|
|
Joined: May 2000
Posts: 679
addict
|
OP
addict
Joined: May 2000
Posts: 679 |
The other day I was looking up a website supplied by a fellow AWADer for words that rhymed with Many.
Amongst the several dozen words that appeared were the words plenty and twenty.
Aaaarrrrgggghhhhh!!!!!!"©
Maybe there are parts of the US where this might be the case but to even suggest that it is common practice to rhyme these words is ludicrous.
Atomica, which is skewed towards the US spelling and pronunciation, emphasises the 't' when pronouncing either twenty or plenty.
What danged fool decided to throw those in with the words without 't's??
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Jan 2001
Posts: 1,156
old hand
|
|
old hand
Joined: Jan 2001
Posts: 1,156 |
I'd previously commented (a couple of months ago?) about the US pronunciation "innernational", "innernet", and "inneresting". Again in your examples it's the -nt- combination that just turns into -nn-. I'm telling you, I even catch myself sometimes saying things like "paining" instead of "painting". Then I get angry for being so easily influenced by the overbearing foreign media presence in our country! ...Then again, our friends across the pond rhyme "horse" and "sauce". So who's to judge? 
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Dec 2000
Posts: 13,803
Carpal Tunnel
|
|
Carpal Tunnel
Joined: Dec 2000
Posts: 13,803 |
you mean you don't pronounce the invisible t in many?
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Aug 2001
Posts: 2,605
Carpal Tunnel
|
|
Carpal Tunnel
Joined: Aug 2001
Posts: 2,605 |
I agree with you Rubrick, one factor conflicts me: think of all the good poetry we'd lose. Then again, our friends across the pond rhyme "horse" and "sauce". So who's to judge? T.S. Eliot, Old Possum's Book of Practical Cats I know a cat who makes a habit
Of eating nothing else but rabbit,
And when he's finished, licks his paws
So's not to waste the onion sauce.(highly recommended for any cat lover!) http://makeashorterlink.com/?H25E24B6Edit: Sorry ASp! The link fits on my screen, but I gather it widens yours, so I've adjusted it.
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Aug 2001
Posts: 2,605
Carpal Tunnel
|
|
Carpal Tunnel
Joined: Aug 2001
Posts: 2,605 |
Amongst the several dozen words that appeared were the words plenty and twenty. Aaaarrrrgggghhhhh!!!!!!"©Gilberts & Sullivan, "Pirates of Penzance" [chanted] For some ridiculous reason, to which, however, I've no desire to be disloyal,
Some person in authority, I don't know who, very likely the Astronomer Royal,
Has decided that, although for such a beastly month as February, twenty-eight days as a rule are plenty,
One year in every four his days shall be reckoned as nine and twenty.
Through some singular coincidence-- I shouldn't be surprised if it were owing to the agency of an ill-natured fairy--
You are the victim of this clumsy arrangement, having been born in leap-year, on the twenty-ninth of February;
And so, by a simple arithmetical process, you'll easily discover,
That though you've lived twenty-one years, yet, if we go by birthdays, you're only five and a little bit over!I am so conflicted! Edit: After posting, I realized that Rubrick is saying not that plenty and twenty do not rhyme with each other, but that they do not rhyme with many. But this was too much fun to delete -- paricularly in the middle of said beastly month. 
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Aug 2000
Posts: 2,204
Pooh-Bah
|
|
Pooh-Bah
Joined: Aug 2000
Posts: 2,204 |
But this was too much fun to delete -- paricularly in the middle of said beastly month.
Quite agree - G&S are always worth quoting, even if they not at all pertinent. And this quote points up what looks like a change in pronunciation between C19 and now. "This beastly month" appears to have been spoken as a four syllable word to rhyme with "fairy", whereas now, in UK at least, February is contracted to three syllables and slurred to "Febr'ry" (indeed, often enough cut down to a 2 syllable "Febry")
Was Gilbert exagerating the word, does anyone know, for lyrical/poetic purposes, or did the Victorians - well, the posh ones - pronounce the word as he uses it?
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Mar 2001
Posts: 4,189
Carpal Tunnel
|
|
Carpal Tunnel
Joined: Mar 2001
Posts: 4,189 |
I agree with Rubick that sanctioning the rhyming of many with plenty and twenty is a gross injustice to the language. However, in instances of "off-rhyme", even the classic poets have be known to stretch it a bit in a pinch.
That being said, I propose, by venturing into sound linguitics, that even in the so-called "silent T" pronunication of those words that it is rather a "soft T" coming off the N. If you do a crisp T you'll see that the tongue clicks off the forward roof of your mouth toward or even on the upper teeth. But coming off the N in a "nt" pronunciation, the tongue instead jumps further back onto the roof of the mouth producing more of a roll than a click. I habitually use the "soft T" pronunciation for twenty and plenty and other "nt" words, but mentally I'm aware of pronouncing the T and still see it, and consider it present in those words. So, no, I would never consider sanctioning that as a valid rhyme.
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Mar 2000
Posts: 6,511
Carpal Tunnel
|
|
Carpal Tunnel
Joined: Mar 2000
Posts: 6,511 |
"The window is wide, I cain't git o'er..."
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: May 2000
Posts: 679
addict
|
|
OP
addict
Joined: May 2000
Posts: 679 |
I agree with Rubick that sanctioning the rhyming of many with plenty and twenty is a gross injustice to the language. However, in instances of "off-rhyme", even the classic poets have be known to stretch it a bit in a pinch.
Oh, I'm not implying at all that it shouldn't be used within a poetic context. Keiva's excellent example of ryhming paws with sauce is one such instance with which writers have cleverly manipulated words over the years. What I am 'moaning' about is that a reference book gives examples of such incorrect usage of words. Pairing twenty with many is akin to giving a false definition in a dictionary. IMHO.
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Oct 2000
Posts: 5,400
Carpal Tunnel
|
|
Carpal Tunnel
Joined: Oct 2000
Posts: 5,400 |
i dunno, (I Don'(t) know) ya wanna (you want to) find some exaples in everday speach?
yes, many times in the day, many and plenty rhhyme. if i make any effort at all, say i don't no.. but i hear, and saydunno, and wanna, and gunna (going to) and cooda, shooda, wooda, Way to often (offen!)
|
|
|
|
Forums16
Topics13,913
Posts229,350
Members9,182
| |
Most Online3,341
Dec 9th, 2011
|
|
|
1 members (A C Bowden),
915
guests, and
0
robots. |
|
Key:
Admin,
Global Mod,
Mod
|
|
|
|
