Wordsmith.org: the magic of words

Wordsmith Talk

About Us | What's New | Search | Site Map | Contact Us  

Previous Thread
Next Thread
Print Thread
Page 1 of 3 1 2 3
Joined: Aug 2008
Posts: 2
J
stranger
OP Offline
stranger
J
Joined: Aug 2008
Posts: 2
A few years ago, there was a word here was defined as that tendency of a writer or scribe to drop letters from the words they are writing. As in: dropping the 'r' from "celebrate" to now have the word (mispelled) "celebate". Or, as I often do, leaving the first letter off the next word if it repeats the last letter of the previous word. example: "at he" should be "at the".

I would like to be reminded what that word is that labels this condition.

Joined: Feb 2008
Posts: 1,067
old hand
Offline
old hand
Joined: Feb 2008
Posts: 1,067
The omission of a letter in pronunciation is called elision.
The omission of one of a double letter (or word) by a scribe is called haplography (its opposite is dittography). I think haplography might also do service for the simple omission of any letter, but not sure without looking it up which I can't be bothered doing.

Joined: Apr 2000
Posts: 10,542
Carpal Tunnel
Offline
Carpal Tunnel
Joined: Apr 2000
Posts: 10,542
"I can't be bothered. I can't be bothered to ride, the motion is too violent; I can't be bothered to walk, it's strenuous; I can't be bothered to lie down, for either I'd have to stay lying down and that I can't be bothered with, or I'd have to get up again, and I can't be bothered with that either. In short: I just can't be bothered." - Søren Kierkegaard

Joined: Dec 2000
Posts: 13,803
Carpal Tunnel
Offline
Carpal Tunnel
Joined: Dec 2000
Posts: 13,803
"I ain't bovvered." - Lauren Cooper

Joined: Feb 2008
Posts: 1,067
old hand
Offline
old hand
Joined: Feb 2008
Posts: 1,067
"Bother!" said Pooh(k)

Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 956
old hand
Offline
old hand
Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 956
 Originally Posted By: The Pook
"Bother!" said Pooh(k)


Is that a c(l)ue?

Joined: Feb 2008
Posts: 1,067
old hand
Offline
old hand
Joined: Feb 2008
Posts: 1,067
 Originally Posted By: olly
 Originally Posted By: The Pook
"Bother!" said Pooh(k)


Is that a c(l)ue?

...as in pool?

Joined: Dec 2000
Posts: 13,803
Carpal Tunnel
Offline
Carpal Tunnel
Joined: Dec 2000
Posts: 13,803
 Originally Posted By: The Pook

...as in pool?


Or as in poo(l).

 Originally Posted By: Jean Florian
dropping the 'r' from "celebrate" to now have the word (mispelled) "celebate".


For a legitimate example of a dropped R we have the missing R in 'speak'. This was likely a pronunciation driven phenomenon rather than a scribal error. We see the same thing happening today with 'Febuary', 'liberry', and 'infastructure'.

Joined: Feb 2008
Posts: 1,067
old hand
Offline
old hand
Joined: Feb 2008
Posts: 1,067
 Originally Posted By: Faldage
 Originally Posted By: The Pook

...as in pool?


Or as in poo(l).

 Originally Posted By: Jean Florian
dropping the 'r' from "celebrate" to now have the word (mispelled) "celebate".


For a legitimate example of a dropped R we have the missing R in 'speak'. This was likely a pronunciation driven phenomenon rather than a scribal error. We see the same thing happening today with 'Febuary', 'liberry', and 'infastructure'.

It remains in 'spruick'.
Actually to correct what I said earlier, I think from memory that elision only refers to vowels disappearing. I can't remember the word for consonants going.

Joined: Nov 2007
Posts: 390
L
enthusiast
Offline
enthusiast
L
Joined: Nov 2007
Posts: 390
 Originally Posted By: The Pook

Actually to correct what I said earlier, I think from memory that elision only refers to vowels disappearing. I can't remember the word for consonants going.


The OED online does not make that distinction:

1. The action of dropping out or suppressing: a. a letter or syllable in pronunciation; b. a passage in a book or connecting links in discourse. Also, an instance of either of these. Also fig.

Joined: Oct 2000
Posts: 5,400
Carpal Tunnel
Offline
Carpal Tunnel
Joined: Oct 2000
Posts: 5,400
and is it still elision when whole chunks of words fall out?

i think of chitterlings(spoken: chittlins) or the town in the UK (lots of letters)- (spoken:) chumley.

(i recognize the bunch of letters that has is now called Chumley, but i can't remember at all how its spelled)

Joined: Feb 2008
Posts: 1,067
old hand
Offline
old hand
Joined: Feb 2008
Posts: 1,067
 Originally Posted By: latishya
 Originally Posted By: The Pook

Actually to correct what I said earlier, I think from memory that elision only refers to vowels disappearing. I can't remember the word for consonants going.


The OED online does not make that distinction:

1. The action of dropping out or suppressing: a. a letter or syllable in pronunciation; b. a passage in a book or connecting links in discourse. Also, an instance of either of these. Also fig.

Well there ya go, as is so often the case, the only time I'm wrong is when I think I was wrong but I was right all along!

Joined: Feb 2008
Posts: 1,067
old hand
Offline
old hand
Joined: Feb 2008
Posts: 1,067
 Originally Posted By: of troy
and is it still elision when whole chunks of words fall out?

i think of chitterlings(spoken: chittlins) or the town in the UK (lots of letters)- (spoken:) chumley.

(i recognize the bunch of letters that has is now called Chumley, but i can't remember at all how its spelled)

That would be Chalmondely. It's a boy's name also. Yes, pronounced Chumley.

Joined: Feb 2008
Posts: 876
old hand
Offline
old hand
Joined: Feb 2008
Posts: 876
Reminds me of my cousin's name, St. John. We've never, ever called him that; it's "Sinjin". Brits! ;0)

Joined: Oct 2000
Posts: 5,400
Carpal Tunnel
Offline
Carpal Tunnel
Joined: Oct 2000
Posts: 5,400
Re: Singin

Oh yes, lots of words morph like that

waistcoat (Long A/long O-> morphs to weskit (schwa/short i!)
(in US there are 2 words-waistcoat (said as spelled), and weskit, a synonym!)

grindstone (pronounces as spelled in much of the US, but in UK grinstin.. (short i/short i)

same with Hempstead (in much of US Hemp (like the fiber) and stead (like Instead)
In UK hemp it morphs into something i recognize when said.. but (i forget!) how those guys over there say it!

Joined: Oct 2005
Posts: 557
M
addict
Offline
addict
M
Joined: Oct 2005
Posts: 557
 Originally Posted By: The Pook
That would be Chalmondely.

I've also seen Cholmondeley and even Chalmondesleigh.

Joined: Feb 2008
Posts: 1,067
old hand
Offline
old hand
Joined: Feb 2008
Posts: 1,067
 Originally Posted By: of troy
Re: Singin

Oh yes, lots of words morph like that

waistcoat (Long A/long O-> morphs to weskit (schwa/short i!)
(in US there are 2 words-waistcoat (said as spelled), and weskit, a synonym!)

grindstone (pronounces as spelled in much of the US, but in UK grinstin.. (short i/short i)

Not to mention forecastle (focsle); boatswain (bosun); rowlock (rollock); forward (forr'd) and other nautical contractions.

Americans often pronounce forehead as fore head, but most of the rest of the English speaking world probably says "forrid."

Joined: Dec 2000
Posts: 13,803
Carpal Tunnel
Offline
Carpal Tunnel
Joined: Dec 2000
Posts: 13,803
And cupboard is pronounced cubb'rd, but, with the possible exception of fo'csle none of the spellings have changed.

Joined: Feb 2008
Posts: 1,067
old hand
Offline
old hand
Joined: Feb 2008
Posts: 1,067
 Originally Posted By: Faldage
And cupboard is pronounced cubb'rd, but, with the possible exception of fo'csle none of the spellings have changed.

Actually I've seen bosun spelled that way often.

Whilst on different pronunciations, it's interesting that North Americans say Lootenn't for Lieutenant whilst English people say Leftenant. I would say Lyewtenant or L'tenant.

Joined: Oct 2005
Posts: 557
M
addict
Offline
addict
M
Joined: Oct 2005
Posts: 557
 Originally Posted By: The Pook
boatswain (bosun); rowlock (rollock);

I've always wondered why we have bosun but not coxsun (coxun?).
Rowlock is "pronounced" oarlock in the US, but do you mean rollock more like ralick? I'm not sure from your spelling what is meant. In my speech, I can barely distinguish between row lock, rollock, and roll lock.

Joined: Dec 2000
Posts: 13,803
Carpal Tunnel
Offline
Carpal Tunnel
Joined: Dec 2000
Posts: 13,803
 Originally Posted By: The Pook

Whilst on different pronunciations, it's interesting that North Americans say Lootenn't for Lieutenant whilst English people say Leftenant. I would say Lyewtenant or L'tenant.


Don't the English pronounce it one way for Navy lieutenants and the other for Army lieutenants?

Joined: Feb 2008
Posts: 1,067
old hand
Offline
old hand
Joined: Feb 2008
Posts: 1,067
 Originally Posted By: Faldage
 Originally Posted By: The Pook

Whilst on different pronunciations, it's interesting that North Americans say Lootenn't for Lieutenant whilst English people say Leftenant. I would say Lyewtenant or L'tenant.


Don't the English pronounce it one way for Navy lieutenants and the other for Army lieutenants?


From wikipedia:
"British naval tradition preserved an intermediate pronunciation: /lə'tɛnənt/. This is not recognized as current by the OED, however, and by 1954 the Royal Canadian Navy, at least, regarded it as "obsolescent" even while regarding "the army's 'LEF-tenant'" to be "a corruption of the worst sort"."

There is no certainty as to where the labial 'f' or 'v' ending variants on the first syllable came from. OED rejects the idea that it was in Middle English from a French variant on lieu, loef. It seems more likely that it was a spelling pronunciation because 'u' and 'v' used to be interchangeable, but there is no consensus on that either.

Joined: Feb 2008
Posts: 1,067
old hand
Offline
old hand
Joined: Feb 2008
Posts: 1,067
 Originally Posted By: Myridon
 Originally Posted By: The Pook
boatswain (bosun); rowlock (rollock);

I've always wondered why we have bosun but not coxsun (coxun?).
Rowlock is "pronounced" oarlock in the US, but do you mean rollock more like ralick? I'm not sure from your spelling what is meant. In my speech, I can barely distinguish between row lock, rollock, and roll lock.


I would say roll'ck (rɔlək). You would probably pronounce that rahl'ck.

Joined: Jun 2002
Posts: 7,210
Carpal Tunnel
Offline
Carpal Tunnel
Joined: Jun 2002
Posts: 7,210
I always set the other letters down before I try to write another.


formerly known as etaoin...
Page 1 of 3 1 2 3

Moderated by  Jackie 

Link Copied to Clipboard
Forum Statistics
Forums16
Topics13,913
Posts229,372
Members9,182
Most Online3,341
Dec 9th, 2011
Newest Members
Ineffable, ddrinnan, TRIALNERRA, befuddledmind, KILL_YOUR_SUV
9,182 Registered Users
Who's Online Now
1 members (A C Bowden), 729 guests, and 1 robot.
Key: Admin, Global Mod, Mod
Top Posters(30 Days)
Top Posters
wwh 13,858
Faldage 13,803
Jackie 11,613
wofahulicodoc 10,561
tsuwm 10,542
LukeJavan8 9,919
AnnaStrophic 6,511
Wordwind 6,296
of troy 5,400
Disclaimer: Wordsmith.org is not responsible for views expressed on this site. Use of this forum is at your own risk and liability - you agree to hold Wordsmith.org and its associates harmless as a condition of using it.

Home | Today's Word | Yesterday's Word | Subscribe | FAQ | Archives | Search | Feedback
Wordsmith Talk | Wordsmith Chat

© 1994-2024 Wordsmith

Powered by UBB.threads™ PHP Forum Software 7.7.5