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I read this three times and for the first time in many years I am at a loss as to how to translate it.
Don't worry your pretty little head about it, then. Sorry there's no puns in it.
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"...when you're done with piling all these pure interval fifths on top of each other is 24 cents sharp of the C you started out with..."Mathematically this may be true, but your issue is only worth a penny less that two-bits as it manifests seven octaves apart, which *nobody in their 'right minds' will be juxtaposing for its fullest effect... let alone be able to discern it. The tuning adjustments are done at a smaller intervals and more accurately by ear by listening to a combination of ratios or a more complex ratio (such as 5/6 instead of 2/3), or so it is to my ear... On the note of different keys have different characters: A piano's sounding board and stringing has also had a lot to do with the character of key centers. The b natural (or b flat depending) below "mid" c is the point at which the note on a piano changes from comprising of three tuned strings to two tuned strings per note. This has a clear effect on how we (for example) relate c-major and a-minor (keys which share the same notes, but not the same "resting" point). This effect of timbre is minimized by correctly tuned instruments of the finest caliber... but how many of those are out there? 
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It's certainly not impossible to get a pure intervalAhh, that's it - I was thinking about the impossibility of getting perfect intervals right the way across a keyboard, as you so eloquently describe, Faldagious One. Yeah, just getting one pure interval so you can hear how it sounds is easy (ish). Mind you, you should hear a guitar I've tuned.  We got a lot of compromises along the way that left us with the idea that different keys have different charactersThis interests me. Are you saying that, in a non-well-tempered universe, all keys would sound more or less the same, and have the same "feel"? In other words there would be no advantage to writing music in any particular key (other than, perhaps, to fit in comfortably with vocal ranges). Edit: ackshully I think musick just answered my question (ta mate)
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In reply to:
The fifth of the fifth isn't where the problem is noticed.
I used this just as a starting point; to show that it was the adding up of continued "pure" intervals, that ended up causing the trouble. you finished my thought. thank you.
In reply to:
We got a lot of compromises along the way that left us with the idea that different keys have different characters.
I always thought that it was the other way around. the Greeks knew that each tonal center(key) had a different sense to it. Db sounded different than C because it was different. the frequency variations would cause a different resonance with the listener and the space around them. this is still true today, though since we have forced the keys to behave, the resonances don't ring true anymore. frankly, I think we lost a major part of what music could do to people. it is a testament to the power of vibration that music still moves people today.
musick: your idea of timbre is a good one, but I think it goes deeper than just two or three strings. think about the different instruments/voices that are used...
so Onabi, I think it is crucial to pick the right key for each song, not only for the instruments and voices that are to play it, but for the deeper resonances of nature that reside in each key.
formerly known as etaoin...
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I think it is crucial to pick the right key for each song, not only for the instruments and voices that are to play it, but for the deeper resonances of nature that reside in each key.
Nice way of putting it, eta.
I agree, albeit from the perspective of one who has never really heard much of alternative tunings.
A friend has a Korg keyboard that you can easily set to a variety of tunings; quite interesting to hear the same music "filtered" in different ways. But we tend to agree that one tuning system is the best for any given tune, even if it's not the same for each.
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the frequency variations would cause a different resonance with the listener
I have been trying to find out what the characters of each of the keys are. Do you know them all? I know that D major, for example, is supposed to be martial and F major pastoral (I think) but that's about as far as I can go. I think the point about certain keys sounding good on certain instruments is a valid point but is it cause or effect? D is martial because D is a good key for brass instruments and brass instruments sound martial so when one wishes to write martial music one does so in D so it will sound good on the martial instruments. Perhaps, at some point during the tweaking of the scales to get around the Pythogorean comma, D was more martial feeling because of its particular thirds and fourths and sixths and what-all, so when brass instruments were designed they were designed with the key of D in mind. But would a piece written in D sound less martial if transposed to F and played on a brass instrument designed for F the way a normal brass instrument was designed for D?
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Then there's the consideration of keys that are naturally set for strings.
The violin's strings are G, D, A, and E, a fifth apart. Those keys, both major and minor, are easiest to play for the violinist--or perhaps a better way to state this would be, they're more available. And there are countless works set around those keys.
It works for the cello and viola, too, though there's a little difference here:
C, G, D, and A being the tunings of their strings.
I don't offer the above to suggest that other keys are avoided in any way--instead, just to point out that a great deal of the literature is built around those keys because of how the string instruments are set up.
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Those keys, both major and minor, are easiest to playThis gets me thinking - major and minor are significantly different (even to non-musicians), but with "modal" music you end up with something that's neatly in between, that easily flips either way. Major and minor are more like opposite poles on a continuum than discrete entities. Flipping between major and minor would probably be expressed by "accidentals" in musical notation, but in a way this is cooking the books to make the notation work. And here's the thing - the same applies to keys in general. Guitar is a good instrument to "suss" this one: the chord Gsus4, for instance, is somewhere half-way between G and C. I could be playing a song that is officially written in G or in C, yet the chord that fits that song best overall is Gsus4. You can't say "this music is written in the key of Gsus4" as there's no way to express that in standard musical notation - it's nonetheless meaningful, and also very useful to musicians aware of other chord-shades that they've found to work well with Gsus4. Musical notation, like language, is a convention that enables understanding and communication. But marvelous as it is, it's still just a finger pointing at the moon - and it shouldn't be confused with a reality where its rules don't necessarily apply. Errr IMHO 
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First; a question: What notes are in a Gsus4 chord?
OK. Modes.
The major and minor keys are probably about 99% of modern western music but they are just two of seven different modes possible with the note distibution (two half steps scattered amongst all the whole steps) available to western music. They are often described in relation to the white notes on a piano. The standards are the major (C to C on a piano) and minor (A to A on a piano, but there are variations called harmonic and melodic minor that would just confuse things so we'll stick to what we can call the pure minor, A to A). These are not the only possibilities and, in fact, in the days of Gregorian chant, were not used very much, if at all. The modes have been given Greek names (that have nothing to do with anything the ancient Greeks called any corresponding modes but). These modes can be roughly divided into major and minor modes based on whether they had a major or minor third.
Starting with the one we call Ionian they are:
Ionian - This is the major mode. C to C on the piano.
Dorian - D to D. A minor mode. D minor has one flat, Bb. This is the sixth. It is a B natural in Dorian, so Dorian is minor with a raised sixth.
Phrygian - E to E. A minor mode. E minor has one sharp, F#. The F is natural in Phrygian, so Phrygian is minor with a minor second.
Lydian - F to F. A major mode. F major has one flat, Bb. The B is natural in Lydian, so Lydian is major with an augmented fourth.
Mixolydian - G to G. A major mode. G major has one sharp, F#. The F is natural in Mixolydian, so Mixolydian is major with a flatted seventh.
Aeolian - A to A. This is the pure minor.
Locrian - B to B. This is where things get scary. It's a minor mode but. B minor has two sharps, F# and C#. They are both natural in Locrian so Locrian is minor with a flatted second (the C#) and a diminished fifth (the F#). Since the perfect fifth is so basic to Western music use of the Locrian is almost unheard of and, indeed, thought by some to be Evil.
Anyone still awake can go back to sleep now, and pleasant dreams (as if)
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I don't have the time today to research this as much as I'd like, but a quick search for "tonal center" brought up several interesting sites, this one in particular: http://www.sohl.com/sohl/mt/maptone.htmlit's not quite what I'm looking for, but has some neat ideas, and both verbal and graphic explanations. perhaps a search for Greek music might give up something worthwhile. I'll be gone all day(sheesh, I have to go to the lake and spend time with the family ), but I'll get back to this. it's going to make for some possible lesson plans with my middle school music classes! ok, how about this: http://www.unconservatory.org/articles/hexperience.htmlscroll down to The Dark Sidewell, here's a list for you!  http://www.xs4all.nl/~huygensf/doc/bib.htmlthis will take days to get through, a huge bibliography(with many links) of tuning and temperament. yeeha!
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