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Joined: Aug 2005
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Carpal Tunnel
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Carpal Tunnel
Joined: Aug 2005
Posts: 3,290 |
Apostrophes are important.
No, they ain't. They're a sugar coating. Nice, but hardly necessary or important.
Wouldnt it be terrible without em?
The use of apostrophes is, in the main, a late 17th or early 18 century phenomenon. Like many usage choices, which some dream cannot be done without, the language managed quite well without. As Mr ThePook jocularly shows, most spelling and usage infelicities have little to do with the intended message getting through. In fact, I've always maintained that if you can correct a sentence, it's not in real need of emendation. That's why we can understand Shakespeare and Chaucer in spite of the chaotic spelling and lack of punctuation.
Ceci n'est pas un seing.
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Joined: Feb 2008
Posts: 1,067
old hand
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old hand
Joined: Feb 2008
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Do you mean non-rhotic spelling? Surely people have been speaking dialects with or without the 'r' sounds in certain words for longer than that?
Certainly, in some circumstances the R has dropped out of pronunciations, but it doesn't really count as non-rhoticism. The missing R in speak is an example. I think it's a matter of an R after a bilabial or labio-dental that disappears. Modern examples are liberry, Febyuary, and infastructure. That doesn't really count as non-rhoticism. And, yes, probably there are dialects all over the world where post-vocalic Rs have disappeared. But this is Modern Standard English we're talking about and it's all getting too complicated to keep up at the moment. I've got my day job to go to and it's getting late. Have a nice day! Mine's over and I'm about to try to get to bed early for a change. The above is just a sideline anyway (what isn't here!) - the main point I'm making is that the original word DIDN'T have a spoken 'r' in the second syllable when it came into the language, so it is extremely unlikely for the 'r' sound to have been added, since, as you point out here, they tend to elide rather than appear (sorry, elide is not the right word, that applies to vowels, doesn't it, but the word for consonants slipping out eludes my old brain right now). So it must be a non-rhotic spelling variant.
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Joined: Feb 2008
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Joined: Feb 2008
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That's why we can understand Shakespeare and Chaucer in spite of the chaotic spelling and lack of punctuation. Well, Shakespeare at least. YOU might understand Chaucer easily. Personally I only understand Chaucer with difficulty, after reading the sentence three times. Not because of the spelling and punctuation, but because his vocabulary, usage, grammar, pronunciation, etc is probably more different from Shakespeare than Shakespeare is from us.
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Joined: Aug 2005
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Carpal Tunnel
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Carpal Tunnel
Joined: Aug 2005
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the original word DIDN'T have a spoken 'r' in the second syllable when it came into the language, so it is extremely unlikely for the 'r' sound to have been added, since, as you point out here
I haven't looked at the citations, but how do we know this? All sorts of things happen to words after they've been borrowed. Middle English parfit became Present-Day English perfect. Somehow, I doubt it has anything to do with rhotic and non-rhotic dialects or orthography.
Ceci n'est pas un seing.
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Joined: Feb 2008
Posts: 1,067
old hand
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old hand
Joined: Feb 2008
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the original word DIDN'T have a spoken 'r' in the second syllable when it came into the language, so it is extremely unlikely for the 'r' sound to have been added, since, as you point out here
I haven't looked at the citations, but how do we know this? All sorts of things happen to words after they've been borrowed. Middle English parfit became Present-Day English perfect. Somehow, I doubt it has anything to do with rhotic and non-rhotic dialects or orthography. True, strange things happen in English. But, since both parfit and perfect have an 'r' in them I don't quite get your point there? But then it is late here and I'm probably missing the obvious. I still think it's far less likely for an 'r' sound (as opposed to merely the letter) between a vowel and a final consonant to be added than to be subtracted. Assuming the original assertion that it's not there in the Arabic word is correct - I never checked that.
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Joined: Mar 2000
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Carpal Tunnel
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OP
Carpal Tunnel
Joined: Mar 2000
Posts: 11,613 |
Er--can y'all 'splain to me what this refers to, please?
Apostrophes are important.
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Joined: Nov 2007
Posts: 390
enthusiast
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enthusiast
Joined: Nov 2007
Posts: 390 |
Er--can y'all 'splain to me what this refers to, please?
Apostrophes are important.
Have a look at the subject line.
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Joined: Aug 2001
Posts: 10,562 Likes: 1
Carpal Tunnel
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Carpal Tunnel
Joined: Aug 2001
Posts: 10,562 Likes: 1 |
I would surmise that Anu has written and posted more than one column (haven't taken/made time to look) and that there's another, subsequent to the one fingered in the index post here, that uses the phrase "Apostrophes are important."
Has anyone found it?
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Joined: Apr 2000
Posts: 10,542
Carpal Tunnel
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Carpal Tunnel
Joined: Apr 2000
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Er--can y'all 'splain to me what this refers to, please?
Apostrophes are important.
Have a look at the subject line. huh?! Anu is on Encarta.. Anu's on Encarta. this is not a possessive, singular or plural.
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Joined: Aug 2001
Posts: 10,562 Likes: 1
Carpal Tunnel
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Carpal Tunnel
Joined: Aug 2001
Posts: 10,562 Likes: 1 |
Aha. Missed it the first time 'round. You're right - it's not a possessive. It's a contraction. And it is indeed important here.
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