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#158413 04/11/06 04:22 AM
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milo, i think every culture has great thinkers, and thinking is not culturally connected.

some people can think in 3d (and they can look at a image of a 3d thing, and rotate it in their head, and know what it looks like turned to left (or right, or upside down)

some people are quickly able to see patterns (humans excell at seeing patterns!) and are able to replicate them.

as a child, i was able to memorize passages with out understanding the words, or meaning of the passage.

these skills/gifts/what ever you call them, are signs of intelegence.
they are not culturally dependent.

there are folks (and we have mostly likely somewher in our life seen evidence of this) who have trouble making a pattern as simple as a checkerboard (--and their attempts to lay a set of floor tiles in a checkboard pattern are flawed.) others, can see and replicate complex patterns or even create new patterns, with ease.
these abilities can be one way to measure inteligence.

(one of the test i was required to perform in a 4 hour IQ test involved seeing (but then having the image removed) and being asked to recreate the same image (they became increasing complex)--all created with wooden tile of squared, diamonds, triangles and rectangles.

those who can't lay a checkerboard tile floor, would 'fail this test' --and people from other cultures, could 'pass' and they wouldn't need to know anything about our culture, or we about their culture to have this happen.

the word/culture values test (that pass for IQ test) are not true measure of inteligence, but measures of how well adjusted a person to the values the test is measuring.

#158414 04/11/06 05:37 AM
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If you are looking for a listing of IQ tests that are free, here is a site that lists a lot of different types.

Listing of Free IQ Tests.


Rev. Alimae
#158415 04/11/06 11:47 AM
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> tiles in a checkboard pattern

Farbeit from a maverick to chasen® others' spelling but shouldn't that be floored? :]

#158416 04/11/06 12:06 PM
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Thanks, Alimae--good to see you! You doin' okay?

And, mav--I notice you only do any chasen when there's a female involved!

#158417 04/11/06 05:32 PM
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I got a 120 in the first IQ test link.


~Ari I'm not that smart, but I might be right.
#158418 04/11/06 06:35 PM
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135. I did worst on the fact based questions (13 & 15 e.g).

#158419 04/11/06 06:49 PM
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Math is somewhat difficult to me, luckily it wasn't to far up there with math. The names of things or persons I didnt do good on. The rest I messed up were mixed by either a typo in the numbers, and just plain wrong. I understand why I missed some of them and I got mad at myself because I knew I could of did it if I were to take more time into the questions.


~Ari I'm not that smart, but I might be right.
#158420 04/11/06 10:00 PM
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Quote:

milo, i think every culture has great thinkers, and thinking is not culturally connected.

some people can think in 3d (and they can look at a image of a 3d thing, and rotate it in their head, and know what it looks like turned to left (or right, or upside down)

some people are quickly able to see patterns (humans excell at seeing patterns!) and are able to replicate them.

as a child, i was able to memorize passages with out understanding the words, or meaning of the passage.

these skills/gifts/what ever you call them, are signs of intelegence.
they are not culturally dependent.

there are folks (and we have mostly likely somewher in our life seen evidence of this) who have trouble making a pattern as simple as a checkerboard (--and their attempts to lay a set of floor tiles in a checkboard pattern are flawed.) others, can see and replicate complex patterns or even create new patterns, with ease.
these abilities can be one way to measure inteligence.

(one of the test i was required to perform in a 4 hour IQ test involved seeing (but then having the image removed) and being asked to recreate the same image (they became increasing complex)--all created with wooden tile of squared, diamonds, triangles and rectangles.

those who can't lay a checkerboard tile floor, would 'fail this test' --and people from other cultures, could 'pass' and they wouldn't need to know anything about our culture, or we about their culture to have this happen.

the word/culture values test (that pass for IQ test) are not true measure of inteligence, but measures of how well adjusted a person to the values the test is measuring.




the values the test is measuring.




Well now, of troy, measurements of value must be based on a desired quality or condition or function or something.

It follows that some cognitive skills might be of value in some Cultures and detrimental in others.

So are we trans-culturists to arbitrarily choose which to score high?

#158421 04/12/06 12:34 AM
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I have been so busy of late it has been insane almost to the point of being indecorous. But then again, I am a reverend so what can I truly expect?

Anyway, thank you for asking M'Lady.


Rev. Alimae
#158422 04/12/06 02:41 AM
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milo, country boy that you are, perhaps you'll enjoy this:

some years ago, in an article in Natural History (a magazine produced by the Am. Mus of Natural History (here in NY)this story was related.

a curator and a naturalist were walking down Amsterdam ave. (a busy street, with several sidewalk cafes, many high rise buildings, lots of traffic (including city buses)--a typical urban environment)

at one point the naturalist stopped, and said "listen--a cricket" the curator, stopped, but he couldn't hear anything.

the natualist, nodded, and said "no, you wouldn't.." he then put his hand in his pocket, and dropped some change on the sidewalk.

several people stopped, and looked about..

the naturalist bent over an picked up the coins.. (someone helpfully pointed out one coin had rolled, and indicated where it came to rest.)

the naturalist asked the curator, "so what coins did i drop?"
with out hesitation, the curator, said, "well, at least on quarter, a couple of dimes and pennies."
----------------------------------------------------------
Here, in NYC humans have learned there are certain noises to pay attention to, and certain noises that can be ignored.

crickets can be (and are ignored) but money falling on concrete, (a noise about as loud as cricket's mating call) is an important noise. we NYer's can differentciate, (well almost all of us can!), the noise made by a quarter, and the one made by a penny. (and almost every other coin)

the naturalist, visiting NY (on a break from feild study, still had 'country ears' and heard country sounds, sounds that were import to his work in the field.

NYer's hear city noises.

both the curator and the naturalist could hear (and classify) faint noises in their environments.

Its not that one had better hearing, but rather, each had trained their ears to hear different thing.

if i had to hunt for my food (meat) i would eat very little of it. i would (i think) learn to be more aware of noises and tells in the woods if i lived there, and needed to learn to hear them, (to survive, or even just to live well.)

You might find a city like NY a cacaphony at first, but, if you lived here, you too, would soon be able to hear a penny drop (and most definately hear a quarter drop!) even with all the louder background noise.

culture (and location) tunes are ears.. and depending on the culture we live, we will learn to respond to different cues. different noises will have different values.

Is it better to be able to hear a cricket? or the clink of quarter hitting concrete? depends on where you live.
--humans are uniquely able to alter there perceptions and to value different thing in different environments.

being able to hear and catogorize the important noises in the environment we live in, is important to our sucess, (personally and as a species)

while it might not be import to most humans to be able to hear a cricket, to a scientist involved in studying an enviorment, it could be. You might very well hear things in your environment that i would miss. I most likely hear things that you would miss (here in NY).

there are some IQ test that are culturally (environmentally) biased. but being able to hear and distingish the important sound in the enviroment we live in is a measure of intellect.

i might not hear (or distingish) country sounds as well as you do, but i generally don't need to.

well developed IQ test recognize that there are different inteligences, (and different ways to measure them).

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