.
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Hey ladies, here's another "guy thread" and they all agree they don't know what they are talking about! I think we ought to bookmark this one! [ducking for cover-e]
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Interesting side note without a link: Last night I read on Quinion about groundswells, that turned out to be swells of the ocean thought to rise from the ocean floor. The reading was very interesting--let me take a look at my bookmarks and see whether I saved the link... Yep, I did save it: http://www.quinion.com/words/qa/qa-gro2.htmHope I remembered how to paste a link! Boat regards, WordWater
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enthusiast
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Howya Bingly
Sorry I couldn't answer yer query earlier, but me tedasaurus was in hock - gamblen debts, ya know.
Anyways, hydrology is the study of water on earth whereas hydrogeology is water underground.
Hope this answers yer query and I told Idi the Mean from the pawn shop that ya'd pay fer me tedasaurus. I gave him yer phone number and address, if that's ok. He should be around later.
GallantTed
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Hiya Bingley - may be able to help here....Well, I'll have a go "off the top of my head" and, if nobody subsequently objects, we'll take it as gospel!
As G'Ted has said, I believe "hydrogeology" is moreso to do with subterranean water, whilst "hydrology" relates to the characteristics of water on the earth's surface.
To grossly simplify the situation, hydrogeologists would either be looking upon subterranean water ("groundwater") as a resource or a nuisance. I'd like the think that the former aspect of water is obvious - all to do with aquifers, the search for them, the estimation of the resource, the recharging dynamics of the aquifer and the exploitation of the resource. As a quick aside, Perth is coming off the driest summer in 30 years; our dams are all but empty, we are only allowed to water our lawns on a roster - and 60% of the supply is being pulled from underground.
Water as a nuisance refers to the fact that an excess of water in the ground reduces the strength of the ground dramatically. Frinstance, the nature, size and quantity of supporting structures (piles etc) for tall buildings is a product not only of the nature of the substrate, but also its water content. Open pit mines and road cuts are the same - the more water present, the shallower the walls must be - and thus (in the case of mines anyway), the greater the expense attributable to waste removal. Whilst vast sums of money are spent dewatering sites ahead of mining, this is less than would need to be spent in earthmoving costs to strip away the waste if the "wet" substrate was being mined. In underground mines slope stability is less of a factor (the openings are much smaller), but water is still treated as a threat as it can flood the operation.
As I understand it, hydrology is moreso to do with how the water behaves on the surface. There is a focus on runoff, flood mitigation, river control etc. What the Dutch have done and the Brits with the Thames are classic examples of the Hydrologists' art.
How'd I go?
stales
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Ye with ears listen to stales.But I leaned forward in my chair waiting, hoping, for Brother Stales to mention the object, or more accurately, the lack of objects, of my perverted affection. Maybe he forgot... SINKHOLESSinkholes collapse when the watertable is lowered in places that are underlain by carbonic rock like limestone. Quarrymen pump water from quarries in order to keep the pits dry for mining. This lowers the local water table and so solution cavities, no longer buoyed up by the watermass or clayfill, suddenly collapse. Alabaster, Alabama, until recently, held the worlds record for the deepest and widest collapse. In 1971 a sleeping farmer was awaken by the sound of a muffled Thud. The next morning he walked to his back forty and was met by a 200 foot deep hole, 400 foot wide, with a beautiful lake at the bottom that sounded out at 125 foot deep. He was a Christian man and he said, "Golly". The hole became to be know by hydrogeologists worldwide as the "Golly Hole". I am a caver and cavers love sinkholes.
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this has been a hot topic in NY as of late. when the WTC was built the edge of Manhattan island a big hole was excavated. to reach bedrock (good old manhattan schist,) they had to go down 70 feet.. at that point, they also reach ground water, and the excavation risked being flooded by the Hudson (North) river.(less than a half mile away.)
so they build a giant retaining wall (called the bath tub) it was anchored to the bed rock, made of waterproof concrete and designed to keep the WTC site free of water.(it is real the opposite of a bathtub, instead of holding water in, it keeps it out--but hey, this is NY, and we are not going to quibble about words here!)
with the collapse of the towers, the south tower collapsed onto the bathtub wall. as the final excavation of the site nears, there have been some near disasters. the damaged bathtub is exposed, as rubble, which has been acting as an earthern dam is removed. the site has come close to being flooded several times.
a complex array of siesmigraphs track movement of the bathtub wall. there are also test going on to check the strenght of the wall-- and each crack is carefully monitored.
meanwhile NY is in the 17 month of a drought. there are water restrictions in place, but twice a day, the streets of lower manhattan are still being washed, as part of a program to control the very fine particles of dust from the WTC.
an excess of water (at WTC) is one problem, the lack of water (in reservois) is an other.
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Dear milum: as a sinkhole fancier, to cross threads, tell us how much sexual fantasy you see in Kubla Khan.
Are the entrances to your spelunking adventures rimmed with curly hair?
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dr. bill, would a like question apply to stales' geological drilling activities?
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How'd I go? --stalesThanks for the insightful geology lesson, as usual, stalesy! I am a caver and cavers love sinkholes.Ain't goin' there...ain't sayin' that. Your Happy Epeolatrist!
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I am a caver...
Has the word spelunker fallen into disuse?
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Has the word spelunker fallen into disuse?
In the several hours I spent caving with Milo and his bunch of caver friends, not once was spelunker or spelunking used. It was always caver and caving. My thoughts on that are that if I had used the term spelunker, I would have immediately been branded an outsider. So, Milo, am I right that cavers don't use the term?
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And spelunker is such an ugly word. Caver comes out of the mouth from the back of the mouth and then opens up in the middle and then with the "v" becomes, only then, a mouth word. Spelunker is clunky--and sounds kind of silly. Caver moves from back to front--air moving from back to front--like a beckoning hand from inside the cave working its way toward your consciousness. Can't you feel that airy hand asking you to enter? Spelunker doesn't do much other than sound like a stupid rare word--it kind of hobbles about on its syllables--clunketyclunketyclunketyclunk. Sounds like one of those little coal cars in a cave clunking along with spiked-out cargo.
Just my take,
WordWooed
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another "guy thread" and they all agree they don't know what they are talking about!
At least when we don't know what we're talking about, we know it and we admit it.
Classic example of the contrary from women's talk is that little rant about if it had been the Three Wise Women they would have asked for directions.
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old hand
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>...if it had been the Three Wise Women they would have asked for directions.
Faldage - you are one brave dude!
stales
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>...if it had been the Three Wise Women they would have asked for directions.
Faldage - you are one brave dude!
Brave... interesting choice of word, stales.
Hev
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Faldage - you are one brave dude!
Faldage admits in his profile, he is a fool.
crossing thread, there is the song about "fools rush in where wise men fear to tread"...
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Dear of Troy,
Thanks for straightening me out on that expression. It had it in my brain, "Fools rush in where angels fear to tread."
Best regards,
WordWiser
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Hey, WW, you're right, too. there are several varients of the phrase, i took the one that fit best..
I was thinking of an Elvis song, Can't Help Falling in Love
Wise men say only fools rush in
But I can't help falling in love with you
Shall I stay
Would it be a sin
If I can't help falling in love with you
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SEX AND THE SPELUNKER: A brief Brief in two parts.-mw "So, Milo, am I right that cavers don't use the term......Spelunker?"Yes. The non-use of that term is the only snobbery that is left in the otherwise egalitarian community of He-men and He-women Cavers. Every time a Caver uses the word Spelunker, he is required to spit. The only reason I didn't spit at my computer screen just then, was because I closed my eyes when I typed...Spe...well, you know what. Ah yes, there is that little yellow bat sticker that we all put on the back bumpers of our cars, but that's not snobbery. That's brotherhood. That keeps us from stealing each others gear. But that is enough discourse on the low-life, chicken-stealing people who are spelunkers (spit), let us move right along and talk about... ...Sex.A few posts back my esteemed colleague Dr. wwh, posed the modest but interesting question "Are the entrances to your spelunking adventures rimmed with curly hair?" Heh, heh, heh. That was the good doctor Bill's amusing way of asking a much more serious question, viz. Is caving a perverted Freudian desire to return the comfort and safety of the womb? In a word , as we shall see, the answer is -yes and no. Caves are, by the very nature of their origin, sexy places. Long vanquished rivers of phreatic water dissolved jointed cracks within the white-grey limestone into the sinuous smooth sensual curves of nature. Of nature, and the human body. For example in Tumbling Rock Cave in Alabama there is a section of the cave where where hundreds of knobby little ten inch phallic stalagmites protrude from the calcite floor. We named this stretch of the cave The Great Totem Gallery.The cave ladies in our group insist on calling this passage the Seen-one-you've-seen-them-all passage. While in the stream passage of Iron Hoop Cave hundreds upon hundreds of perfect life-sized human breasts have been cut out of the smooth milk-white limestone ceiling of passage. The name on the cave map for this passage is The Mammary Passage. This passage is a hands-and-knees stream crawl and after about a hundred feet of bumping your head on these protrusions we he-men cavers begin calling it the Seen-one-you've-seen-them-all passage. Funny thing though, all the sexual imagery has a dampening effect on participatory sex. Like the rapist in Clockwork Orange who a future government had his eyes-wired-open and then forced him to watch hours and hours of pornographic movies, cavers generally lose interest in overt sex. It goes like this... "Now Honey, Sweetie Pie, don't you go expecting me to hang around the house this weekend, I'm getting real, real, horny and I gotta go cave."
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Smilum writes:
Like the rapist in Clockwork Orange who a future government had his eyes-wired-open and then forced him to watch hours and hours of pornographic movies, cavers generally lose interest in overt sex.
...and I've wondered the same thing (sort of) about gynecologists and obstetricians...
Bat regards,
WordWomb
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... can result from putting too many condiments on your sandwiches also. South of the Rio Grande particularly, where they celebrate annually the Sinkhole de Mayo.
TEd
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Thanks stales. I had just come across the Dept. of Hydrogeology in a translation of an environmental impact report I was doing and wasn't sure whether it was the same as hydrology or not.
Bingley
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