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Joined: Sep 2000
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newbie
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OP
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Joined: Sep 2000
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I'll bet that this one is "old hat" for you wordy-birdies, but I am nagged by the question of the validity of the word "orientate." I most recently heard it spoken in a public lecture given by a respected Doctor of Anthropology from the National Museum of Natural History. He mentioned how important it was to notice how particular remains were "orientated" at an excavation.
Is this a word? And, if so, how does it differ in meaning from the more common "oriented"? Thanks for your help!
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Joined: Jul 2000
Posts: 1,094
old hand
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old hand
Joined: Jul 2000
Posts: 1,094 |
Oh, yes, this "word" has been discussed in much detail here. I think it would be proper to leave this one to Jackie, though.
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Pooh-Bah
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Pooh-Bah
Joined: Mar 2000
Posts: 1,981 |
From our past discussion it seems that this word is more common in the UK:
To orient: “He . . . stood for a moment, orientating himself exactly in the light of his knowledge” (John le Carré).
My UK dictionary shows disorientated but not disoriented.
The easy way to look up previous discussions is to type the word into "search", selecting all forums, all dates.
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Joined: Mar 2000
Posts: 11,613
Carpal Tunnel
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Carpal Tunnel
Joined: Mar 2000
Posts: 11,613 |
I think of the word orientate as applying specifically
in terms of direction (north, south, east, or west).
(See, sometimes I can show a little restraint.)
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Joined: Sep 2000
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Carpal Tunnel
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Carpal Tunnel
Joined: Sep 2000
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The noun "Orient" means east. The intranstive verb "orient" means to face east. The transitive verb "orient" means to situate something such that it faces east or is alligned to the east. Something so arranged has an east-west "orientation" as a result of the action of the person doing the situating or alligning. From the quite legitimate work "orientation" derives the beast barbarism "orientate." While it cannot be said that "there is no such word," it can be said that persons who use this word (1) are ill-informed, (2) need correction and (3), if resistent to correction, ought be boiled in their own suet. And, of course, they need our prayers.
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Joined: Mar 2000
Posts: 11,613
Carpal Tunnel
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Carpal Tunnel
Joined: Mar 2000
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Joined: Aug 2000
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Carpal Tunnel
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Carpal Tunnel
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While I'm not a huge fan of the word myself, Merriam-Webster says that you have 150 years of history against you. Maybe someone who has access to the OED could proffer excerpts from other writers who should be "boiled in their own suet." 
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Joined: Sep 2000
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Carpal Tunnel
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Carpal Tunnel
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I am unimpressed by the authority of Merriam-Webster in this case, as this dictionary is descriptive rather then prescriptive. To fix the first use of a barbarism at a point 150 years ago simply means that some illiteracies are less vincible than others and that their imitation is persistent. Thus Fowler says of "orient" and "orientate": "The second, a long variant of the first, seems likely to prevail in the common figurative use." (2d ed., 1965, p. 423)
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Joined: Apr 2000
Posts: 10,542
Carpal Tunnel
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Carpal Tunnel
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I have always been of an opinion which tended towards that of Jackie and Father Steve, but I thought it would be instructive to see how M-W and the OED treat these. interestingly, this is one case where they agree in the main.
'orient' predates 'orientate' by about 100 years (ca. 1740 vs 1849). the original sense of the verb orient was to arrange to face to the east (they verbed the noun, which comes from the Latin word for east). from there the word has been generalized. (imagine that!) it seems that 'orientate' may NOT be a back-formation from 'orientation' (as I had also thought) but rather it was formed from the French orient-er in the same manner as some other English verbs [e.g., separate, create, isolate from separer, creer, isoler]. so it is completely parallel to orient in all of its senses and appears to have developed on a separate path!
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