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On the NPR news (supposedly high-class) this morning I heard, not for the first time, a reporter making an egregious mess of a word which has a Latin plural. Since there have been a number of questions and discussions of Latin recently, I thought it might be helpful to go over the rules for plurals in Latin, many of which have carried over into English, although we are in process of discarding the Latin plurals in favor of English plurals.
Latin nouns are to be found in 5 "declensions". A declension is a system for modifying, mostly by terminations, nouns to show their grammatical status or function. The declensions are classed by the nominative singular form of the nouns it contains. The 1st declension has the nouns ending in -a for all genders, such as agricola, poeta. Nouns in the 2nd declension end in -us if masculine, -a if feminine, and -um if neuter; e.g., discipulus (short 'u'), puella, bellum. 3rd declension nouns take a variety of endings. 4th declension nouns end in -es (long 'e'), such as quies; 5th declension nouns end in -us (long 'u'), such as latus.
For the record, the plural in the 1st decl. is -ae, so it's one agricola, two agricolae. In the 4th and 5th, the nominative plural is the same as the singular. As it happens, most of the nouns which have come into English are 2nd declension, with a few from the 3rd.
In the 2nd decl., the plural of -us is 'i' (long 'i'); the plural of -a is 'ae', the plural of -um is 'a' (short 'a'). So, to take examples of words brought into English, you have one alumnus (masculine) but two alumni, one alumna (feminine) but two alumnae, one stadium, two stadia, one condominium, two condominia, to be correct, although I doubt there are many people who would use stadia over stadiums. In the 3rd declension, the nom. plural is -es (long 'e'), but it isn't added to the nominative singular; in the 3rd declension, the root form of the word is found in the genitive singular, so you have to know both the nominative and genitive singular forms to know how to form the plural. The singular vir gen. viris takes the plural vires. Homo (hominis) = homines. Doctor (doctoris) = doctores; auctor = auctores.
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Are ll's pronounced the same as in Spanish?
jimthedog
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Are ll's pronounced the same as in Spanish?Good question, jimthedog. i've been searching for a good Latin pronunciation guide, preferably online. Anyone have a link?? The wee bit of latin that i've learned is useless to me, because i'd never dare quote anything in enlightened company. i probably pronounce "mea culpa" wrong, even, though i do often say it.  ..nothing like boldly displaying your lack of a good education, huh?
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The ll in Spanish is representative of a sound that did not appear in Classical Latin. I dunno bout no on line guides, I speck it's highly googlable, but there's a good book that'll teach you stuff you never learned in school about Latin pronunciation. It's call Vox Latina and it asks (and answers) the burning questions, how the bleep do we know and who the bleep gives a hairy rat's bleep?
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Faldage points out: The ll in Spanish is representative of a sound that did not appear in Classical LatinI was taught Latin in Spain, and we invariably pronounced ll as plain /l/ and g as /g/, although in words like angelus Spanish would want it to be /x/. Everything else we simply pronounced ŕ l'espagnole, although there was always a debate as to whether c's in words like circum (I am referring to the first c) should be /k/ or the th sound in "thin" (no Greek symbols here). I don't think we ever got an explanation of why we pronounced it -or should pronounce it- that way.  Marianna
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To BYB -- Very nicely done, indeed, Magister! (As usual) I do not recall ever seeing such a useful, complete and yet succinct summary of the rules for plurals in all 5 declensions. You could have helped a lot when I was in the 9th grade taking 1st year Latin. Where were you when I needed you? Oh, yeah, now I remember. You were in the 6th grade, young fellow. I hope - but very much doubt - if the NPR types are paying attention to your study aid. As for me, I'm copying it and putting it in a (paper!) Latin dictionary. P.S. But, please, Teach, don't check on me too closely in future. I may forget to look at it!!
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I would also highly recommend Vox Latina if you're serious about the details of correct Latin pronunciation.
Historically, since Latin has been continuously spoken for over 2000 years, by significant groups of people in many countries, it's developed a wide range of pronunciations local to that place and time (e.g. modern church Latin is pronounced as if Italian). None of these should be used as a model for the true classical pronunciation.
Extremely quickly: C as in cat, G as in get, S as in sit (all three without exception), V as in wet, AE as in aisle, OE as in boil, H and QU as in English, R rolled, vowels as in Italian/Spanish will do for now. Final M was not a consonant but indicated a long nasal vowel.
The groups CH PH TH (usually from Greek) were the same as C P T. If you see a written J (it's more usually I in modern print of Latin) it's as in yet or Ja.
Double consonants pronounced double.
The group GN was probably as in hangnail.
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Good précis, Nicholas.
Answers to the questions:
how the bleep do we know?
Misspellings in graffiti, rantings from the Grammar police and the like.
who the bleep gives a hairy rat's bleep?
Anyone at all interested in knowing what the poetry (essentially an aural art) sounded like.
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re: Latin Proununciation: V as in wet
giving rise to the old joke about Caesar dividing the Britons into 3 parts; the Weeny, the Weedy and the Weaky. (Veni, Vedi, Veci) We were taught V as in Vow at school by a guy who was old enough to have been around at the time and only later learnt that the "W" sound was "correct", and could make sense of the joke.
On plurals of Latin words in English, the majority UK usage is the English form, though some Latin forms such as stadia, fora, compendia (and of course flora and fauna) can be found, and die hards such as myself use them from preference. There must be several others but I can't think of them right now.
Rod
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Rod mentions plurals of Latin words in English
Then there are the ones we don't even remember are plurals, e.g., data, agenda and opera, not to mention the ever popular media.
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re latin plurals/singulars.
Faldage points out words of which we use the plural more often than the singular. Datum and medium are used in UK as singular forms of data and media (though more rarely now) but I haven't heard agendum.
I don't think I have heard opera as plural of opus, writers tend to use the word opus** as a collective noun and avoid the problem. POD lists opera as a singular noun for a musical work.
Rod
or should we refer to the recent definitive discussion on "octopus" in this board?
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old hand
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I once found a crazy website maintained by people who wanted Latin words in English to be pluralized as was proper in Latin. Their organization had some sort of name, and they derided some rival organization which was in favour of forming all the plurals with English rules instead. It was a little on the surreal side, partly because at first I wasn't sure what I'd stumbled on, and then I couldn't believe that people would devote so much time to such criticizing a tiny aspect of of such a big language! 
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US'ns have essentially forgotten that data is plural. Well, some folk use the plural verb with it but that is sounding increasingly pedantic. Media is becoming increasingly common in computer contexts as a straight singular, e.g. "Insert non-write protected media". Agenda is commonly used to mean a list of items to be covered in a meeting or suchlike and is invariably construed as singular, as in "I have an agenda here for tomorrow's meeting". The most common use for opera is a collection of lyrics and music in the form of some drama or comedy, and is taken as a singular. The fact that it derives from the singular opus has long since been forgotten.
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The use of Latin plurals seems to be universally declining, no matter which declension the noun belongs to. Except, of course, when the plural is the word we use regardless of its number.
Therefore this thread is VERY academic. While I don't necessarily agree with Faldage's "bleeped rats", the way that Latin was pronounced is, in my opinion, still not completely sorted out and probably never will be. I'm sure that Ol' Nick has the formal pronunciation correct. His description of that is exactly what I was taught. My Latin teacher had spent years wandering around Europe retracing some obscure facet of Roman life for his PhD, and had some very interesting comments on Roman daily life. But he thought that the "upper class" pronunciation of Latin as taught was probably correct.
But what fascinates me (based on the discussions of grafitti and what have you that the Latinists have indulged in over the years and which I've followed in a rather desultory fashion) is how Marcus the Fishmonger spoke it. I don't believe that we do completely understand what the vernacular usage was. Dr Bell (my Latin teacher) started me off down this path some thirty-odd years ago, damn him!
The idiot also known as Capfka ...
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I rough sorted a book with the title Vulgar Latin to Portuguese or something like that several weeks ago. Policy of the Friends of the Library is that rough sorters may check out for a period of two weeks books that they have been rough sorting. The comments on Vulgar Latin in the book were very interesting. Apparently the Vulgar was using periphrastic constructions for what were separate forms as early as the Republic. I hope to find the book during the Spring Sale or the Fall Sale and buy it.
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I rough sorted a book with the title Vulgar Latin to Portuguese or something like that several weeks ao.
'Ullo. This is a new one on me. What's "rough sorting"?
The idiot also known as Capfka ...
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The Friends of the Tompkins County Library hold an annual* book sale, the proceeds of which go to the support of the library. We typically get in close to a half a million books that have to be divided among the large categories (Education, Drama, Sociology {three sub-categories}, Science {also three subcategories}, Politics and Government, etc.) This process is called rough sorting and is a real gas. Once the books have been rough sorted, the fine sorters for each category sort them in finer detail.
*Originally just one sale in the Fall, later a Spring paperback sale was instituted; it is now threatening to become as major as the Fall Sale.
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Thanks for the explanation. I wondered if a sale might be the issue. In Dunedin (Zild) there is an annual institution called the "Regent 24 Book Sale". It was originally set up to provide funding for the conversion of a movie theatre which had been a live theatre originally back to its original purpose. That was ?15 years ago. Now, they donate the proceeds to all sorts of charities. Like yours, there are usually between .5 million and 1 million books on sale. There's food and entertainment as well. As the name suggests, it is held over 24 hours, and in that time they can get up to 100,000 people coming in. Some people go along and stay for the entire 24 hours. Not me, though. I dive in, grab what I want (or can) and get out again.
The idiot also known as Capfka ...
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For the Fall Sale people line up the afternoon before but I've never gotten in line before about 4:30AM for an 8 o'clock opening. The Sale runs a week and is reputed to be the premiere sale of its type in the US. Standing on line on opening day is the social event of the season.
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I should be kept away from Book Sales with barbed wire if necessary. I went to the University Of Hawaii Press book sale , held yearly in the University gym, with a firm resolve not to spend more than $100. I bought so much they let me back my car up to the loading dock (no kidding) to get my $$$$-worth of books which were delivered to me on a huge wheeled dolly. I scored several about-to-be-out-of-print books and multiple copies of some wonderful ethnocultural books! That took care of me, several birthdays and a few Christmas gifts. As I said : barbed wire!  wow
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Nicholas W edifies us: Final M was not a consonant but indicated a long nasal vowel.This is quite interesting; the same sound- cum-orthography remains in modern Portuguese. Faldage, I wanna see that Vulgate to Portageese book if you can get your rough hands on it. 
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wow sez she should be kept away from Book Sales with barbed wire if necessary.
Not to worry, Ann. Show up about 5AM opening day. They don't let you walk out with more than 50 books. You can go back in but you have to get back in line to do it.
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Pooh-Bah
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I should be kept away from Book Sales with barbed wire if necessary.
Amen, sister! I have several hundred books in my not-yet-read pile, and I've been trying really, really hard not to buy (too many) more. But, the devil puts temptations before me: my husband just started a new job working for a book publisher and wholesaler. Now we have catalogues filled with books I can get at a discount setting around the house. NOT <book> FAIR!!!
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My Dad was an omnivorous reader and book lover.
Finally Mother said, "One more book in this house and I'm leaving it!"
So he bought another house.
I went with him on the day he took possession and first thing carried in by your truly was a carton of ______. you guessed it! Books.
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So he bought another house.
Now *that is a heart-warming story.
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