#52035
01/06/2002 9:15 PM
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In Discover magazine, Dec. 2001, in an article entitled "Risks" is described antelope pursued by a cheetah jumping straight up with legs straight. This is called "stotting". I could not find the word in any of my dictionaries, but I found it in several sites. Cheetahs also do it. As a guess it might be of South African Dutch origin.
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#52036
01/06/2002 9:38 PM
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Dear wwh,
STOTTING is a grrrrrrr-eat word!!
Imagine a stilter stotting! A stotting stilter! A stilter who stots. A stilter, a sot, who stots. A star stilter, a sot, who stots. An optic star stilter, a sot, who stots.
There's a lot to stot, but I better stop.
DubDub
tsuwm, please do NOT look up the bloody word. I really like this one and don't want you to come here telling us it's a typo or something like that or can't be used in Scrabble! Killjoy!
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#52037
01/06/2002 11:13 PM
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Stot away, Dub' Dub. It's in the brick and mortar OED even. Says it's of obscure origin but may be from a Teutonic root and then gives some possibly related words in Old Norse, Old Saxon and Old High German. Doesn't say anything about Afrikaans.
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#52038
01/06/2002 11:23 PM
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just so, although you neglect to mention that it is mainly Scot. and is not recognized by the OSPD* (US Scrabble, that is).
*but. stotinka is recognized; it is a Bulgarian monetary unit. Scrabble really is a stupid game.
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#52039
01/06/2002 11:53 PM
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#52040
01/06/2002 11:55 PM
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not recognized by the OSPD
So if you don't like Mrs. Byrne Scrabble® play OED Scrabble.
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#52041
01/07/2002 12:26 AM
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<slapping forehead with palm>
how could have I forgotten to check with Mrs. B? she does have stot - with 2 n. senses and 3 v-n. and v. senses.
the seemingly unrelated n. stot is a steer, or heifer, or a stupid clumsy person (Scot.).
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#52042
01/07/2002 12:37 AM
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Since the behavior is noted prinicpally in two African animals, why should an Afrikans origin seem implausible?
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#52043
01/07/2002 1:11 AM
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tswum, re stot: what Byrne have you got? what do we wot?
My Byrne says:
n 1. a young horse. 2. a three-year-old castrated bull
n & v.i. 1. stumble, stagger. 2. bounce, rebound. 3. stammer
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#52044
01/07/2002 1:25 AM
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Dear Keiva: Mrs.B's "bounce" would fit. Incidentally this behaviour, which to some biologists seems a stupid way of wasting energy, to a shrewdie meant on the contrary, the animal was telling the predator, I'm so full of energy, you'd do better to chase someone else who is tired.
I remember seeing on TV predators circling pack of prey animals, trying to identify a weak one.
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#52045
01/07/2002 2:51 AM
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hi, dr. bill! My point was that Mrs. Bryne's definitions do not seem to match what tsuwm posted. I'm just a city-boy, but I'm pretty sure that "heifer" is not the same as "horse".
But I'd also not think that Mrs. B's "bounce" (implying a rebound from an opposite-direction motion) would fit the animal behavior you describe of "jumping straight up with legs straight".
Agreed that your hypothesized "communicative" reason for the animal behavior might be of use for a prey-animal. But would it seem of use to a predator, such as a cheetah?
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#52046
01/07/2002 5:37 AM
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addict
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I remember seeing on TV predators circling pack of prey animals, trying to identify a weak one.
This reminds me of the story of The Lion and the Gazelle
Every morning in Africa a gazelle wakes up and knows that it will have to outrun the fastest lion or it will be killed.
And, every morning in Africa a lion wakes up and knows that it will have to outrun the slowest gazelle or it will starve to death.
So, in Africa, it doesn't matter if you are the lion or the gazelle. When that sun comes up, you had better be running.
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#52047
01/07/2002 5:57 AM
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sorry for the confusion... the stuff you have from Mrs. B. agrees with my numbers (except that that the second set is labeled -n & v.i., which I assume means verbal-noun and intransitive verb). I then went to OED because her definitions didn't seem to all relate. that's where I found the two distinct nouns -- the original meaning of that which I showed as "steer, heifer, fool" was indeed an
inferior horse, but that sense is marked obsolete.
here, for the sake of clarity is the whole bloody thing:
stot n(1) -
†1. A horse. In OE. ? one of an inferior kind.
2. A young castrated ox, a steer. north.
3. A heifer. north.
4. †a. As a term of contempt for a woman. Obs.
b. A stupid, clumsy person. Sc. and dial.
5. Comb., as stot-beef, -hide, -ox, †-stable; stot-calf, a castrated bull-calf; †stot-plough = fool-plough (fool n.1 6).
stot n(2) -
1. The act of rebounding; a rebound; a rebounding blow. at or on the stot, (to catch or take) on the rebound; in quots. fig. to play stot, to rebound, bounce (Eng. Dial. Dict.).
2. A leap or spring, esp. in dancing. Hence, the swing or rhythm of a tune. to keep stot, to keep step or time (with); also fig.
stot v. -
1. intr. To rebound, bounce (from, off); to fall or impinge with a bounce (on, against); to jump, start, spring.
b. fig.
2. To move with a jumping or springing step, to bound along; also trans. (causative). Also, to stagger, lurch, move unsteadily.
Hence "stotting ppl. a. Also "stotter, a ball that bounces or rebounds.
so, aren't you sorry you asked? nor, as you can see, can Mrs. B. nor anyone else really do this word justice in an abridged format.
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#52048
01/07/2002 9:33 AM
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Dear tsuwm,
You're a word-stotting dear here with your definitions, but that Scrabble dictionary is the problem with Scrabble. One of the problems, that is.
You quote:
b. A stupid, clumsy person. Sc. and dial.
And I think the Scots were confused about the word and got stot mixed up with sot to have come to the above misunderstanding. Not too many clumsy people could stot at all, but sots are often clumsy, so there's where the fork in the linguistic road occurred.
Best regards,
DD
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#52049
01/07/2002 2:00 PM
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dear dub (A muddy or stagnant pool; a small pool of rain water in a road; a puddle. (Chiefly Sc.),
yeahbut. you seem to be the confused one, or you are pertinaciously denying the existence of two nouns -- the one in question having to do with various inferiorities and prolly nothing at all to do with the bouncing verb. (in the etymology, OED allows as how there may be yet another separation between the inferior horse and steer/heifer senses) 4a/b I think come from that same inate human kindness that has seen humans called cows or horse's patoots. The great stot of a farm lad.
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#52050
01/07/2002 2:42 PM
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I wonder if the word is related to German "Stute" and our "steed".
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#52051
01/07/2002 11:29 PM
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yeahbut.© you seem to be the confused one [...]
that'll be $0.99 plus sales tax, payable in Euros to my Swiss bank a/c please Michael.
yeahbut. (var. yeahbut!, yeahbut, emph) An exclamation that signifies acceptance of the contents of an interlocutor's contribution to the conversation, whilst placing a marker to signify an intention to rebut or demur from the thrust of the argument, said in allowing the brain to fully formulate the response. All © maverick enterprises unltd 2001, used freely by friends and enemas.
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#52052
01/08/2002 4:05 AM
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Yeahbut© I'm glad to see you back and posting anyway! Is THAT how you plan on paying for that babemobile!! My cheque is in the mail.
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#52053
01/08/2002 4:27 PM
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Dear Stot,
Watch those muddy or stagnant puwls into which you trod with your heavy huwves. Tuw much mud there, and you won't be able to stot anymore at all--no way. And what's the uwse of a stot who stots not?
Beast regards,
WordWot, a Scot who stots a lot!
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#52054
01/08/2002 4:49 PM
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WO'N thought it of no advantage to cheetah to "stot". I think it is posssible that the cheetah wants to evoke similar response from the antelopes, so he/she will know which ones are too hard to catch, and when the others move, notice any who limp, meaning they could easily be caught.
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#52055
01/08/2002 4:55 PM
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Dear wwh,
So the antelope that stots not is wot by the cheetah and is cot!
Thanks a lot!
DubDubDoubleDub
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#52056
01/08/2002 7:23 PM
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Dear WW: I remember seeing TV nature programs with antelopes popping until their hooves were as high as the top of their back had been. I don't remember seeing them crouch down, just suddenly they were a yard or more off the ground, with legs straight. Remarkable. I tot I taw a cheetaw.
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#52057
01/08/2002 8:03 PM
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bill, there's a guy who writes about juggling who teaches that it's done by "popping" the balls from the palms of your hands without actually moving the arms. he appears to be sort of hippy-dippy.
(I wonder if there'd be any interest in a juggling seminar at WaP....)
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#52058
01/08/2002 8:12 PM
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Dear tsuwm: I enjoy watching juggling, but never got so I could keep three tennis balls in motion. Just one more skill I could never acquire. Among so many. They laughed when I sat down at the piano, and then laughed louder still. I'm sure a juggling act would enliven the party you refer to. Bill
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#52059
01/08/2002 8:20 PM
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I don't have an act  , but I can teach....
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#52060
01/08/2002 8:53 PM
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It used to be said that those who can, do. Those who can't, teach. I'm sure you are being modest.
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#52061
01/09/2002 8:09 AM
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So, are we suggesting here, as we toss a few balls into the air and juggle 'em around, that stotting is a form of juggling? That seems quite a leap, especially, most especially for tsuwm.
If stotting were like juggling with its springboard from the hand, then Mother Earth must be doing so bodacious undulating there no geologist has ever noted.
WW
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#52062
01/09/2002 2:47 PM
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>So, are we suggesting here... that stotting is a form of juggling?
nope -- the connection was the visual "popping"; in neither case do I believe that there is really no "preparation".
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