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#16978 - 01/30/01 05:53 AM Re: Moot  
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Bingley Offline
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Jakarta
In reply to:

my impressions of Not proven is all the jurors agree-- they want to find you guilty-- but didn't think the case made was strong enough to prove beyond reasonable doubt--so it was still debatable-- Unlike an acquittal, Not guilty-not proven didn't quite clear your name.


My impression is more the opposite, that the jury knew damn well you did it but didn't think you should be punished. Somebody, I forget who, defined it as "Not guilty, but don't do it again."

Bingley



Bingley
#16979 - 01/30/01 10:24 AM Re: glebe  
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paulb Offline
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Hobart, Tasmania, Australia
There's an older inner suburb of Hobart, Tasmania, known as The Glebe -- I don't know its history.


#16980 - 01/30/01 12:27 PM Re: Scots Law  
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maverick Offline
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not proven

... which is pronounced differently to (at least my) normal version of the proof word, being something like PRO-ven, rather than PRU-ven. Or is this a standard form in Scots-influenced areas of our conversation?


#16981 - 01/30/01 02:48 PM Re: Scots Law  
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but in Scot's common law-- you could be found guilty, not guilty or Not proven

May I call the play "The Chalk Garden" to your attention. Saw the play with the wonderful Miss McKenna in lead.
The "not proven" verdict and its result is one of the pivotal points of the play. Wonderful evening. Play was made into movie which may be available at your video rental store. Have also seen it on American Movie Classics (AMC) television.
wow


#16982 - 01/30/01 03:38 PM Re: glossary (of old legal terms)  
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Bobyoungbalt Offline
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glebe
As I understand it, a glebe is the land surrounding a church or its rectory/vicarage which the incumbent rector/vicar is entitled to use for his own purposes. Since this is a part of the establishment set-up of the Church of England, one would not expect find it in the U.S., where the perquisites of a clergyman do not involve real estate, other than church-supplied housing.


#16983 - 01/30/01 04:05 PM Re: glossary (of old legal terms)  
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Solamente, Doug. Offline
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Solamente, Doug.  Offline
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Virginia
We have a couple of glebes here in Virginia that I know of, one in Northern Virginia and one on the Northern Neck. My understanding is that glebes were lands donated by the English government to the Anglican Church for the establishment of new churches during the colonial period. The lands themselves are probably no longer referred to as glebes, but the term lives on geographically, ie: Glebe Road in Arlington and Glebe Point on the Northern Neck.


#16984 - 01/30/01 04:10 PM Re: glossary (of old legal terms)  
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Solamente, Doug. Offline
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Virginia
Bob:
On rereading your post I remembered that there is a secondary agricultural meaning to the word glebe. I wonder if the rector's "own purposes" might have included farming as a way to supplement his income or to establish self sufficiency.


#16985 - 01/30/01 04:15 PM Re: glossary (of old legal terms)  
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of troy Offline
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rego park
Well in the 1680's, when the church was founded, New York was New Amsterdam-- and for the next hundred years or so, it was an English colony, (where the Anglican church would have received tax/state suppport)

I don't know if the land in the glebe remained church property, and was sold off, or if the the glebe became township or common property. But the old borders of the glebe are marked by an avenue that has a 90 degree bend, since it was the path around the glebe.

Its not clearly marked, but Glebe Avenue is make a 90 degree turn– just about where the G of glebe is on the map.
http://maps.infospace.com/_1_4LB1TBB02TBBC12__info/kevmap?op=MoveMap&otmpl=/kevmap/map-out.htm&lat=40.8391&long=-73.8488&lat_p=40.8391&long_p=-73.8488&QA=glebe+ave&QC=bronx&QS=ny&QZ=10463&QO=US&width_o=360&height_o=270&detail_o=0&scale_o=1&matchpass=STREET&width=360&height=270&detail=0&scale=1

The area remained "tory" during the war-- and after the war several families return to England rather than live in the Independant new country.


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