#81518
09/23/2002 12:14 PM
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Joined: Sep 2000
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When did navy blue become so? Before the navy started to wear that colour, and it became associated with them, what was it called?
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#81519
09/23/2002 1:16 PM
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Joined: Jan 2001
Posts: 13,858
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My dictionary says:
navy blue
from the color of the Brit. naval uniform very dark, purplish blue
But I have no idea when it was first used in US Navy.
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#81520
09/23/2002 3:13 PM
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Joined: Mar 2000
Posts: 11,613
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Carpal Tunnel
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#81521
09/23/2002 3:25 PM
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Joined: Sep 2001
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Indigo? Jackie
We might ask, " When does indigo stop being blue and turn into purple? When does navy blue stop being navy blue and turn into royal blue?"
And then there's that navy blue that is so dark that it actually looks almost black.
Back to indigo: I have a photograph of indigo paper used around a sugar cone that of troy taught me about. The indigo paper around the sugar cone there doesn't look indigo at all (on the Roy. G. Biv scale)--it looks more like a royal blue.
This subject often becomes subjective. Still, it's interesting to hear people discuss how they see colors.
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#81522
09/24/2002 8:42 PM
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Joined: Oct 2000
Posts: 1,346
veteran
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veteran
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When did navy blue become so?Hey, choupette! Great to see ya.  My theory is that the exact (British) Navy shade of blue didn't exist before it was introduced in the Navy. Or at the very least it effectively didn't exist, as it wasn't separated out from other shades of blue. I always think of navy blue as a very dark blue that's near-black except in good light. Indigo definitely isn't right, and I don't think purple is either - it's just a very very dark blue, simple as that.
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#81523
10/02/2002 1:55 AM
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Joined: Nov 2000
Posts: 1,289
veteran
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Some of the confusion comes from the fact that most people don't know the difference between purple and violet.
For example, certain church vestments and decorations used in certain seasons are often called purple; actually, they are always violet.
Both violet and purple are a mixture of blue and red. Violet is more blue than red; purple is more red than blue and has the "plummy" look, whereas violet is more or less darker version of lavender and may be very dark indeed -- almost navy.
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#81524
10/02/2002 8:02 AM
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Joined: Jul 2000
Posts: 167
member
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<<Both violet and purple are a mixture of blue and red. Violet is more blue than red; purple is more red than blue and has the "plummy" look, whereas violet is more or less darker version of lavender and may be very dark indeed -- almost navy.>>
Is there a source for this, or does someone like Pantone give any guidance on it? A lot of people I know would simply use purple and violet interchangeably and indeed don't know the difference between the two. Where does mauve fit in the picture?
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#81525
10/02/2002 12:10 PM
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Joined: Oct 2000
Posts: 5,400
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jj- mauve is a like lavender, a light a purple (an even mixture of red and blue, that looks niether red nor blue) that has been made lighter with white, and then the color "muddied" with either black or a very dark brown..
if you go to one of the color selectors (computer windows for color schemes and the press the morebutton you can see this)
Colors can go across the spectrum, (roy g biv) and then each color can go lighter, or darker, (tint or shade)
but 'dusty colors' like dusty rose or mauve, first go light, and then go 'dusty'.
meanwhile, i have been wondering about ultra marine blue and wondering if this is not the sourse of navy... ultramarine (i think it is a coal tar derivative that was supposed to equal the dye that was first found by the phonisians, one that is extrated from a marine worm, and yeilded a rich purple dye.)
it has strange properites, because if it is not fixed with a strong mordant, it acts as a bleach --the bluing woman used to put into laundry to make cloths whiter.
(now days, most detergents have ultra violet dyes added, that while largely invisible to human eyes, make cloths, so treated, look brighter -- they reflect more light, ultra violet and other parts of the spectrum.)
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#81526
10/02/2002 4:15 PM
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Joined: Aug 2001
Posts: 11,168 Likes: 2
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Both violet and purple are a mixture of blue and red. Violet is more blue than red; purple is more red than blue and has the "plummy" look, whereas violet is more or less darker version of lavender and may be very dark indeed -- almost navy.
We generally sidestepped the issue completely, and simply called them "red-purple" and "blue-purple"
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#81527
10/03/2002 9:26 AM
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Joined: Jul 2000
Posts: 167
member
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Helen - yeahbut - I can SEE the colo(u)rs, but all I'm saying is that one man's plum is another man's purple is another person's mauve - the actual naming of colo(u)rs is a highly subjective assessment, unless there is some Pantone type standardisation which I don't know too much about..
jj
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#81528
10/03/2002 9:58 AM
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Joined: Dec 2000
Posts: 13,803
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some Pantone type standardisation
There is. I saw Pantone purple and Pantone violet yesterday afternoon. The purple looked about half and half red and blue. The violet was a dark, slightly reddish blue. Or was it the other way around?
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#81529
10/03/2002 9:58 AM
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Joined: Mar 2000
Posts: 1,981
Pooh-Bah
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Pooh-Bah
Joined: Mar 2000
Posts: 1,981 |
>Pantone type colour sheet Like this one? http://www.yaelf.com/colour.shtmlSome of the colours, such as the green-blues, look a bit strange to me but interesting, nevertheless.
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#81530
10/03/2002 12:54 PM
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Joined: Oct 2000
Posts: 5,400
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RE:Pantone type standardisation which I don't know too much about..
the trouble with standards is, they change with mediums.. some colors are don't reproduce well on computers (and even diffent browsers present colors differently!) and inks for paper aren't the same as dyes for cloth.
there is a color board, (fashion industry representatives )that meet every year or so and deside on upcoming colors for fashions.. they are experts in color chemisty, and plan that this year, pink will be hot (well really the deside color X will be hot in two years, giving time for manufactures to create cloth, and get it to garment companies and furnature manufactures..
most names are some what arbritary... but mauve is a dusty lavender.. or maybe its sort of a smoky amyathist.. or what ever.
some companies decree that a certain pantone shade is their color... and expect that color in all ads and printed material..
you have to remember, most colors, change depending on how they are illumiated... colors look different in white (sun) light, incandesant, and floresent light... not to mention really off lights like sodium vapor lamps use sometimes as street lights.
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#81531
10/03/2002 1:07 PM
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Joined: Feb 2002
Posts: 322
enthusiast
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enthusiast
Joined: Feb 2002
Posts: 322 |
I took a quick scroll down the colours -- what does madder mean when added to a colour name??
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#81532
10/03/2002 1:24 PM
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Joined: Oct 2000
Posts: 5,400
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madder is a plant dye, that yields a deep red (a red with an undertone of blue)-- cherry red is one sort, where as tomato red is red with an undertone of yellow (tomato red is closer to orange, cherry red is closer to purple.. but both are still more red than orange or purple)
brown can be a greyish brown, or redish brown, or yellowish brown, as can grey.. you can have a simple straight grey (black and white in some ratio) or a grey that has a little bit of a blueish tint (a steel grey)
even white can have undertones.. icy white has a bit of blue in it.. creamy white, yellow, warm white, red..
most people think an icy white is 'whiter' than a plain white!
one of the tricks our eyes play on use..
a classic trick of color/reflectivity is that a newly paved street, (blacktop) will reflect more light in full sun than 'dirty snow'. yet we all know that "black absorbs light" and "white reflects light" ... which is why photographers always use light meters to measure, and don't trust their eyes!
our moon is about as black as paved street.. but the sun is a very bright light sourse, and space is really dark... and the result is we see the moon as silvery!
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