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What happened to the L in salmon? #177449
06/16/08 02:19 PM
06/16/08 02:19 PM
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Issigri Offline OP
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Issigri  Offline OP
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After reading the sherbert article on MSN I was wondering if anyone could explain the pronunciation of salmon. I'm from the south and like most Southerners I pronounce the L. Most of the time you can simply go by how a similar word is promounced. Example aunt, ant/aunt?, it's aunt obviously in spite of most southerners saying "ant". Unless you're from Boston you're going to pronounce the L in falcon. So what happened to pronouncing the L in salmon?

Re: What happened to the L in salmon? [Re: Issigri] #177462
06/16/08 03:51 PM
06/16/08 03:51 PM
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Posts: 876
western NY
twosleepy Offline
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twosleepy  Offline
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Hmmm. Maybe there's a room where the silent letters go, next to the room with the letters that should be silent but get pronounced, are having a party. It is so ironic that people who are trying to sound well-educated will carefully pronounce "often" as off-ten when the "t" is actually silent; it rhymes with "soften" (which no one would pronounce soff-ten; at least I've never heard it!) So there you go; no answers, just more questions... :0)

Re: What happened to the L in salmon? [Re: Issigri] #177463
06/16/08 04:04 PM
06/16/08 04:04 PM
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R'lyeh
zmjezhd Offline
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zmjezhd  Offline
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Salmon is one of those words, like perfect, where an etymological spelling has confused folks (no l there either). When it was borrowed into Middle English via Norman it was spelled and pronounced without the l: samoun. Later, people who knew some Latin realized that there should be an l in it (i.e., s;a,o, salmonis), and after that it's a hope, skip, and a jump to pronouncing the l. Likewise, perfect came into English as parfit, but after some etymologizing spellifiers got a hold of that one, we ended up, today, spelling and saying perfect. The sound of an l after a vowel and before another consonant is pronounced with secondary articulation (velarized), the so-called dark l (link).


Ceci n'est pas un seing.
Re: What happened to the L in salmon? [Re: zmjezhd] #177464
06/16/08 04:17 PM
06/16/08 04:17 PM
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western NY
twosleepy Offline
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twosleepy  Offline
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Interesting to note that in "salmonella" the "l" is always pronounced. Go figure...

Re: What happened to the L in salmon? [Re: twosleepy] #177468
06/16/08 04:33 PM
06/16/08 04:33 PM
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Hydra Offline
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Hydra  Offline
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Speaking of such stuff, how many of you pronounce the r in iron?

Re: What happened to the L in salmon? [Re: Hydra] #177470
06/16/08 04:47 PM
06/16/08 04:47 PM
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zmjezhd Offline
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zmjezhd  Offline
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Speaking of such stuff, how many of you pronounce the r in iron?

Depends on what you mean by r. I pronounce iron as /ʔʌɪjɚn/ in casual speech or /ʔaɪjɚn/ in more formal speech. (This chart may help link.)


Ceci n'est pas un seing.
Re: What happened to the L in salmon? [Re: Hydra] #177471
06/16/08 04:47 PM
06/16/08 04:47 PM
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Vermont
Buffalo Shrdlu Offline
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 Originally Posted By: Hydra
Speaking of such stuff, how many of you pronounce the r in iron?


I don't earn my keep like Ron Obvious.


formerly known as etaoin...
Re: What happened to the L in salmon? [Re: Buffalo Shrdlu] #177477
06/16/08 05:00 PM
06/16/08 05:00 PM
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Hydra Offline
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Hydra  Offline
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^ I knew that was coming!

* light applause *

Re: What happened to the L in salmon? [Re: Hydra] #177478
06/16/08 05:04 PM
06/16/08 05:04 PM
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Hydra Offline
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Hydra  Offline
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Where I hail from, iron sounds like ion. Hence, for a long time I misheard Leonard Cohen singing, "O mask of Aaron, I was there for you," and tried like a fool to chase up the obscure reference to this Aaron fellow and his mask.

Re: What happened to the L in salmon? [Re: zmjezhd] #177486
06/16/08 07:44 PM
06/16/08 07:44 PM
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Dallas, TX
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Myridon Offline
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 Originally Posted By: zmjezhd
I pronounce [i]iron as /ʔʌɪjɚn/ in casual speech ... (This chart may help link.)

No, doesn't help... using the chart, I get something like uhahihyan - I think I'd rather go back to the dancing architecture.

'Round these parts, it's pernounced eye urn.

Last edited by Myridon; 06/16/08 07:45 PM.
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