#91878
01/14/2003 5:06 AM
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Joined: Jul 2000
Posts: 167
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member
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Posts: 167 |
Has anyone else been irritated by the absence of said punctuation in the new Hugh Grant film title "Two Weeks Notice"? I 've decided to boycott the film for that reason.
jj
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#91879
01/14/2003 12:51 PM
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Joined: Aug 2000
Posts: 2,204
Pooh-Bah
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Pooh-Bah
Joined: Aug 2000
Posts: 2,204 |
I think you'll find that there is no call for an apostrophy in the title, johnjohn. The notice being given is two weeks long - not two week 's long - the notice is not possessed by the weeks (which are plural), but by whoever is giving or receiving the notice. Therefore, you may go and view the film with a clear conscience. 
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#91880
01/14/2003 1:01 PM
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Joined: Sep 2001
Posts: 6,296
Carpal Tunnel
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Carpal Tunnel
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#91881
01/14/2003 1:24 PM
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Joined: Aug 2000
Posts: 2,204
Pooh-Bah
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Pooh-Bah
Joined: Aug 2000
Posts: 2,204 |
- and all they have to do is to put an acute accent on the "e" to make it glitter!
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#91882
01/14/2003 2:49 PM
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Joined: Jan 2001
Posts: 1,156
old hand
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old hand
Joined: Jan 2001
Posts: 1,156 |
I actually thought those sorts of constructions were along the lines of two weeks' notice. As in a notice of two weeks.
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#91883
01/14/2003 3:06 PM
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Joined: Mar 2000
Posts: 6,511
Carpal Tunnel
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Carpal Tunnel
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As a matter of grammar, I'm with johnjohn and Bean on this one. As a matter of movies, thanks for the warning, WW. There are too many must-see movies out there right now to waste time and money on something that's not excellent. In fact, I think I'll start a thread on that.
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#91884
01/14/2003 5:05 PM
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Joined: Jul 2000
Posts: 3,467
Carpal Tunnel
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Actually, the title is a sentence, but no one has bothered to tell us just what the two weeks noticed. (A sort of example of pathetic fallacy. I am sick of the spam I've been getting recently about pathetic phallusy, but I won't enlarge on this at the present.)
But if it is a notice of two weeks duration then it needs an apostrophe.
TEd
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#91885
01/14/2003 5:16 PM
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Joined: Dec 2000
Posts: 13,803
Carpal Tunnel
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Carpal Tunnel
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the notice is not possessed by the weeks
I gotta go along with Rhuby, but I think he didn't go far enough. The s is unnecessary. This is along the lines of the proverbial ten foot pole. The unit is not pluralized and the whole phrase two week is adjectival, modifying notice. The movie should be titled Two Week Notice.
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#91886
01/14/2003 5:23 PM
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Joined: Mar 2000
Posts: 6,511
Carpal Tunnel
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Carpal Tunnel
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You gotta have an apostrophe in the former or a hyphen in the latter.
Two-Week Notice.
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#91887
01/14/2003 5:41 PM
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Joined: Dec 2000
Posts: 13,803
Carpal Tunnel
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Carpal Tunnel
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You gotta have
You maybe do.
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#91888
01/14/2003 6:16 PM
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Joined: Feb 2002
Posts: 833
old hand
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old hand
Joined: Feb 2002
Posts: 833 |
I'm with johnjohn and Bean, too.
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#91889
01/14/2003 9:34 PM
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Joined: Jul 2002
Posts: 742
old hand
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old hand
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Well RhubC, since you're standing alone in a sea of apostrophes, I shall sink with you - I too read it as you did, that no such appendage was needed. Being semi-literate(on a good day) I refrained from saying so, but when someone else voiced my opinion, I decided I could fall on my sword with that one, even while being swept away by the tide of contrary views.
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#91890
01/15/2003 4:52 PM
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Joined: Mar 2000
Posts: 11,613
Carpal Tunnel
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Carpal Tunnel
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johnjohn, how wonderful to see you back here! <grin> I've missed you!
I have no idea of what this movie is about, but I could go with Faldage's Rx, if Anna's hyphen is added: I could approve saying, "It was a two-week notice."
However, movie titles generally don't have any context, and so in this case I think we have to go with the obvious interpretation. Therefore, it should have the apostrophe, because the whole phrase (anybody recall the 'at high tide' addition onto our 'happy as a clam' discussion?) is: two weeks' worth of notice.
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#91891
01/15/2003 5:06 PM
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Joined: Dec 2000
Posts: 13,803
Carpal Tunnel
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Carpal Tunnel
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two weeks' worth of notice
Huh?
What does that mean?
Is it twice as valuable as one week's worth of notice?
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#91892
01/15/2003 5:09 PM
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Joined: Mar 2002
Posts: 1,692
Pooh-Bah
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Pooh-Bah
Joined: Mar 2002
Posts: 1,692 |
It's worth another weeks money!
Ed: or possibly another weeks' money, or another week's money??!! [baffled-e]
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#91893
01/15/2003 5:15 PM
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Joined: Mar 2000
Posts: 11,613
Carpal Tunnel
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Carpal Tunnel
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Is it twice as valuable as one week's worth of notice?
That would depend on one's boss, I suppose. My point was that two weeks' notice is a shortening of two weeks' worth of notice. One week's worth, being singular, takes the single-placement apostrophe. Two, three, or ten weeks would take the plural placement. Perhaps my word 'phrase' was improper; possibly, 'meaning' would have been better:
two weeks' notice means two weeks' worth of notice. Am I starting to be clear, yet?
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#91894
01/15/2003 5:29 PM
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Joined: Dec 2000
Posts: 13,803
Carpal Tunnel
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Carpal Tunnel
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Have you ever heard it as "two weeks' worth of notice"? Or does this qualify as what you'll find in etymologies from time to time when they have merely postulated the existence of a form, "unattested"?
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#91895
01/15/2003 6:43 PM
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Joined: Jan 2001
Posts: 1,156
old hand
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old hand
Joined: Jan 2001
Posts: 1,156 |
I bet (as I said before) the original phrase is "a notice of two weeks" (not "two weeks' worth of notice"). It should be easy to check the labour laws of any province or state, looking for this phrase or maybe not this phrase but it should give a clue. However, I'm on my way home now, so it won't be me doing the looking.
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#91896
01/15/2003 10:22 PM
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Joined: Jul 2000
Posts: 167
member
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member
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Posts: 167 |
I must admit that when I posted I didn't even consider that the phrase should not take an apostrophe. Guess that's the beauty of this place.
From "The Complete Plain Words" (1973)-
<<<Whether one should use an apostrophe in such expressions as 'Ten years imprisonment' is a disputed and not very important point. [ha!] The answer seems to be that if "ten years" is regarded as a descriptive genitive...we must write "years'" ; if as an adjectival phrase there must be no apostrophe but the word must be hyphened [ - eh? you must mean hyphenated matey...] (see HYPHEN). In the singular "a year's imprisonment) "year's" can only be a descriptive genitive.>>>
Fowler (1996) don't say nuffink on it...any others?
And I still definitely won't see the movie...
jj
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#91897
01/19/2003 6:06 AM
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Joined: Jun 2002
Posts: 1,624
Pooh-Bah
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Pooh-Bah
Joined: Jun 2002
Posts: 1,624 |
>>(A sort of example of pathetic fallacy. I am sick of the spam I've been getting recently about pathetic phallusy, but I won't enlarge on this at the present.)
And, thankfully, you haven't gone on about it at length ...
- Pfranz
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#91898
01/19/2003 6:31 PM
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Joined: Mar 2000
Posts: 11,613
Carpal Tunnel
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Carpal Tunnel
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Sausage you are, Pfranz. Wish I were that wise.
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#91899
01/19/2003 9:14 PM
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Joined: Aug 2000
Posts: 2,204
Pooh-Bah
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Pooh-Bah
Joined: Aug 2000
Posts: 2,204 |
Whether one should use an apostrophe in such expressions as 'Ten years imprisonment' is a disputed and not very important point. Well; I'll agree that it isn't the end of the world, whichever form you use - but I still contend that "Two Weeks" is plural not possesive - and I have a lot of sympathy with - but the word must be hyphened [ - eh? you must mean hyphenated matey...] However, "hyphened" is a completely acceptable, if somewhat outdated, form. "Hyphenated" is in line with modern usage, and I am perfectly happy to accept that (even though I would hesitate to use it myself!) I guess it has its origins on the other side of the Atlantic from my abode, and would suggest that, seeing as all-y'all US'ns have discarded various letters from the original language (like the "u" from "flavour", for instance) you are now compenating by adding redundant syllables to words like "hyphened".  
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#91900
01/19/2003 9:31 PM
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Joined: Apr 2000
Posts: 10,542
Carpal Tunnel
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Carpal Tunnel
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>you are now compenating by adding redundant syllables allow me to gloss: compenating - writing without regard to much of anything.
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#91901
01/19/2003 9:51 PM
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Joined: Dec 2000
Posts: 13,803
Carpal Tunnel
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Carpal Tunnel
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discarded various letters from the original language (like the "u" from "flavour", for instance)
Well, lessee:
MnE Flavor from
ME Flavour from
OF Flaor from
VL Flator from
L Flatus
Took out the extraneous u, I'd say.
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