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I'm nor sure why the animosity regarding Faldage's statement about migrant workers?......I understood he was merely pointing out the difference between 'percentage assumption' vs 'prejudice'.
There was an 'answer' on Jeapoardy a couple of weeks ago, that loosely touched on this very theory. The 'answer' was: "The only language that 'how to nail' salon manuals are written in." (forgive my memory and don't hold me to task for the exact wording of the 'answer') None of the contestants got the answer correct, although all three attempted to answer it. I knew immediately that the answer was Vietnamese......not because I am smart, but because of *Percentages":
I have had my nails done in salons in nearly two dozen cities in three states....and 100% of the workers, as well as the owners/managers of the salons, were of Oriental descent. I am certainly not familiar enough with the Oriental peoples, to know the
differences between the various lines....however, my favorite nail technician in my home town, told me some time ago that he is from Viet Nam, as are most of the people in the nail salon business. Therefore, when I see an Oriental person working in a nail salon, I assume they are Vietnamese.....and the 'answer' on Jeopardy would seem to support that.
So, back to what Faldage was saying........when I see an Oriental person, I do not automatically think they are nail technicians. However, when I walk into a nail salon, I am now conditioned to expect to see Oriental people......I would be Very surprised to see a non-Oriental person!
So, technically, I am twice "guilty" of assumptions: first to assume all or most nail technicians are Oriental; second to assume all or most Oriental nail techinicians are Vietnamese. These assumptions are correct by default, however.......which is all I think Faldage was saying. :)
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I'm not sure why the animosity regarding Faldage's statement about migrant workers?......I understood he was merely pointing out the difference between 'percentage assumption' vs 'prejudice'.
No animosity, there, Ruby. I was just reacting in surprise to the leap to analogy that someone might think all Hispanics are migrant workers. To call Hispanics "migrant workers" in a derisive fashion is, of course racist and hostile, as is calling a black person a "cotton picker." But my confusion with Faldage's initial analogy would lead, using your nail salon story, to the assertion that there are people who assume all Asians are nail manicurists. ("Oriental" is considered offensive and no longer acceptable to many people, BTW )To assume someone is a migrant worker just because they're Hispanic is prejudicial...but to assume there are people who assume that all Hispanics are migrant workers is an untenable notion, and not, I now know, what Faldage was intending to say.
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"Oriental" is considered offensive and no longer acceptable to many people, BTW We've been down this road before. In order to truly clear up this contention, juan, you'll have to stop using the term "Hispanic".  None of the Orientals I know mind being called 'Oriental'... it's because they *are what I'm calling them (ie they call themselves that). The *issue occurs when the term is incorrectly placed out of ignorance or assumption... this also *goes for assuming someone is misusing or ignorant of the applicability of the term. I don't like being called a white guy, either, but if you'd call me a "whiter guy", I can relate. Anyone like to tell me why 'Caucasian' or "white" is still supplied on forms and surveys?
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..why 'Caucasian' or "white" is still supplied on forms and surveys?
Demographics?
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why 'Caucasian' or "white" is still supplied on forms and surveys
If a group is culturally assumed to be inferior for whatever reason eventually the term used to refer to that group will be taken as a slur. It will be replaced by some other term by people who don't want to be perceived as considering that group as inferior. Eventually the new term will be considered a slur and another new term will be coined to replace the old. What is needed is to stop considering the group inferior. Since Caucasians or whites are the culture that's doing the considering there is no need to replace the term referring to them.
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We've been down this road before. In order to truly clear up this contention, juan, you'll have to stop using the term "Hispanic". Moose, as you now from previous threads, i don't like the term Hispanic, and I'm only using it here because we're citing the use of it in the article we're discussing. And I only mentioned the Oriental thing to RubyRed as a counterpoint, because I know she wasn't here when we discussed it. Why am I suddenly under attack for "contention" and "animosity" here?...
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I didn't see any animosity (from anyone) and I figured you'd be able to 'read into' the " " I stuck out... not like I haven't done that before...
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In reply to:
Since Caucasians or whites are the culture that's doing the considering there is no need to replace the term referring to them
Hmm... I thought the whole point was that the culture was made up of everyone. Actually this confirms my belief that all this language prescription by others is primarily directed at white people and especially white males. As much as I dislike the idea of someone calling me an egghead, I resent even more so somebody telling me exactly what I should and should not say. My parents raised me to behave and speak a certain way, and I think it is presumptious of others to try to push their weird belief that my children shouldn't ever read a book containing the word yacht, for example. Honestly, is the idea that we should shield children from the notion that there are wealthy people out there that own yachts? There are, you know, so this approach amounts to lying. Men shouldn't be portrayed as problem solvers? Boys as intelligent, logical, or mechanical? Why not? Why not portray both sexes as problem solvers, etc? I can see why you should avoid stereotyping groups into pigeon holes, but I don't see why you should be actively avoiding positive images of certain groups unless you have ulterior motives.
Furthermore, I can specifically recall being interested and intellectually stimulated when textbooks in school featured stuff that was different from my life. I grew up in Kentucky, where we get some ice and snow in winter but not enough to go ice skating regularly. But it was neat to read about Hans brinker and the Silver Skates. It was one more thing to open my mind to the idea that the world was a big place and that people did different things for fun in different parts of the world. Is this is the sort of experience these idiots are trying to avoid? home schooling is starting to look better and better. How else will children ever get to read real literature, learn about the world and basically develop intelligence?
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Since Caucasians or whites are the culture that's doing the considering there is no need to replace the term referring to them
Am in complete agreeement with this sentiment, Faldage. Perhaps, in our efforts to iron out the multiple and varied imperfections of life, we sometimes attempt energetic hyper-correction. These publishers probably typify this effort. No need to fix what 'ain't' broke.
But it was neat to read about Hans brinker and the Silver Skates.
Alex, you validated Faldage's statement with this comment. Most probably, none of us will recall folklore from China, India, Ethiopia, Turkey, Iraq, etc., that was taught to us in school. Maybe, because it wasn't, eh? On the flip, almost every child in a once colonised country knows of Hans Brinker and his efforts with the dyke. It is just yet another irrefutable process of history. I learnt that as Hans Brinker or the silver skates. And always wondered why that book was so titled. Can't remember much of it now though apart from some snippets from the stories about the dyke and the skates. On second thoughts, the child who put his hand in the dyke was nameless, wasn't he? I am thoroughly confused now....
A query on Caucasian..... Is it generally accepted today that whenever the term Caucasian is used, it is only in the restricted sense of applying to the 'white, of European descent' population?
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