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Here's a general tip for parents, not word related, but sanity related.
Your child did not get the thing he/she REALLY wanted, despite your best effort?
Tell him/her that perhaps the Three Kings will bring it ... this gives you time to run out and find the item and if lucky even get it on sale!
Remember the 12 Days of Christmas begin Dec 25 and run through January 6th, the day thought to be the day the Three Kings brought their gifts to the Child.
We always made it a special dinner that evening, the table nicely done up and a cake for dessert with the present from the Three Kings to follow.
Hope this cheers some children and helps some distraught parents!
Wow
P.S. Anyone else have similar traditions? Now that you are all back at your places of work (note I didn't say "back to work" implying actual work being accomplished) time to start posting once again
Happy Christmastide
WOW
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Ann:
One of the things I remember from when I was a kid was our fire department's annual 12th night celebration. All the families in the community would bring their dried-out Christmas trees and we'd pile 'em up in the field beside the station house and torch them.
The Ladies Auxiliary (this was back in the days before the men-only hierarchy of the FD would even think of admitting women to membership) would serve hot chocolate, cookies, etc., and the men would clandestinely pass a bottle around. The last year I was there for it we had over a thousand trees. That makes a HELL of a fire.
Now, of course, it's illegal to burn a pile of leaves.
TEd
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...a HELL of a fire.
Quite an inferno. The Chief kept an eye out, Dante?
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Pooh-Bah
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Your child did not get the thing he/she REALLY wanted, despite your best effort?
So how do children learn to cope with life's disappointments, Oh Wise One? I remember that I was more or less disappointed most Christmasses, but I always got something that was nice, that my parents and siblings could actually afford and had bought with love for me, and learned to put up with that.
I believe that it is not actually bad for children not to have absolutely everything they want, exactly when they want it.
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Pooh-Bah
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Post posting (!)
I have just remembered that the most disappointing present I ever received was a haibrushm from one of my aunts, when I was nine. I still use that hairbrush every day of my life to arrange my curls. 52 years of use ain't bad for a disappointing pressie!!
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Christmas traditions? When we were children, and set up the creche, the wise were positioned at the far side of the room, and each day moved closer to the creche, (the good kid of the day got the privilege of moving them) and didn't arrive till little Christmas..
and as Rhu suggest– it is possible to have a christmas with out disappointments?
My parent were so much better at missing the mark than hitting it, I came to expect my Christmas present to be not what I desired.
One year stands out as an exception.. I needed a new winter jacket, and under the tree was a large box.. My mother in particular warned me as I opened the box that she hadn't looked through the rack, and that I could exchange it for something in pale pink or blue.. She went on and on, assuring me I didn't have to like the contents.. I could exchange it...
When finally got it open, I found a jacket that looked as it was made from a bear skin..with a racoon type trim about the hood. (It was a fake fur). I loved it. Once again my mother suggested I could exchange it for some soft pastel nylon jacket– the "style" of the time.. And I said oh no– its perfect...
For the next several years, my mother rued the day she hadn't bothered to look for something, and just picked up the first thing she saw on the rack...
Congratulation to Rhu on having retained your curls... I don't have (never did) curly hair, but my siblings who did, have the problem that their grey hairs come in straight.. Since they all tend to have very tight curls ( lambs wools hair the Irish say) their grey hairs are all the more evident..
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I agree with Rhu. It is not a bad thing for kids not to have absolutely everything that they want. When they do get everything, it makes for spoiled children who expect their food already cooked and chewed for them.
My parents were never rich and could not afford expensive or lavish gifts yet I don't recall ever being disappointed with any Christmas gift. Christmas has always been such a hubbub in our family. Before I picked up the torch, the réveillon was held at my mom and dad’s house. In their small apartment (two bedrooms, a kitchen and a living room) there would be some 25 or 30 people singing away, playing the guitar, mouth organ or accordion, with many a toast raised to friends and family. The festive air always made everything so magical. The gifts were secondary the family reunion was the thing.
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Oh, dear... I don't think I explained it very well. My children had several sparse Christmases and they asked for little and I was the one disappointed when I realized -- despite thier efforts to be excited about what they did get -- that I had missed the mark .... oh, I give up. Sorry I brought it up. The best laid plans, etc.
wow
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My apologies, wow. I misunderstood your first post. It simply reminded my of a woman I know who always makes sure her kids get every last thing they want. Last Christmas, I invited them to my house and when I gave the children some gifts, the elder child (7 year old) pouted through the whole thing. When it came time to leave she started kicking the gift and saying, "this is not what I wanted," over and over again. The mom's response, "we'll go buy you what you want on the way home dear." I didn't invite them this year.
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Pooh-Bah
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My most disappointing present was a dictionary. What on earth would I need one of those for? I'd have much preferred lego or some dolls clothes! Of course I grew to adore the reference book that my uncle bought for Christmas, Pears Cyclopaedia http://www.mantex.co.uk/reviews/pears.htm, the Guinness Book of Records, an even better dictionary and eventually at great expense an ODQ (brilliant for finding the rest of the line we had to write - "find "The quality of mercy is not strained ...", finish the sentence and write it 50 times", one teacher barked .. the phone was busy that night!) I've now become the "aunt" who buys books. The Dorling Kidersley reference books http://www.mobiusconsulting.com/bookstore/dk.htm are so fascinating and although I'm not always thanked so much when they are given, I'm often thanked later in the year, when everyone is rushing around to find a good book to help with the latest school project as I once thanked my uncle!
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Pooh-Bah
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>that I had missed the mark
I know what you mean! All my three year old wanted one for Christmas was a dolly feeding set (Ł10) and some dummies (things that go in a babies mouth) for her "Tiny Tears" doll - could I get them! I eventually got the address and ordered them by post but they didn't arrive. I was reduced to visiting friends, tipping out toyboxes and trying to find the least chewed ones that could be borrowed to be put in her stocking from Father Christmas - I was exhausted (the cost 50p)!
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Pooh-Bah
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>and set up the creche
I just noticed this, I think TEd used the word too.
I've never heard creche used for other than child-care. We call the christmas scene a "crib". I wonder why the difference?
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I've definitely heard both for Christmas scenes, but I'm not sure what the difference might be. Is a creche a bigger and more elaborate scene than a crib?
Bingley
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Creche is never used in NY for childcare--it might be somewhere in US, but not to my knowledge.. It is often used for a nativity scene..(which is what it was all ways called in my childhood) but I don't think it was ever called a crib.
childcare is always referred to as "daycare" as in a daycare center... now days, there are also senior citizen day care centers, for the elderly who, are a bit too feeble to remain on their own all day, but don't quite need round the clock supervised care. their adult children enroll them in a senior day care center, where they get breakfast and a mid day meal. and supervised activities-- from bridge and cribbage, for the mentally alert, but perhaps physically compromised, to exersize programs..
kids get daycare, pre-school, or a nanny-- or sometimes combinations.. it is possible in NY to have a part time nanny-- usually a college student, available for several hours, combined with a day care program for other hours.
the difference between daycare and pre-school is the program, and often whether or not it meets legal guidelines. NY for safety, requires 1 adult for every 2 children under the age of 2, and 1 egress for for every 10 children. so a 60 child program needs 6 seperate exits, and 30 adults. Even a small program-- 20 children, needs 2 exits, and 10 adults. Most people use "illegal" daycare. 6 to 10 children, in someone house, with one or two rooms filled with toys, and a television. the kids get fed and changed, and otherwise fend for them selves. standard are little better for 2 to 5 year's old, (fewer adults needed) but NY regulations call for the same ratio of means of egress.
Seperate means of egrees means "doors to the outside world" not just to a common corridor. I have a front and back door, so i have two means of egress.. Its really hard to arrange 5 or 6 seperate doors to the street. so legal childcare is very expensive.
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Pooh-Bah
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>Creche is never used in NY for childcare
We use the word creche to mean childcare in a leisure centre or a shopping centre. It tends to mean the rather temporary childcare that allows the parents to shop, exercise, swim or see a play (if they are very lucky) and is provided by the people who want you to shop, exercise, swim or see a play! It is probably for two hours maximum on an irregular basis. The word is sometimes used for work-place creches which do have longer hours and are more like nurseries (see below).
Child-minders take children into their homes. I forget the ratios but they are quite complicated and depend on age of the children. There are a lot of registered childminders but it depends on the area.
Nannies provide child-care in the home. Some of my friends share nannies. They can be highly qualified, although it isn't legally required (or terribly well enforced). Au pairs are here to learn the language, usually and work part-time, generally looking after children who are older or who attend nurseries for part of the day. I seem to remember that there was a problem with an English au pair in Boston, so I'll avoid that one.
The Pre-School Parents Association (PPA) supports Play Groups which can be 2-3(ish) hours a day, Mon- Fri. There are professional staff but the fees are low and parents are encouraged as parent helpers and fundraisers.
Some schools have nursery classes, usually only half days from the age of three and are seen as education, rather than childcare. Some children start school as soon as they are four but in Scotland they can be as old as five and a half. Some schools have "After School Clubs" for children with working parents who do not make use of alternative child-care. They provide play opportunities (but not an opportunity to do homework). Some areas now have homework clubs for supported study.
Private nurseries provide care for children while parents are working and can have very long hours, say 8am - 6pm.
They take babies up to school age children and have strict requirements such as small toilets, outdoor play and ratios in keeping with the number of children.
I forgot to include grandparents and sisters and brothers who also provide childcare for many families.
My children are survivors of most of these types of child-care from stay-at-home mum, to full time nanny. They say that they liked the nanny best!!!
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veteran
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In reply to:
creche/Nativity Scene
Agreed the word creche is not only not used, but is not generally considered an English word in the USA. "Nativity Scene", in my experience, is generally used only to refer to a large (maybe life-sized) display, as on a village green, in front of the courthouse, or possibly on one's front lawn (garden, to Brits); the first two are now, in most communities, forbidden on public property as violating the separation of church and state. A small scene (I have a fine one bought 37 years ago in Italy -- it is on my mantel in the living room at Christmastide) is generally called a manger, an example of use of the part for the whole.
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Here we use crčche to name four things:
1) the manger in the nativity scene
2) a baby crib or cradle
3) an orphanage
4) a nursery school (where babies, and children 4 yrs and under, are cared for while parents are at work)
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I wasn't thinking of the things that go into a baby's mouth. You have to make sure they work properly. Creche test dummies.
TEd
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TEd wrote : I wasn't thinking of the things that go into a baby's mouth. You have to make sure they work properly.
Creche test dummies. The joke brought a  when I realized what a dummy is! When JMH first wrote about a "dummy" it took a moment to realize he meant what USA folk call a pacifier! Or what my neighbor's daughter, when she was two, called "my plug." wow
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Creche Test Dummies. Love it. Ted, let's start a band and make a video.
The idiot also known as Capfka ...
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Interestingly enough, I did not have the band in mind when I wrote the previous post.
My wife keeps wanting me to get on that (expletive deleted) Millionaire show and I have to keep telling her that I would fail miserably because I would get pop culture questions that would knock me out too early. Heck, I thought Britney Spears was a brand of asparagus!
TEd
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Heck, I thought Britney Spears was a brand of asparagus!
Asparagus, maybe. Virgin asparagus definitely, by her own, oft-repeated, admission. [sailing-close-to-the-wind emoticon]
She also has a problem with singing on key, but that's another problem entirely and one shared by most of her colleagues in the "music" industry.
The idiot also known as Capfka ...
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Showing our age, are we Monsieur Kiwi? I don`t think any of her fans have noticed her oft off-key melodies. The girls want to emulate her and the boys, well, lets not go there...
Have you tried listening to any of these sugar coated boy bands and teeny bopper girlie bands. I feel cavities blooming after just a few notes. But, like in any generation, the ones with real talent hang on. The rest fade into obscurity.
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BelMarduk intoned Showing our age, are we Monsieur Kiwi? I don`t think any of her fans have noticed her oft off-key melodies. The girls want to emulate her and the boys, well, lets not go there...Let those not guilty of afflicting the globe with Celine Dion cast the first stone.   
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But Maxie dear, I was simply agreeing with CapK on his most observant note concerning Britney Spears. And, hey, take that back. We did not afflict the world. The world came to get her .
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Hey, hey, I wasn't arguing with success, just saying that it is often visited upon the most undeserving vessels (would you understand if I said "barques of frailty"?). . I don't really go Celine either, and I wish that she had taken that year off to have a baby or whatever. The trouble is that the FM station we listen to would keep playing her, Bonnie Tyler, George Michaels, Britney Spears and all the other dodgy "artists" anyway. And, believe me, changing stations won't make a shred of difference ... Velvet Underground, come back - all is forgiven ... [sobbing emoticon].
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In reply to:
And, hey, take that back. We did not afflict the world. The world came to get her
I for one like a few of her songs. I don't like her attempts at "pop-opera diva", and am proud to be the only person I know who has not seen Titanic, but I have heard a couple of numbers from Celine Dion where she is singing more like a cabaret/ smokey nightclub chanteuse, much like Michelle Pfeiffer in The Fabulous Baker Boys, and that style of singing seems to suit Celine much better than those ghastly "big" numbers she's always trying, in my opinion.
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She's sold a lot of records, and, as I said, I really don't want to knock success. Maybe Ted and I can get her to front "Creche Test Dummies" when we make the video. Incidentally AEnigma wants to change "creche" to "credence". Maybe we should inveigle the Fogarty brothers into the band as well.
The idiot also known as Capfka ...
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the only person I know who has not seen TitanicWell, Nemo, I have not seen The...baker boys, and did not know M. Pfeiffer could sing. But--I'll tell you something that was in the paper here, or maybe USA Weekend, shortly after Titanic came out: that girls would go see it together, and then come back, bringing their boyfriends so the guys could "learn how a girl ought to be treated". So, if you have a significant other who is perhaps less than you'd like him to be in some ways, you could scope out this movie--it's really pretty good, though not as good as all the hype said it would be--and see if he could use the hint!
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I waited to see it on TV. Not impresssed. Seemed to me a re-hash of all the older Titanic movies with more special effects. (Affects? or is it affected?)
I liked the old black-and-white Kenneth Moore version, out of England better.
Except for the one scene in the "new" version of the locked gate there was little done with -- to me -- the real horror of the Titanic, the hundreds of third class (steerage) passengers left to drown while the rich first-class passengers were put into lifeboats.
wow
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I liked the movie. The love story may have been what the directors and writers wanted you to see but the most riveting part, for me, was the recreation of the Titanic's ordeal in the most accurate detail possible.
You are right wow, how can you not be touched by the tremendous loss of life and the inequities of a class system that led to more first class passengers being saved. One article I read (I believe it was in National Geographic) reminded me, though, of the fact that you should not judge people without really getting to know them. Rockefeller, one of the richest men in the world, perished on that trip. Not because there was no place on the lifeboats for him, but because his main concern was to “save the kiddies” which he went around gathering and putting into lifeboats.
Oddly, one person that stood out in the movie, for me, was Molly Brown, who tried her best to have the lifeboat she was in go back and save more people. I have tried, unsuccessfully, to find out more about her but I came up dry.
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Oddly, one person that stood out in the movie, for me, was Molly Brown, who tried her best to have the lifeboat she was in go back and save more people. I have tried, unsuccessfully, to find out more about her but I came up dry. She's quite a legend: http://www.mollybrown.com/intro.htmlThe person that played her in Titanic actually looks quite a bit like her too.
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Oh, Jazz., that's wonderful!
BelM, you've got to look! Neat old pictures and everything!
What a neat site! Talk about history coming alive!
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Haven't seen the movie, so that makes at least two of us. I never go to a movie where I know how it ends, especially if it has two saccharine pills for lead actors. Plus, of course Celine although I must admit she alone wouldn't have put me off it.
Best part of the whole hype was the counter-hype. A T-shirt appeared with the movie logo and the slogan It Sank - Get Over It! on the front. Laughed like a drain when I saw that!
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>Barbara Streisand (sp? just doesn't look right) disproves the "talent = singing on key" equation.
>ps (something tells me I'll never hear the end of this one)
Musick:
Be sure and mention John Denver while you are at it.
Ted runs for cover, but Jackie's far to quick. WHACK WHACK WHACK.
TEd
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"The music in me" (that's a line from a J.D. song) causes me to admit that John Denver's voice was not the best I've
ever heard. I fell in love with him because of his
beliefs about the world we live in, and his ability to
write such evocative songs. For ex.: "There's a truck out on the 4-lane, a mile or more away; The whinin' of his wheels just makes it colder." And in all the rest of that
song, you can just see the loving lady at home, and
feel her loneliness, and know exactly the importance of all the little routine things that happen once her loved one finally arrives. S-i-g-h...
So, Ted--you got all that exercise fer nuttin'!
-------------------------------------------------------
I am leaving in the morning for a few days in D.C., assuming the weather permits. I will try to find a way to
get here from there, but if not, I'll miss everybody.
A healthy and happy new year to all.
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Nina Simone, an artist which I really like, is quite known for not singing on key. She does a brilliant rendition of "Here Comes The Sun" by the Beatles, and her "I Want a Little Sugar in my Bowl" is seriously sensual without being crude.
Jackie, have a good time!
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all god's creatures have a place in the choir--
I am not sure who wrote it (is a song) but i love to believe it.
I haven't yet found the right bucket-- I can't/could sing on key-- can't/couldn't carry a note even if came in a bucket!
But i've never let it stop me... I think i sound fine-- its all the people in the world with any sense of pitch (i do sometime feel sorry for those with perfect pitch) who find my singing less than tunefull/tasteful.
Three cheer for jackie-- she'd let me sing in her choir-- (she might deside my voice was best used in the parking lot rather than the choir loft.. but she has a good heart.
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Probably half my problem with popular music is that I am cursed with perfect pitch. It's really my one and only "talent". O me miseram ...
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I am sure your kids did appreciate whatever you gave them.
My own family have never been ones for a big Christmas, but we always enjoy them. I think it even helps us to understand the verse" it is more blessed to give than to receive". This year I bought my younger sister a sisters necklace (its like a best friends necklace) hers says 'lil' sis' mine says 'big sis', the irony of it is she is seven inches taller than I am. It is like a big joke!
As far as Christmas traditions go my family watches the movie Scrooge every year, it is a musical based of course on the book A Christmas Carol. We also read passages of scripture about the Christmas story, and we like to listen to Handle's Messiah.
My mom (and dad) like to give us each a gift that we will really like (and one that will be a surprise), but you should never feel bad about a sparse Christmas some day when your children are grown they may remember things like making or eating Christmas cookies and lisening to carols, just as much or even more than gifts.
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