#8297
10/17/2000 10:35 AM
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It is often said that men and women use English in different ways. Without peeking at their real life details and ignoring those whose names are a dead giveaway, how easy or difficult do you find it to guess the sex (or gender if you prefer) of other posters?
Bingley
Bingley
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#8298
10/17/2000 11:12 AM
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I've found it pretty easy. Men tend to be more aggressive,
and to state facts and their opinions without much regard for how others will be affected. Women tend to make it more of a priority not to cause upsets.
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#8299
10/17/2000 12:33 PM
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I tend to agree with Jackie. If you look in the Pow Wow thread you will find the following suggestions by Bridget. Suggestions which might be considered touchy-feely by men.
1. If I say/post something that might be seen as critical, best to use a tone/emoticon/turn of phrase/all three! to demonstrate that this is not an out-and-out attack.
2. If I'm still afraid I may have offended someone, deal with it privately. It is much easier to build bridges and get understanding, even if not agreement, without the pressure of doing it in the public eye.
The Pow Wow thread is a good one to spot male/female differences in communication and personal interaction.
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Pooh-Bah
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Well, sorry if any one does find this offensive, but I don't give a tinker's cuss about the gender of other posters. I would agree that it is often fairly obvious, but if it isn't, what does it matter? It is the quality of the discourse, surely, that is the essence, and either gender can provide that as well as the other.
That is not to say that the inter-genderal reactions (war of the sexes??) do not add a certain je ne sais quoi to the proceedings, which I find instructive and or amusing. Either way, they are a valuable ingredient to this particularly delicious cake.
But most of the time, Scarlett, I just don't give a damn.
We are building the new society on the empty lots of the old
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Inerestingly enough, I do give a damn, but I'll be damned if I can explain exactly why. Perhaps it's just natural curiosity, but I find a strong need to ascertain the gender of the person I'm communicating with. After all, with conversation - whether direct or by telephone - we can usually tell the gender of the speaker by the sound of his/her voice. With written correspondence, unless we know the person, we use cues such as the name to suggest gender, and I must admit to being uncomfortable with the "Dear Sir/Madam" scenario in the case of doubt. Being a bit slow picking up clues to gender from expressions of opinion, I find that I resort, mostly sub-consciously, to making assumptions about gender from people's noms de plume, sometimes incorrectly to my subsequent surprise. Sometimes I'll check people's details, sometimes not.
Which raises an interesting thought that has been in the back of my mind for some time? How much of the "real" person do we see behind the personae on our board? Could someone get away with a completely different character from his/her own? Could someone we know actually be several of our well-known contributors at the same time, even exchanging barbs or witticisms with him-herself?? I suspect it's a rare, perhaps non-existent, phenomenon, and I hope that by raising it I haven't detracted from the whole experience. It may even add some mystery for some....
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old hand
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Which raises an interesting thought that has been in the back of my mind for some time? How much of the "real" person do we see behind the personae on our board? Could someone get away with a completely different character from his/her own? Could someone we know actually be several of our well-known contributors at the same time, even exchanging barbs or witticisms with him-herself?? I suspect it's a rare, perhaps non-existent, phenomenon, and I hope that by raising it I haven't detracted from the whole experience. It may even add some mystery for some....
Are you implying that Tsuwm and Jackie are the same person? My, that's a scary though.
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#8303
10/17/2000 11:46 PM
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Are you implying that Tsuwm and Jackie are the same person? My, that's a scary though.
God Almighty!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
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#8304
10/18/2000 12:22 AM
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Jazzy...I think you have managed to shock a southern lady 
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#8305
10/18/2000 12:38 AM
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shock a southern lady
Damn straight.
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well, imagine *my chagrin.
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What inspired me to raise this point was mild surprise at finding that Fishonabike was not a woman as I'd thought. There was also someone a while back who I'd thought was a man but turned out to be a woman -- I forget who it was now. Other people have expressed confusion about some people's sex where I thought it was pretty obvious.
As far as the quality of the content of posts is concerned, of course it doesn't matter, but in real life conversations it's rare to be mistaken about a person's sex. I can't speak for others, but I do build up a mental picture of regular posters and it can be disconcerting to find out that I'm wrong about something so basic.
Bingley
Bingley
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>>After all, with conversation - whether direct or by telephone - we can
usually tell the gender of the speaker by the sound of his/her voice
When I was reading lots of written examinations (hundreds of students) I was trying to guess the sex from the way in which they write (by hand - the keyboard make us more similar).
There were a lot of not predictable sexes - but 2 extremal behaviours: round, ordered, clean, sometimes with small circles (instead of the dot) over the "i" was always female; in the other part, the most confused, hardly readable was always male (like refusing any rule). I was wondering how much this difference was given or forced by education.
Ciao
Emanuela
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>When I was reading lots of written examinations..<
This reminds me of the times when my late father (who was an arts teacher) brought home the works of his pupils to judge. I always suspected him of looking at the names (i.e. gender) before judging the drawings, and suggested we first guess before looking.
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#8310
10/18/2000 11:58 AM
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> How much of the "real" person do we see behind the personae on our board?
This question interests me too. If I take me as an example I don't think I can entirely getaway from who I am, even in cyberspace. When I first got on the net I thought it would be different, but I was surprised that my interaction followed the same pattern. If I am sometimes very quiet and at other times extremely talkative in reality; it is the same in virtuality (??).
> Could someone get away with a completely different character from his/her own?
I have a friend who comes across as a different person when he writes. Not deliberately so, but the medium of writing triggers a different style of expression. The writing suggests a different person and the physical behaviour the complete opposite. I think this could happen.
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Pooh-Bah
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> Could someone get away with a completely different character from his/her own?I have been wondering about this, too. The con-artist in me would love to get away with it - this is the same part of me that would love to sell the Eiffel Tower for scrap metal to some unsusoecting multi-millionaire. I don't think I could do it - not if I were to keep contributing at the rate that seems to be my norm. I am sure that I would give myself away. But think of the arguments I could have with myself - it's a tempting thought. So beware of any strangers joining from this point on!! 
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I tend side with Marty on the 'wish to know' gender issue. It doesn`t make a huge difference in how I interact with people (it is so much simpler to remain oneself no matter who you talk/write to) but it does make a difference in how I interpret what I see.
Men and women do not communicate in the same manner (similar opinion brought up in previous thread). Men often communicate in more of a bulldozer fashion. If a man throws in a "oh, ya, take that!" type of comment or is aggressive in his opinion I don't take it personally. That`s what guys do.
If a woman responds in this manner I will make a point of finding out if I have upset her since this is not the way women typically communicate.
Perhaps I am generalizing, but isn`t the way we react to things based on past experience. And how many books are there out there that talk about the differences in the way men and women communicate.
I also think knowing the gender/name/hobbies adds a personal touch to an electronic medium. I am talking to people, not names on a board. If you don`t create a person behind the name you are simply writing to a machine.
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Are you implying that Tsuwm and Jackie are the same person? My, that's a scary though.I thought there was something fishy going on there
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I have to admit that I also prefer to know the gender of the person to whom I speak, electronically or personally. I find it quite disconcerting to learn after communicating with someone that I had misjudged their gender. Have you ever spoken face to face with a person and been unable to determine their sex from their physical appearance and voice? Now that's confusing!
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Pooh-Bah
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I thought there was something fishy going on thereWhy, xara, did you think they were re cycling each other?
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actually™, you're getting uncomfortably close to the truth® -- Jackie and I collaborated to create "shona".
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Jackie and I collaborated
Posted another untruth, I see. I doubt that anyone will believe your statement, since it is obvious from the quality of your posts that you would not need or want to
collaborate with someone whom you consider feckless.
Interestingly, the nickname shona brings to mind that old pop song, "My Sherona".
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All right, them are fighting words. Who said you were feckless. You`re as feckled as they come. Why, I`ve never SEEN anyone with more feckleness. You are the epitome of fecklenosity. Mumble mumble mumble....
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okay, let's see if I can defuse this before it gets hot (since ignoring it hasn't worked :). I think it was Jo who suggested several possible romantic pairings, one of which was Jackie and I. my typically prolix response was that I prefer the feckful and taciturn type (read strong and silent); Jackie inferred that I was calling her the opposite, that is, feckless. fyi, feckful is mostly Scottish in usage, in the sense of vigorous or powerful.
anyway, mea maxima culpa.
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Feck---what the heck. THANK YOU, belMarduk! MUCHLY appreciated! Tsuwm, I appreciate your "mea culpa". I notice that you say nothing to the effect that my inference was incorrect. You are certainly entitled to your opinion. I must say that it is one I would prefer not to have found out, but will deal. Perhaps you could just skip my posts. No hard feelings here. An amusing aside: more than once, in attempting to type feckless or --ful, I found I had typed a 'u' in place of the first 'e'! 
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An amusing aside: more than once, in attempting to type
feckless or --ful, I found I had typed a 'u' in place of
the first 'e'!
Apropos of absolutely nothing (as is my wont), the correct pronunciation of the very common Maori word "whaka" is basically indistinguishable from F*cka - some Anglo NZers are reluctant to pronounce it properly for that reason.
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...the correct pronunciation of the very common Maori word "whaka" is basically indistinguishable from F*cka - some Anglo NZers are reluctant to pronounce it properly for that reason.
Yes Max, I can identify with that. I recall my mothers' reaction when I telephoned her during one of my NZ holidays to tell her I was going to Whakapapa.
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Yes Max, I can identify with that. I recall my mothers' reaction when I telephoned her during one of my NZ holidays to tell her I was going to Whakapapa.There was a Maori comedian who had a character called "Abe Whakatawhainau" - if the surname is pronounced properly, and fast, it sounds exaclty like "F*cked If I Know" - although that can't quite match the incestuous nightmare you gave your poor mother! (As an interesting aside, the English word that comes closest to translating "whakapapa" is genealogy) Coincidence?
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Completely off-topic (!):
I have a tape of bird songs that includes the call of the
South American chakalaka (I think--can't check the sp., the tape is on loan to a friend), so called because of the sound it makes. But to my English-attuned ears, this bird's call sounds exactly like "wrap-it-up". Amazing.
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The writing suggests a different person and the physical behaviour the complete opposite. I think this could happen.
Hi Avy,
Yes I think this does happen, and not just when writing. In different contexts, when partaking in different activities, and especially when in different groups, we all adopt slightly different personae. In some cases the personae can appear significantly different from an outside perspective.
But what we have to remember is that all these personae are genuine aspects of one "real" person.
OK, I'm conveniently disregarding deliberate pretence/assumption of personae, but that's because, as belM implies, it's such hard work to maintain this kind of act that I think it's a relatively uncommon occurrence. More to the point, it's socially risky and, in the long term, probably not much fun!
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mild surprise at finding that Fishonabike was not a woman as I'd thought
Bingley,
Given Jackie & belM's summaries of sex differences -
I'm honoured!
Uh, I think.
Shona
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Jackie and I collaborated to create "shona".And what a fine creation! I only wish you'd decided what sex to make me first. 
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shona brings to mind that old pop song, "My Sherona".
Exactly my first association! Thought it would be a bit too obscure to mention, though obviously not to my creatrix..  P.S. Song by The Knack, I believe, c. 1978??
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The KnackKnackered already, shona, and still only a Journeyperson?
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here is something I found in an online college slang handbook... pretty funny! my sherona (adj) Out of style (more for 80s fashion). Check it out! That is so my sherona! [Northern Illinois University, 1998] http://www.csupomona.edu/~jasanders/slang/csrpm.htm
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And who brought you here? Don't I at least deserve 'godmother' or 'auntie' status or something? What am I, chopped liver?
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Is "My Sherona" the tune resurrected in the U.S. by a car company for its annoying commercials "My Toyota"?
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#8333
10/19/2000 10:01 PM
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#8334
10/19/2000 11:41 PM
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Knackered already, shona, and still only a Journeyperson?
Yeah, mate - but check out how quickly I clocked up the miles!
Oo, me flippers...
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#8335
10/19/2000 11:47 PM
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Don't I at least deserve 'godmother' or 'auntie' status or something? What am I, chopped liver? Help mummy, daddy! Scarey lady wants a hug!!
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#8336
10/19/2000 11:50 PM
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tsuwm, not only are you my were-daddy - you're also the research king!
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