as keiva would be the first to tell us, this is what we'd call hearsay, and it wouldn't be admissible in court
Please do not ever presume to put words in my mouth and know what I would say, Caradea. Would you prefer that I post documentary evidence -- that is, some of the actual texts of nastiness?
Please enlighten me. My latin is a little lacking but my dictionary says that inter alia means "among other things" and that does not make sense in the context you have provided. Is there a different meaning to this phrase that does not appear in my dictionary?
I was wondering the same thing and the post was for my information!!
Now, on reflection, I'm not so sure. Sure, Jeepers has only posted three times and has an 'uncanny' grasp of the AWAD board. Then again you can get a good idea of people's characters and the workings of this forum simply by sifting through a few threads. Jeepers may be a pseudonym of an old or established member but I'm not wholly convinced.
fwiw: Dickens registered on Jan. 28 2002; Jeepers on Nov. 29 2001. this, of course, proves nothing.
as keiva would be the first to tell us, this is what we'd call hearsay, and it wouldn't be admissible in court
Please do not ever presume to put words in my mouth and know what I would say, Caradea
WHOOPS! mea culpa, Keiva. i honestly had no idea that the laws in Illinois regarding the definition and inadmissibility of hearsay evidence (except in dying declarations) were different than those of California, where i studied criminal law. i should never have put those words into your mouth, and i apologize. i made the mistake of assuming that all state courts worked pretty much in the same manner. i have not had the opportunity to study federal law in any great degree, so i will gladly demur on this point to your greater knowledge. you have my humblest apologies.
Would you prefer that I post documentary evidence -- that is, some of the actual texts of nastiness?
oh, goodness no, not here on Anu's board... thank you. i tried to make that abundantly clear above, but did so in my characteristically fumbling manner. i just come here to talk about words, to learn, and to have a good laugh once in awhile.
I see that Annastrophic and Caradea want to change the subject. Getting a little hot in here?
Yes, thank you Dickens! (and welcome a-Board!) this is precisely what i was trying to say ~ but you've said it much more pithily! Flame wars are hot, and they make me uncomfortable -- even when i'm not involved.
and FWIW, when my toddlers get into a similar contest of he said/she said, and there's absolutely no way of getting down to the bottom of it without making assumptions as to who's telling the whole truth, i just send them ALL to their rooms. Now all of you--- get thee to Animal Safari! now, back to the glory of words!
Caradea, you tell me you do not want us to see the hurtful PM's, and then tell Dickens the matter should be dismissed because the PM's are not before us. You seem to want to have it both ways. BTW, the PM's have been omitted to date because of the practical concerns and senstitivity that faldage discussed. But by common law the PM's would be fully disclosable: if you want to make legal rules decisive here, you cannot object to publishing the PM's.
[Caradea: "WHOOPS! mea culpa, Keiva. i honestly had no idea that the laws in Illinois ... were ..."[/Caradea] Caradea, please note that I neither agreed nor disagreed with either your law or its relevance here; I left it for you to support your own views. Again, please do not misrepresent what I -- or stales -- have said.
Mav and I have just had a heated exchange, and have resolved it in a fine way: with immediate correction and going forward from there. Perhaps that is the best way to handle the conflicts that will inevitably arise: not to ignore them, but to clean them up and proceed.
A sincere thank you, mav.
[Re-edit Feb 3 at 13:33, with reference to my contermporaneous post below: The above edit was made in the interest of peace on the board, and may or may not be a "white lie".]
I am proposing an AWAD mascot-- the american porcupine--
my reasoning is based on the old joke about porcupines.. How do porcupines mate?
Carefully, Very carefully
porcupine quills are barbed, and painful-- but the little porcupine, contrary to folk myth, can't shoot them. you have to get up real close, and actually touch the animal to get stuck.
porcupine quills-->think of feathers--> in latinate languages-->plume-->which lead into pen--> which makes us think of words, and harsh word can be "sharper than a serpant's tooth, and hurt feeling..
Kieva-- dear little porcupine lover.. i wish could sooth your wounds.
and yes, the pm's could be publish here,-- and maybe-- sans the name of the poster it might help.. either i am too much the dullard to realize when ignomy is heaped on me, or i have been spared.. or maybe, i just have a warped sense of humor and total missed the point of harsh critizisms.
i hope you let the writer know-- they need to know directly.
as i have gotten older, i have come to see the wisdom of the phrase "the sins of the father are heaped on the sons"..
those of us, who have grown used to, who have become inurred to harsh critizism, might not realize how harsh we sometime are with others.. those of us, who have been raised in wisdom and kindness might not have developed the callused hides we need to protect themselves from such harsh words.
I have no doubt, that you, and Wordwind, and Jackie have been hurt.. i would like, in charity, to believe that the person who hurt you did not intend to be as cruel as they were percieved. (but, i know i can can be harsh and cruel, and i know i want charity, even if i don't deserve it!-- so some times i think i am more charitable than most.)
this thread is rift, and it threatens to rip apart our community. I don't know what can be done.. but if something can be done, i am willing to try.
kieva, can you think of no other solution--beside leaving?
Just don't go changin' your name, hear! No Jazzporcupines here. Did you know that porcupines go out on tree limbs to catch a few zzzz's? And, they are the actual culprits of the "deer johns" I posted about on July 4?
best thing about a jazzoctopus.. is all those arms.. we don't have to fight over him.. he has arms enough for each of us to get a hug.. pretty smart of him, huh?
mind, i'm calling dibs on the first hug..
by way, why dibs.. (continue in a questions about words thread...
No, Jazzo...somehow arquilltect doesn't quite fit. boy, you could say that again! but I couldn't resist...send the Groan Police if you must, I'm definitely guilty!
You say "draw back from slinging rocks," because of your "genuine concern for the overall harmony." But it looks like you were slinging them a few hours later, and Woodwind (above) sure sounds like some rocks hit him.
"One or more of the leavers may well have simply not understood this forum." Help me understand, please.
Dear Caradea: I got a "private message" from you, but I hear you copied it to others. Since you wanted to make your side of the story public -- without telling me that -- they should have the chance to hear my answer too.
For those of you who might not have seen Caradea's message, here it is: -------- hi dickens, i can see that you feel strongly about the issues being discussed in the "Departure" thread, which you resurrection today... and that's well within your rights. may i, though, suggest that you contact maverick privately with your questions? i can guarantee he won't answer there in Info & Announcements, in large part because *so many of the folks (including most recently Jazzoctopus and BobYoungBalt) have expressed their fervent desire to have this public fighting stop. noone is trying to censor you, least of all me... but please, take it private.
if you choose to take offense to this, i am sorry. but if you intention is honestly to understand the comments made by maverick (or anyone else), i believe you're barking up the wrong tree by seeking to keep that public thread alive. ------------- My response:
Hey! Since Maverick chose to put his comments to me here where everybody can read them, I don't understand why my answer to him can't be here too. It isn't me who chose to have our talk in public.
And who are these "*so many of the folks" that you say you are speaking for? I'm sure they can speak for themselves, and don't need you to put words into their mouths like you tried to do above. What I'm hearing from them is WAY different from what you say. Here's a sample: - - - - - - - - encore, please: From: ___ Received: Mon Jan 28 21:17:16 2002 Dear Dickens: ROTFLMAO Let me hold your coat while you do it again - - - - - - - -
So Caradea, who made you the official speaker for the board?
Hey guys - anybody ever heard of a strategy called "divide and conquer"? It's been around a while.
IMHO there are some things best ignored. Leave this thread where it is and go re-read "Your Best Experience" to remind yourself of the true nature of this board.
Thank you, Caradea and mav, for reminding me that my departure was be a struthionine response to the difficulty. [wink, stales, my Ozian buddy!] Accordingly, you've brought me back. Thank you.
Dickens, don't worry about Caradea. She's an infrequent poster, and doesn't speak for this board.
I'm sure Caradea wasn't trying to be harsh with you. She is a nice and caring person who, I'm sure, was just trying to help put a disheartening thread to bed. Write to her, you'll see I'm right.
Everybody is important, even infrequent posters Keiva. My feelings would be terribly hurt if I was dismissed so readily.
You were a stranger once with only a few posts to your name. Your voice was important then as it is now. Her voice was also important then, and it is now.
When someone has the ultimate good of the Board at heart they do speak for me - just as Jackie & mav & jazz & so many people have in the past. I honestly believe Cara was trying to help so she spoke for this Board member at least.
enuf, Rubrick. I am willing to let this lie -- but bel, faldage [in the "beheading" thread] and then you revive it. If y'all keep pricking at it and misstating, I must respond.
Rubrick, do check the record, and I think you'll find that you're off base here. Thank you.
You will find, I think, no point at which I purported to speak "for the board". Someone else -- not I -- purported to express the opinion of "*so many of the folks".
[My above entry, of Jan 29 at 14:34, is concurrently re-edited in white.]
I said this on another thread, and I guess I need to repeat it here:
ENUF ALREADY !!!!
I have to say frankly, and not in PM or email, that this continued brawling between certain of you (you know who you are) abuses the patience of the rest of us who would like to get on with the real business of AWAD. Also that we don't want to lose anyone else by their taking offence and going off in a huff and a virtual sedan chair. Unfortunately, it seems there are some of us who have unnaturally thin skins and just can't let anything lie, but have to keep going back and picking away. And of course, if it goes on, it won't be long before someone takes serious offense.
Can you not understand that this is a site for our delight, fellowship and learning? No one's professional reputation is at stake here. No one is in danger of losing his/her job, spouse, social standing, or anything else if he or she forgoes the opportunity to respond to every single comment that might, by some stretch of the imagination, be thought by anyone to be critical.
I appeal to everyone to let this accursed thread die. If no one posts on it any more, we'll be done with it. And if anyone tries a similar one elsewhere, well ... [menacing doom econ].
I was going to PM this post to Keiva but, chances are, it would end up on a thread given the legalistic argument presented earlier in the thread.
Did I ever purport to?
You just did. By telling Dickens that Caradea doesn't speak for the board implies that you are voicing the opinion of the board. More correctly, what you are saying is that she doesn't speak for you.
Rubrick, do check the record, and I think you'll find that you're off base here.
Am I? Am I really? In the space of one week you announce your departure, debate rages during which you come back several times, announce you are staying and then decide that the thread should be ended at your insistence but not before having a cheap shot at Caradea. You try to sound magnanimous by saying you will 'let things lie' but still need to have the last word always - even if the previous poster has been trying to defuse the situation, as belmarduk was doing, and there is no reason for you to have the last word.
I've read your posts, Keiva, and you rarely have a good or cheerful thing to say. How sad to think that your contribution to words comes mostly in the form of put-downs and discord.
FWIW, my personal opinion is that both of you are equally guilty of reprehensible conduct by persisting in flailing away at each other publicly in this thread. I do not accept your reasoning for why you refuse to carry on this inane vendetta in private, if carry it on you must. It appears that neither of you has the good sense to simply give it up, leaving the other to enjoy whatever dubious gratification he can for having the last word. Doing that would be a real class act, but it doesn't appear, as yet, that either of you can do that.
What is most disturbing is that both of you are otherwise valuable members whose contributions I have appreciated and enjoyed, and I hope to continue to enjoy them. You are wasting your time and ours with this poisonous diversion.
I shall exercise a strategy which I used once before when I felt that a thread had passed beyond the acceptable bounds of political discussion, and I recommend it highly to all other members: viz., I shall not again open or read this thread. [This is the strategy of the wise parent whose child is having a temper tantrum -- you simply ignore him and let him scream away.] If the rest of us follow this strategy, further combat between any or all parties will be essentially a private exchange, since no one else will be reading it.
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mea culpa, Keiva. i honestly had no idea that the laws in Illinois regarding the definition and inadmissibility of hearsay evidence (except in dying declarations) were different than those of California, where i studied criminal law. i should never have put those words into your mouth, and i apologize. i made the mistake of assuming that all state courts worked pretty much in the same manner. i have not had the opportunity to study federal law in any great degree, so i will gladly demur on this point to your greater knowledge. you have my humblest apologies.
boy, you could say that again! but I couldn't resist...send the Groan Police if you must, I'm definitely guilty!
