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#44559 10/15/01 04:57 AM
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stales Offline OP
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Got it!! (I think)

The word "whirl" can be substituted for "birl" - ie, "C'mon stales, give it a whirl". Following the thought further, it's only a very small step to thinking of taking one's turn as taking one's chance (in trying to do something). Ergo, we are now considering whirling and birling in the context of a game of chance. Thus, surpise surprise, the expression may have had its origin in the famous Oz game of 2-up (which, as I'm sure you are all aware of, 2 pennies are spun in the air and the outcomes bet upon - 2 heads, 2 tails or a split). The person that flips the coins, the spinner, is giving the pennies a birl. As the spinner's role can be filled by any of the assembled punters, each could say, "I'll give it a birl" as they stepped into the circle.

Another game of chance contender is the "chocolate wheel" - that firm favourite of pubs, school fetes, returned serviceman's ("RSL") clubs etc. You know, the big wooden disk with nails around its perimeter against which a strip of rubber flaps.

Whaddya reckon? I think the "twirl" definition DID crack it - big thanks.

stales


#44560 10/15/01 05:03 AM
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stales, it may be that we have two phrases (i.e., give it a burl/whirl) linked by coincidence (or not). the folks at OED don't seem to have made a direct connection, for they give us:

burl n. [App. var. north. dial. birl a whirring sound, a rapid twist or turn, etc. (see E.D.D. and Sc. Nat. Dict.); cf. birl v. to revolve, rotate.] 1. ? Roundness, fullness. poet.
2. Also birl. An attempt, a try, a test; esp. in phr. to give it a burl, to make an attempt. Austral. and N.Z. colloq.

birl v. Scot. [A modern word: apparently onomatopœic; having probably association with birr, whirr, whirl, hurl, and Sc. dirl, pirl, in all of which there is a reference to vibration or rotation and its sound.]
1. intr. To move on with rotatory motion, as a rifle bullet; also fig.
2. To revolve or rotate rapidly and with characteristic noise.

the vbl n. birling would seem to fall out of the lattermost sense.

-joe (I'm a lumberjack and I'm okay) friday


#44561 10/15/01 11:08 AM
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Whirl, burl; whirly-burly; hurly-burly...hurdy-gurdy(?).
============================================================

tsuwm: you dress in women's clothing??? Well, that's ok...I guess...


#44562 10/15/01 03:12 PM
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Helen: >definitely some sort of ozzie slang..
OED: >esp. in phr. to give it a burl, to make an attempt. Austral. and N.Z. colloq.

Nicely done, Helen!


#44563 10/15/01 03:53 PM
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Keiva, even a stopped clock gets to right twice a day!


#44564 10/15/01 04:37 PM
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even a stopped clock
Still, I have to hand it to you, Helen, for chiming in on this one!


#44565 10/15/01 04:54 PM
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Here in the US these are seen at carnivals, where they are called dice wheels.

They are used in Kentucky for determining when to wean horses. Basically, adult horses run faster if they are weaned sooner. Hence the expression "A foal and her mummy are soon parted."



TEd
#44566 10/16/01 10:45 PM
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TEd, do you have a licence or something? And does it cost much? Where do you get them? Time they put the fees up, I think!



The idiot also known as Capfka ...
#44567 10/17/01 01:04 AM
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So we have:

Have a go = give it a birl = give it a whirl

What about "take a stab at it," which means the same thing but seems a tad more, um, rough. Does anybody have an idea as to origin of this particular variation?


#44568 10/17/01 01:14 AM
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One of my favourite blackadder sequences...
From http://www.totse.com/en/ego/science_fiction/ba2-2.html
E = Edmund Blackadder
C = a young crone

E: Tell me young crone, is this Putney?
C: That it be, that it be.
E: "Yes it is". Not "that it be". You don't have to talk in that stupid voice to me. I'm not a tourist. I seek information about a Wisewoman.
C: Ah, the Wisewoman.. the Wisewoman.
E: Yes, the Wisewoman.
C: Two things, my lord, must thee know of the Wisewoman. First, she is ... a woman, and second, she is ...
E: .. wise?
C: You do know her then?
E: No, just a wild stab in the dark which is incidentally what you'll be getting if you don't start being a bit more helpful. Do you know where she lives?
C: Of course.
E: Where?
C: Here. Do you have an appointment?
E: No.
C: Well, you can go in anyway.
E: Thank you young crone. Here is a purse of money ... which I'm not going to give to you.

And yes, I do realise this doesn't answer the question.


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