#78550
08/19/2002 11:15 PM
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Joined: Jul 2002
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Trying to complete a needlessly complicated transaction at ebay recently, I was inclined to use kerfuffle in an email to the vendor. I thought better of donig so, thinking it possible that the word is not well known in the US. Was this a correct assumption? If so, what do USns use in place of this wonderfully expressive term?
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#78551
08/19/2002 11:50 PM
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Joined: Dec 2000
Posts: 1,055
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> thinking it possible that the word is not well known in the US. Was this a correct assumption? I'm not American, but I will jump in and mention that neither 'kerfuffle' nor 'carfuffle' are included in the American Heritage Dict. (www.dictionary.com) - which was a big surprise to me. This seems to indicate that your reservation about using it was not wrong - it is after all a pretty old fashioned word, I think. M-Webster's includes it and suggests it has a Scottish etymology, btw. I also stumbled on a link where people had been writing in to complain about the use of 'kerfuffle' in a newspaper column. The writer pokes fun at the letters:
Gerry Nelson, retired Associated Press reporter, said: "The use of unfamiliar words and gratuitous foreign phrases in the Star Tribune has been a pet peeve for years. The purpose of the newspaper is to transfer information, easily and understandably, from inside the head of the writer to the head of the reader."
"Any impediments to that ('kerfuffle') are stupid and boastful. They exist for only one purpose ('raison d'être'): to flaunt the writer's supposed erudition. Why don't they simply post signs in the newsroom proclaiming, 'I have a master's degree'?
http://www.startribune.com/stories/1519/2921494.html
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#78552
08/20/2002 12:15 AM
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Joined: Jan 2001
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Dear sjm: I have no doubt that the word "kerfuffle" would be understood, but unless you
are not longer hopeful of vendor being reasonable, I would not use a word that could
suggest you are seriously annoyed with him. You might cause him to be even less
helpful.
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#78553
08/20/2002 12:53 AM
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While certainly not in common use, or familiar to most USns, kerfuffle may have survived in some of the mountain dialects of Appalachia and the Ozarks, and perhaps it even crept into Southren speech for awhile (Wordwind? Jackie? AnnaS? Chemeng? Milum?) Because I vaguely remember hearing it used in just such a way in a book or film (at least, I don't think it was first-hand) "Why y'all raisin' such a kerfuffle about it?" Much in the same way as "raise a fuss."
Actually, I seem to remember actor Denver Pyle using it (no, not on The Dukes of Hazard...back when I was a kid).
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#78554
08/20/2002 2:08 AM
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Date: Fri, 12 Apr 1996 11:31:17 CDT
the worthless word for the day is: kerfuffle
kerfuffle - [Brit] a disturbance
(on that day I had precisely 11 subscribers, so I didn't increase usage of the word very much!)
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#78555
08/20/2002 2:24 AM
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(on that day I had precisely 11 subscribers, so I didn't increase usage of the word very much!)Well, I love this one, tsuwm! So I'm puttin' kerfuffle right up near the top of my "bring it back to life" list, right alongside absquatulate and some others, so let's spread the wealth!  'Course, I'll have to make sure to check in with my collaborator, Rhuby, on this. 
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#78556
08/20/2002 5:38 AM
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Joined: Mar 2000
Posts: 1,027
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Although this word is new to me, its sound evokes its meaning beautifully, much better than "fuss". I picture e.g. my life partner desperately searching for her lighter after having abstained from smoking for 2 hours .
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#78557
08/20/2002 8:25 AM
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Joined: Aug 2000
Posts: 2,204
Pooh-Bah
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Pooh-Bah
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'Course, I'll have to make sure to check in with my collaborator, Rhuby, on this.
There is no problem about this one. Whilst it isn't exactly an everyday word for me, (possibly because of my mellow life-style ) it is certainly one which I use from time to time: mostly in relation to my three cats, who do tend to go about their business with a great deal of kerfuffle during the short time that they are awake each day. We don't seem to have seen much absquatulation around here recently, so the word is resting lightly on the shelf. However, it is close to hand for when the moment arises. 
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#78558
08/20/2002 9:16 AM
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Joined: Nov 2000
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Looks like someone's chance to absquatulate without any kerfuffle. In fact, if you decamp with a kerfuffle, then you are most definitely not absquatulating! BTW, is an habitual and well-practised absquatulator an absquatulatitioner? 
The idiot also known as Capfka ...
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#78559
08/20/2002 9:22 AM
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Joined: Aug 2000
Posts: 2,204
Pooh-Bah
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Pooh-Bah
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Are you trying to convince us that you do not have the experiential knowledge to give us a definitive answer? 
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#78560
08/20/2002 10:14 AM
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Joined: Dec 2000
Posts: 13,803
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I certainly would not have known the word kerfuffle out of any context. Had I been subscribing to wwftd way back in them days, I doubt I would remember it. Howmsoeverthemoreorless, in context I would suspect that I would be able to divine the meaning. But no way of knowing that, now.
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#78561
08/20/2002 10:47 AM
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BTW, is an habitual and well-practised absquatulator an absquatulatitioner? Looking in the mirror, were you?
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#78562
08/20/2002 12:24 PM
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Joined: Jan 2001
Posts: 13,858
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I have seen numberous reports of people who make purchases on e-bay getting kerfuffled.
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#78563
08/20/2002 1:15 PM
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Looks like someone's chance to absquatulate without any kerfuffle. In fact, if you decamp with a kerfuffle, then you are most definitely not absquatulating!
BTW, is an habitual and well-practised absquatulator an absquatulatitioner? Nay, my good sir! To imply a mere opportunistic usurpation of kerfuffling in order to roll our beloved absquatulate out into the light, yet again, is an injustice to the dedication of our calling...for it is our duty! Rhuby, we have liberated abquatulate (and some, uh, new derivatives) for 8 more viewings in this thread alone!...good work compadre! And, now, that you have, indeed, raised a kerfuffle about this, CapK, you see that you can have your absquatulate and kerfuffle it, too! And, adding the additions of this post, we have now unveiled our sacred word, so far, for a record 15 times on one thread! So put that in your kerfuffle pipe and smoke it! Rhuby, keep up the good work!
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#78564
08/20/2002 1:31 PM
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Joined: Aug 2000
Posts: 2,204
Pooh-Bah
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Pooh-Bah
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Hmmm - - - I read we have now unveiled our sacred word as "... our SCARED word ..."
Enough to make anyone absquatulate, with or without kerfuffle.
In rather more serious tone, and in light of CapK's very serious enquiry, I guess he's right about the impossibility of a conjunction of kerfuffling and absquatulating. The kerfuffle, I assume, is more likely to be a result OF the actions of the absquatulationer than by him/her?
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#78565
08/20/2002 1:47 PM
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Joined: Aug 2001
Posts: 131
member
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I've heard the word on just a few occasions here in the south. While some are familiar with it my experience is that people frown, squinch an eyebrow and look at you like you've made up a word.
As far as ebay goes, I love it and have never had any issues that have caused a kerfuffle.
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#78566
08/20/2002 2:16 PM
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Joined: Dec 2000
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As far as ebay goes, I love it and have never had any issues that have caused a kerfuffle.
You didn't bid on Elian Gonzalez's inner tube or the million-of-its-kind used post-it note, did you?
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#78567
08/20/2002 2:23 PM
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Joined: Feb 2002
Posts: 322
enthusiast
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enthusiast
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Hmmm - I had no idea that Americans didn't use kerfuffle, since it is so familiar to me and mine. Another example, I guess, of the US/(Canada+UK) divide.
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#78568
08/20/2002 2:25 PM
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Joined: Jul 2000
Posts: 3,467
Carpal Tunnel
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No, but I did get a DVD of the movie:
Elian: On a Raft No One Can Hear You Scream
TEd
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#78569
08/20/2002 2:44 PM
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Joined: Mar 2001
Posts: 4,189
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Hmmm - - - I read we have now unveiled our sacred word as "... our SCARED word ..."
Enough to make anyone absquatulate, with or without kerfuffle.Scared of sacred, huh? Good, Rhuby! (19 and counting...) How 'bout...absquatufuffelate? Should be good for something!  absquatukerfuffelate?
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#78570
08/20/2002 2:53 PM
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Joined: Aug 2000
Posts: 2,204
Pooh-Bah
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Pooh-Bah
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absquatufuffelate?
Probably almost unusable as it stands - but I could (just about) envisage "absquatufuffelation," being, of course, the kerfuffle that follows an absquatulation.
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#78571
08/20/2002 3:09 PM
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Joined: Dec 2000
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almost unusable as it stands
Is absquatulation necessarily clandestine? If not I could well imagine someone making a great disturbance while absquatulating.
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#78572
08/20/2002 3:14 PM
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Joined: Aug 2000
Posts: 2,204
Pooh-Bah
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Pooh-Bah
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Is absquatulation necessarily clandestine?
From its etymology, I think it must be so - if you remember, the "squattle" bit of absquatulation is a reference to the manner in which Native Americans decamped overnight without anyone being aware of it.
For that matter, absconding has a clandestine air to it.
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#78573
08/20/2002 4:01 PM
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Joined: Mar 2001
Posts: 4,189
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Is absquatulation necessarily clandestine? If not I could well imagine someone making a great disturbance while absquatulating.Yes, a sudden silence can be very disturbing, can't it? (32...33...good show!) [if you count the fuffle forms] And, of course, The Great Sasquatchulation would be the disappearance of Bigfoot.
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#78575
08/20/2002 6:23 PM
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Joined: Mar 2001
Posts: 4,189
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>from the Quinion link: Up to the 1960s, it was written in all sorts of ways - curfuffle, carfuffle, cafuffle, cafoufle, even gefuffle (a clear indication that its main means of transmission was in speech, being too rarely written down to have established a standard spelling). But in that decade it suddenly became much more popular and settled on the current kerfuffle.
Intriguing to think there may still be words around that are spoken, but rarely written.
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#78576
08/20/2002 7:31 PM
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Joined: Jul 2002
Posts: 742
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> have seen numberous reports of people who make purchases on e-bay getting kerfuffled.
Fortunately, no vendor has ever absquatalated with my lucre from an ebay transaction - all of mine have gone without a hitch. The kerfuffle that prompted this thread had to do with a third-party service provider, not the vendor or ebay itself.
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#78577
08/21/2002 6:54 AM
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Joined: Nov 2000
Posts: 3,146
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I certainly would not have known the word kerfuffle out of any context. Had I been subscribing to wwftd way back in them days, I doubt I would remember it. Howmsoeverthemoreorless, in context I would suspect that I would be able to divine the meaning. But no way of knowing that, now.
Quite appropriate behaviour for the Archdruid of Canterbury, Faldo. Do you do tealeaves as well?
The idiot also known as Capfka ...
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#78578
08/21/2002 7:00 AM
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Intriguing to think there may still be words around that are spoken, but rarely written
Jeez, Juan, you wanna live where I live! You hear words every day for which the provenance is unclear, the meaning muddied and the pronunciation mangled. I'd hate to try to write any of them down!
The idiot also known as Capfka ...
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#78579
08/21/2002 7:53 AM
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Joined: Mar 2000
Posts: 1,027
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You are not alone with this impression, Dear Capital Kiwi. Sometimes I wonder even how to "parse" the sounds I hear (among the youngsters in the bus, for example) into what might be called "words".
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#78580
08/21/2002 10:04 AM
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Joined: Dec 2000
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I wonder even how to "parse" the sounds I hear (among the youngsters in the bus, for example) into what might be called "words".
All this auf deutsch?
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#78581
08/21/2002 12:27 PM
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Joined: Mar 2000
Posts: 1,027
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All this auf deutsch?
Yes, I got this impression even in that language which I had absorbed as a baby (Swiss-german). I explain this by the fact that oral communication is just as much a matter of transmitting intention by means of tone (emphasis, loudness, melody..) as of transmitting information by means of words.
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#78582
08/21/2002 12:29 PM
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Joined: Oct 2000
Posts: 5,400
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Body language too! as a near sighted person, i am very aware that my 'hearing' is improved by wearing eyeglasses!
i need to see peoples faces, and other visual clues to easily understand them.
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#78583
08/21/2002 12:52 PM
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Joined: Aug 2000
Posts: 2,204
Pooh-Bah
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Pooh-Bah
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that oral communication is just as much a matter of transmitting intention by means of tone (emphasis, loudness, melody..) as of transmitting information by means of words. wsieber
Which I am convinced is the method used by cats and dogs "who understand every word I say to them" (as claimed by over-proud owners.)
i need to see peoples faces, and other visual clues to easily understand them.of troy
I guess that nearly everyone - even those with good hearing - uses a certain amount of lip-reading. Those of us whose hearing is "a little dull" (or more!) use it more than others.
But I agree with you, body language is also a big help.
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#78584
08/21/2002 2:26 PM
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Joined: Nov 2000
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Kerfluffle is not a word heard much anymore here in New England but there would be no mistake made as to it's meaning.
Around here it would be presumed to mean a mild, soon-blown-over disturbance.
Hearing:
As one with just 50 percent hearing (totally deaf in left ear) body language and expression are a big help. Thinking about this : I realize when I converse with people I invariably look at their lips with occasional glances eye-to-eye. I always mention my hearing loss so I hope people do not think I am being rude when I do not look them "right in the eye" all the time!
Guess I do more lip reading than I realized!
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#78585
08/21/2002 7:34 PM
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Joined: Jun 2001
Posts: 2,636
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Whenever I am trying to teach someone a word or phrase in Spanish, I always tell them to watch my mouth. Nine times out of ten, they pronounce the word correctly the first time if they do.
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#78586
08/23/2002 4:24 PM
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Joined: Jun 2002
Posts: 161
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the last skill that I acquired while living in UK was to understand people on the phone where you do not have any help from lips, intonation, face expression and gestures. I am past this barrier but some foreigners prefer to waste an hour and come in person somewhere then to talk with this place over the phone.
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#78587
08/24/2002 8:32 AM
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Joined: Mar 2000
Posts: 315
enthusiast
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enthusiast
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I guess that nearly everyone - even those with good hearing - uses a certain amount of
lip-reading.
.
I hear well, but indeed, sometimes I say: wait,to listen to you I need to wear my glasses...
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#78588
08/25/2002 3:35 PM
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Joined: Aug 2000
Posts: 2,204
Pooh-Bah
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Pooh-Bah
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Well, well - just look what the wwftd is today!
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#78589
08/26/2002 8:36 AM
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Joined: Nov 2000
Posts: 3,146
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Quoth Emanuela: I hear well, but indeed, sometimes I say: wait,to listen to you I need to wear my glasses...
The idiot also known as Capfka ...
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