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Joined: Jan 2002
Posts: 320
enthusiast
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enthusiast
Joined: Jan 2002
Posts: 320 |
Judging from its use in various respectable journals, it seems to be ok these days to use like as a conjunction, although--showing my advanced age--I still can't go along with it.
I'd never say: "They don't write songs like they used to." Better, IMHO, to use as, or the way.
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Joined: Aug 2001
Posts: 10,546 Likes: 1
Carpal Tunnel
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Carpal Tunnel
Joined: Aug 2001
Posts: 10,546 Likes: 1 |
...the hard wiring of grammer came to me intact! ... the onliest word i can think of is ain't-- ...It is not that long that it has been in the dustbin, a scant 200 years or so. (our founding fathers might well have used the word!)
I have enjoyed many a quiet self-righteous conniption over "ain't"... and then all of a sudden today a quote from Robert Louis Stevenson popped into my head:
"A birdie with a yellow bill
Hopped onto my windowsill,
Cocked his shining eye and said,
Ain't you 'shamed, you sleepyhead!"
I am abashed.
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Joined: Dec 2000
Posts: 13,803
Carpal Tunnel
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Carpal Tunnel
Joined: Dec 2000
Posts: 13,803 |
A birdie with a yellow bill
Robert Louis Stevenson???
Jeesh!!! It *was RLS. I thunk it were some Hoosier.
AttualŪ the way I first hearn it were:
A birdie with a yaller bill
Hop upon my windie sill
He squint an shine his eye an said
Ain't you shamed you sleepyhead?
from the lips of Albert Alligator.
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 171
member
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member
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 171 |
Not long ago, I bumped heads with a poster on another site over the use of "It is I" versus "It is me."
I felt secure in my support for the former usage and defended it mightily. I subsequently found some equivocation on the part of several web grammarians who, while acknowledging the grammatical correctness of "It is I," added words to the effect that "It is me" has become acceptable, at least in non-formal writing. I have to admit, I felt a bit let down. At the same time, I would never respond to someone's question, "Who's there?" with other than, "It's me."
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Joined: Oct 2000
Posts: 5,400
Carpal Tunnel
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Carpal Tunnel
Joined: Oct 2000
Posts: 5,400 |
when my kids were young, Me an(d).. vs Cathy and I always got ignored, or worse (from my daughters point of view to)was intentionally mis-heard by us... so we would ask: Meagan? Who is Meagan? Cathy's real first name is Meagan?-- but It's me! was considered OK...(it was a matter of choosing ones battles..)
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Joined: Dec 2000
Posts: 13,803
Carpal Tunnel
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Carpal Tunnel
Joined: Dec 2000
Posts: 13,803 |
acceptable, at least in non-formal writing
I'm having a little trouble imagining a situation where the phrase would come up in formal writing.
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 171
member
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 171 |
I believe "formal" would apply to an essay submitted in fulfillment of a class assignment or a magazine article whose target audience would be sufficiently aware of the rules of grammar to be offended by the misuse of the construction. In a "formal" narrative, I could easily see the writer saying something along the lines of, "...They never suspected it was I who let the dogs out."(Not that I would use those words to make that point).
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Joined: Mar 2000
Posts: 1,981
Pooh-Bah
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Pooh-Bah
Joined: Mar 2000
Posts: 1,981 |
> Another rule I learned that's pretty much consistently broken these days--at least in the world of advertisement-- is the distinction between healthful and healthy.
I remember a discussion about this ages ago. I had never heard the word healthful until I saw it on this board. So you can probably blame us for the confusion.
Similarly regimen for diet - our diet serves both the slimming and the everday use of the word. I only see regimen used on UK medical sites to do with treatment by a particular drug or cocktail of drugs.
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Joined: Dec 2000
Posts: 13,803
Carpal Tunnel
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Carpal Tunnel
Joined: Dec 2000
Posts: 13,803 |
the distinction between healthful and healthy.
A distinction that has been muddy since 1550 according to OED1.
Which brings up the question of "changes" in "rules" that have little or no historical basis.
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Joined: Sep 2001
Posts: 6,296
Carpal Tunnel
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OP
Carpal Tunnel
Joined: Sep 2001
Posts: 6,296 |
This is one of the frustrations of being a writer and a reader and an earnest student of grammar:
You go to all that trouble of learning a picayune rule--and then the masses go charging through it, ignoring it in the way bullheaded but powerful masses do, and you realize you learned the darned rule for nothing.
I learned the stupid distinction between healthful and healthy--and, honest to goodness, the AHD made the distinction between the two at least in the '60s. The first time I heard a commercial in which 'healthy' was misused, I nearly blew my stack. But why? For nothing. Because the masses bloody didn't like the sound of 'healthful'--the masses just plain avoid using the word 'healthful.' They like 'healthy.'
And one day some future tsuwm--some tsuwm with three heads and six arms and instant access to every linguistic element that ever existed, including Neanderthal grunts found still reverberating in some strange channel in the earth's core--that future tsuwm will use 'healthful' as a useless word of the day--a relic.
But, honestly, I cannot make myself say:
"Oh, that's a healthy choice!"
It makes my blood curdle, and, yes, I'm antiquated.
But I do like splitting infinitives because that's an altogether different situation, in my way of thinking.
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