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Pooh-Bah
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Pooh-Bah
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We came across this term at work and don't quite grasp it. The roots would imply "to see below" or something like that, but that doesn't make much sense. Any thoughts?
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Pooh-Bah
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Pooh-Bah
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I may have figured this one out. We also came across vide supra, and it seems to be simply an instruction to look below or above in a text. Why you'd use this instead of "see below" is beyond me though. We found this funny link with lots of Latin phrases: http://www.biopsych.net/latin_phrases_for_all_occasions.htm
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Carpal Tunnel
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Carpal Tunnel
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There's also "vide verso" (see the other side [of the page]). Guess it's just old conventions.
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Pooh-Bah
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Pooh-Bah
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So how would you say this in Latin:
Look up, look down, look all around...your pants are falling down!
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"There's also "vide verso" (see the other side [of the page]). Guess it's just old conventions."
Yep. Librarianship uses that kind of terminology all the time. In a cataloging record, if there's something of note on the back of the title page, its location is referred to as "verso t.p.". If there is no place of publication or publisher listed, we put "s.l." (sine loco) and "s.n." (sine nomine), respectively, in those fields of the database record. Library work is a great opportunity to be high-tech and stodgy at the same time.
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Carpal Tunnel
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Carpal Tunnel
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infra and supra are still used extensively in legal briefs, decisions, etc., where they serve as a sort of footnote to refer the reader elsewhere in the text. "The Jones decision, infra, has been interpreted..."
Years ago I worked for the General Accounting Office as an adjudicator of claims; during much of the time I reviewed the work of others, including several people my age who were in law school at night and were, to put it frankly, somewhat full of themselves. I was constantly removing things like this from their letters to claimants, most of whom had an approximate high school education.
One guy insisted on using viz., which means more or less, "to wit", as well as infra and supra. I finally had to get in his face about it, saying some nasty things about law students and him in particular. That discussion was later referred to as the "infra dig."
TEd
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Pooh-Bah
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Pooh-Bah
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Well, I think it's all infra dig. I do!
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Carpal Tunnel
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Carpal Tunnel
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What's wrong with viz.? It's been a while, but I'm pretty sure I knew what it meant when I was in secondary education. And I wasn't reading legal texts at that age, either.
Bingley
Bingley
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Carpal Tunnel
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re:What's wrong with viz.? It's been a while, but I'm pretty sure I knew what it meant when I was in secondary education. And I wasn't reading legal texts at that age, either.
yeah, but. we are self selected group here..
i got in trouble use N.B. on a document at work.. my manager with his master's degree (albeit a MS) didn't know what it meant, and thought it 'show off'. i learned N.B. in elemenatary school.
(but to be honest, i didn't now vide infra- i might have been able to guess it, or i would have looked it up. most dictionaries have common latin words/phrases in the appendix.)
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Carpal Tunnel
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Carpal Tunnel
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There are people who have trouble with etc.
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Carpal Tunnel
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The value of the use of "supra" in legal documents is the economy which is provides in citing cases which have been cited before in a document. The first time a case is mentioned, an enormously long citation must be given to its location in each of a number of reporters (books in which opinions are published). Thereafter, the case may be cited, in much shorter form, by saying "Jones, supra, at 455" which means "The Jones case, which I cited in full above, this time for the point made on page 455 of the official report."
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Yeahbut isn't "above" just as good (and as short as) supra? Eg. "Jones, above, p455)? I have no problem with Latin, but not when there's an English synonym which is just as concise
jj
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old hand
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old hand
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I think what Father Steve is getting at is that it means more than just "above" (you could say that about anything you'd said earlier, or about airplanes flying overhead) but more like "The source which I cited above, where you will find the full citation, and I ain't writing it out again!" Sort of letting you know exactly that there is very specific information above, not just another reference to the same source, say.
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Pooh-Bah
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Pooh-Bah
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Every profession has its jargon. The use of "supra" in this way is a cross that the legal profession throughout the English-speaking world just has to bear, I suppose.
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Carpal Tunnel
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My favorite of the translations listed : Catapultam habeo. Nisi pecuniam omnem mihi dabis, ad caput tuum saxum immane mittam. I have a catapult. Give me all the money, or I will fling an enormous rock at your head.
Some muggers are eruditer than others!!
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Carpal Tunnel
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Carpal Tunnel
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