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A good friend used the wonderfully descriptive phrase to express surprise to me the other day: "Sh*t house Susie!" (well, they didn't say the asterix but I put that in for those of delicate sensibilities like Jackie)  Do any of you know this one, or where it may come from?
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Well, another thread that's gonna be a bust.
TEd
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be a bust.
a bust? is that the wrong part of the anatomy? isn't this thread about an out house?
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isn't this thread about an out house?
And what is a brick outhouse built like anyway? And would you want someone who was built like one?
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don't get too [anal]ytical about this one, guys -- it simply means "well built".
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"well built"
Far as that goes, I've never seen a brick [out]house, and I don't see anything that would suggest that they would necessarily be well built.
Examining the minutia of life through the microscope of [anal]ysis
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Aunt mav--such language!  "Yeah, she's a brick...house"--The Commodores.
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It means from the bottom up!
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veteran
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I have seen a brick outhouse, at Pennsbury Manor, the [restored] estate of William Penn, colonial proprietor of Pennsylvania. It's a three-holer. Must have been the oatmeal (USn expression for "porridge") that caused the necessity for such a large and sturdy privy.
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It's a three-holer
For family use? I've heard that the family that prays together stays together, but might this be excessive?
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No Kaopectate back then. One of my brother-in-laws(cuñado for those paying attention) used to call the well-built ones "monumental" This was said in Spanish preceded by a reverse hiss.
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Not to be gross here but, I remember we had an outhouse at our summer chalet when we were young. It was made of wood and movable for when the hole in the ground became, well, full. Brick outhouses don't sound like they would be all that movable. Do you mean to tell me that they were emptied out??
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Wow, I reread this post to make sure it was o.k. and I see the words summer chalet and it sounds so high-end and fancy.
I wonder if there is a better word for what my parents own. It is a rectangular, one-storey house (no basement), clapboard siding on the outside and no walls on the inside. Welllll, actually, my mom, being the creative sort, not being able to afford actual drywall, stapled old bedspreads to the two by fours to give the illusion of walls. We love it and still go up North every once in a while but 'chalet' looking it is not. Any ideas?
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Well we do use camp when we talk in French. It is an 'anglicism' - a word the French have borrowed from the English. But doesn't a camp involve tents more than houses?
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Not necessarily. I have heard men refer to hunting camps that had nothing to do with tents but everything to do with roughing it. post-edit-and beer.
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old hand
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Outhouses are still common throughout water-poor rural Australia (flushing considered to be a criminal waste of water). No such thing as a pan service way out there either, so they sit atop a bloody great pit. Usually built of wood and/or corrugated iron and strategically placed to allow the occupant/s to take in the view (typically flat red nothingness...). Inevitably covered by a peppercorn tree for shade (usually magnificent botanic specimens due to the abundant supply of nutrients!!). And, in all seriousness, a wonderful fossicking opportunity 50 to one hundred years later for those of us that collect old bottles. (Gallons of Lysol during its operating life and lots of bacterial action over the decades negate any unpleasantness).
You have probably heard them referred to as "dunnies" - but, for those REALLY in the know, they are called "long drops"!!!
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Well, I guess camp it is then. But we don't rough if very much any more since there is now running water (hot water since two years) and electricity.
throughout water-poor rural Australia (flushing considered to be a criminal waste of water).
Wow stales, what a description. I am always so amazed at the diversity of the world. Here in Québec you can't throw a brick without hitting a lake (or a church). I am exagerating a bit (about the lakes...not the churches) but there is so much water people don't even spare a thought for it.
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In reply to:
It's a three-holer
For family use? I've heard that the family that prays together stays together, but might this be excessive?
I seem to remember the Romans enjoyed(?) communal facilities seating up to 20 at a time.
Bingley
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Talking about your loo with a view, the toilet at Empress Hut (on the Empress Ridge of Mt Cook - about 10,000 feet ASL) sits astride a ridge. Guess where the byproducts go? It's the ultimate long drop! Interesting place, interesting loo. Probably has one of the best views in the world! But cold, very, very cold ...
BTW Faldage, ol' chap, when you were talking about it being a bust, were you referring to Susie, by any chance?
The idiot also known as Capfka ...
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But cold, very, very cold ...I imagine, CK, that that would give 'inspiration' for things to "move right along"... My sweet bel, what about vacation cottage or cabin? I thought about 'shack', but that seems a bit low for a clapboard structure. Loved your dot post, by the way! Now, consuelo, if you connect the dots of your chicken pox, you could develop a new art form.
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Faldage, ol' chap, when you were talking about it being a bust
Bust? Moi? Nuh-uh, 'tweren't me what talked about nuthin' bein' no bust. 'At were TEd what done.
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Camp is sometimes used to refer to some pretty well apportioned dwellings in the Adirondacks, but that is the only context I have heard it used in to indicate anything other than a collection of, usually tents, but, at the high end, log shelters that had one side entirely open.
Cabin might work also, but then if we're talking translation to and from Canadien, who knows what to say?
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fishing camps I've been to in the GWN are anything but well-apportioned-or-appointed, but the edifices do have solid walls. some are well kept up and others... just trashy. often the only access is via bush pilot.
back in the USA, the National Guard, Scouts and so forth go to summer camps and seldom see the inside of a tent.
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I *thought well-apportioned looked funny.
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Wow, I reread this post to make sure it was o.k. and I see the words summer chalet and it sounds so high-end and fancy.
In Ontario we always used "cottage" to describe the summer vacation home. It seemed to apply to everything from the shacks to those fancy places (with their heat, electricity, running water and likely cable access, looking like something out of a "homes of the future" magazine) that I'd see across the lake from my grandparent's cottage.
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Cottage it is then. It sounds very homey - which the cottage was. Actually, it was quite roomy. There was a boys room, a girls room AND my parents had a separate room to themselves - something they did not have at home (they slept in living room on hide-a-bed)
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Cottage it is then. It sounds very homey - which the cottage was. Actually, it was quite roomy...
Sounds a lot like my grandparents cottage. Three bedrooms, living room/dining room and kitchen in an "L" shape, and a bathroom, laundry room. It's amazing how roomy they can be even when by city standards they're small. I suppose having all the outdoors also added to it, being an extra room. My grandfather did a lot of work on the place through the years, adding split log steps down to the lake, and garden. I was too young to remember the changes - only the end result. But I've been told about them often enough. My grandparents probably would have stayed there all year if it didn't get quite so *cold*. ;-) A ton of insulation wasn't one of the upgrades, and besides, the water got pumped up from the lake and filtered. The whole contraption would have froze along with the lake and burst if not drained for the winter.
One of the things I remember best was the huge barrel of wood blocks which were the main entertainment for any kids over - the tv never really picked anything up on the antenna. Then there was smell of the pine trees, and one year being there in time for the trilliums blooming in the woods - a wide carpet of them. Very beautiful.
The water freaked me out. I loved to swim, but not the little fishes nipping. ;-)
Ali
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I hate to go from chalets to outhouses again, but BelM demands, "Do you mean to tell me that they were emptied out?" Oui, ma chère, c'est ça exactement.
My father-in-law grew up in an area which was, before 1918, adjacent to the city of Baltimore, at which time it was incorporated into the city. It was developed in the 1880s and was a neighborhood of small row houses (some only 9 feet wide) with very small yards in back, and each had a outhouse. There was a service called, of all things, the OED or Odorless Excavation Device, familiarly known as the "honeydipper" which you called for when needed. It was essentially a horse-drawn wagon with a large tank on top and some sort of handpowered pump hooked up to thick hoses. They usually arranged matters so as to do a number of houses on the same block on the same day, as it was anything but odorless. The outhouses were not replaced by city sewers until well into the 1920s.
*** Post scriptum. The folks at the big word book by the Isis will be glad to hear that I was wrong about what the device was called. My wife tells me her recollection of her father's story is that it was the OEO, Odorless Excavation Operation, and the kids would run around chanting, "Oh-ee-oh-ee" when it came around.
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In Zild (and I'm sure that either MaxQ or I have mentioned it before) we get round the whole problem of what to call our holiday homes by using not one, but TWO completely different words for them. In the North Island, holiday homes of all descriptions, from driftwood-and-corrugated-iron shacks to $2 million architecturally-ruined and aesthetically-challenged multiplexes are called baches. In the South Island, the self-same holiday homes of all genera are called cribs. If you talk about a bach or a crib, anyone in New Zealand will understand that you mean a holiday home, although they will not necessarily have any idea about its quality. There are entire books and whole TV documentaries dedicated to the humble and not-so-humble crib/bach. A cottage industry, really ...
The idiot also known as Capfka ...
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In the South Island, the self-same holiday homes of all genera are called cribs.
So *that's* where the ebonics word came from. (But in South Central LA, where it's used, one's crib is his home, not his vacation villa).
And how do you pronounce bach(e)? Like batch? Has it anything to do with bachelor/ette? Perhaps because it is where one flees when he suddenly finds himself single again?
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....aesthetically-challenged multiplexes...
Are there any other kind?
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Crib = Home : It's still used 'ere... where I've 'eard it used since at least '74. It may have been *adopted by ebonics...
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BobY, a honeydipper?? Ohmigawd, I'd say I'm rolling, but I'm afraid I'd be rolling IN something... The OEO, huh? Um, were the songwriters for The Wizard of Oz from that area outside Baltimore, by any chance?
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The OEO, huh? Um, were the songwriters for The Wizard of Oz from that areac'mon, everybody knows that was the "Oreo song". http://www.tardislabs.com/qf/wizard.html
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I never claimed that "crib" and "bach" were words specifically made up in Zild. They've just been suborned to colloquial usage. The AHD has this to say about crib: (Haven't I heard that expression somewhere else?)
crib (krib)
n.
1. A bed with high sides for a young child or baby.
2. A small building, usually with slatted sides, for storing corn.
(a) A rack or trough for fodder; a manger.
(b) A stall for cattle.
(c) A small crude cottage or room.
Slang. One's home.
So, Keven, the usage you have heard was perfectly correct.
For bach, however, there appears to be no dictionary entry which equates to "house" or "small house". Maybe it's an original usage? Perhaps tsuwm, with his access to more authorative dictionaries, can find one more closely related to house.
The idiot also known as Capfka ...
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tsuwm, that link was in-doob-itably surreal, man. ======================================================== Back to summer homes--the name for them in Russia is on the tip of my tongue...can anyone help me out?
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enthusiast
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the name for them in Russia is on the tip of my tongue...can anyone help me out?
Dacha, I think.
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That's it. Thanks, Rapunzel. I knew bach reminded me of it somehow.
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Ok, here's the skinny on this subject:
If it costs under $20 thousand to build it's "The Camp."
If the cost exceeds $20 thousand -- originally or with upgrades -- it is (becomes) "The Lodge!"
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1. U.S. slang. A bachelor; old bach, a confirmed bachelor. Also phr. to keep bach for earlier to keep bachelor's hall (cf. hall n. 11) = bach v.
2. N.Z. Also batch. a. A makeshift hut, usu. one in which a man living alone fends for himself. b. Now esp. a small house at the seaside or at a holiday resort.
emPHAsis added...
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So, is there a name for the place where a woman lives alone? Just want to know what to call my new place  .BTW-house-warming party this Friday.
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even more to the point, how about a word for a bachelor girl or woman, other than bachelorette, that could be so shortened.
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Don't think I've ever heard of it being referred to as somewhere where a man lives alone, but it makes sense as an origin.
Thanks tsuwm!
The idiot also known as Capfka ...
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it simply means "well built".
I've never seen a brick [out]house, and I don't see anything that would suggest that they would necessarily be well built.
Perhaps the simile is more easily comprehensible if "well built" is rephrased as "built substantially beyond the norm".
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re: how about a word for a bachelor girl or woman
didn't that used to be spinster? and isn't now career woman? do we have any better choices?
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>"built substantially beyond the norm".
the 3rd little pig had a "well built" house.
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2. N.Z. Also batch. a. A makeshift hut, usu. one in which a man living alone fends for himself. b. Now esp. a small house at the seaside or at a holiday resort.Say, Max--as our only current NZ resident currently posting, can you please tell us: if a man lives alone in a hut, is he still wrong?  ========================================================= consuelo, happy housewarming, my dear! ========================================================= Pooh-Bah CK--congratulations, on both your new title and your newly-added wife...now you can be wrong twice as often!
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jackie ambiguates congratulations, on both your new title and your newly-added wife...now you can be wrong twice as often!I'm sure I'm reading this wrong, but this oddly worded phrase certainly suggests an even number of wives -- I trust no *more than two(2).
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didn't that used to be spinster? and isn't now career woman? do we have any better choices?
Well, I know the word spinster fell out of use some time in the '70s. Career woman is *never used here. You can say a woman has a careet in sales or some other job but she is never refered to as a career woman.
A woman that is not married is 'single' (célibataire in French)
We don't have a word for the residence of a woman living alone like men do with bachelor appartment.
The term 'bachelor' in French refers to an appartment (flat) that has a bathroom, a bedroom, a kitchen and a living room. We call that a "three and a half".
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Oldies, but goodies: Does a chicken have lips? Does it snow in Siberia in the winter? Does a tree falling in the woods make a sound?
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My vote for what to call a single woman-GODDESS  I guess I know now what to call my new place. It's a 3 1/2.
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It seems live ages ago that of troy said, "a bust? is that the wrong part of the anatomy? isn't this thread about an out house?"
Helen, there's a phylogenic connection between bust and butt. Note that the human species is unique in these two respects:
1) walks in an upright position (even for the other species of apes, this is not their primary posture), and
2) has, between the male and female of the species, significant differencein the appearance of the (ahem) mammalia.
Those two uniquenesses are not unrelated, in evolutionary (phylogenic) terms.
Aside to tsuwm: am I correct in assuming that the linguistic similarity of the terms "bust" and "butt" is merely coincidental?
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am I correct in assuming that the linguistic similarity of the terms "bust" and "butt" is merely coincidental?
in a word, yes.
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"Crib" is a very common word in the Australian mining industry - courtesy of our Cornish forbears.....
Whist the Zilders' use of the word for a holiday house and the mining version no doubt have the same roots, I've often wondered whether the "crib (ie lunch) room" on a mine site (either underground or on the surface) derives from the old time miners' passion for cribbage, the card game?
The term is used in several contexts on a site. For instance, one's lunch is also referred to as one's crib - to be consumed at crib time.
By the by, I made a happy link to the past when I found a home made cribbage board at Kanowna, 19km NE of Kalgoorlie in 1987. It had been carved from the side of a dynamite box sometime between 1902 and 1920 (worked this out by knowing when the mine whose dump I found it in had been operating).
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<<In conjunction with BelM's early reminder that outhouses are chattel, not real estate, Keiva's statement "built substantially beyond the norm" yields this possibility:
"built like a brick outhouse" suggests something not just built beyond the norm, but so much so as to be impractical or, even, ridiculous. In which case, many a dot.com might well be said to have been a brick and mortar business.
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<<In conjunction with BelM's early reminder that outhouses are chattel, not real estate, Keiva's statement "built substantially beyond the norm" yields this possibility:
"built like a brick outhouse" suggests something not just built beyond the norm, but so much so as to be impractical or, even, ridiculous. In which case, many a dot.com might well be said to have been a brick-and -mortar business.
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How did I know that bach meant a small holiday home if it's exclusively a Zild term? Did it lodge (whoops)somewhere in the back of my mind from reading The Bone People 15 or more years ago? Why do I keep thinking that there's something Gaelic about it? Some sort of temporary overnight shelter for hunters or something like that? How can I google this without running into page after page of baroque music fans?
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something Gaelic
Taking us neatly fool circle, Ty Bach is Welsh for... brick outhouse!
A term for an overnight house is ty un nos, which if you could get away with building overnight on common land you could establsih squatters' rights.
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addict
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Honeydipper
often known as the Lavender Lorry in the U.K.
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Taking us neatly fool circle, Ty Bach is Welsh for... brick outhouse!
I thought so...:
maverick
(member)
Mon Oct 16 08:31:01 2000
Re: Favorite graffiti
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
wiggle Bach
Loved this Anna!
In Welsh 'Bach' means little - the colloquial expression for what the Ozzies call a dunny would be Ty Bach (literally, little house). I often imagine the confused discussion of Welsh musicologists when discussing Bach's family, given the local tendency to patronymics followed by diminutives
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Ahem. Women with large breasts are said to be "stacked." Bricks are stacked to make structures with them. Hence a curvaceous woman is built like a brick house, and she's mighty mighty, and letting it allllll hang out.
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<<bricks are stacked to make structures...
bricks are stacked in storage, in building they are laid.
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bricks are stacked in storage, in building they are laid. [in rows or tiers]
The former verb stressing their vertical dimension; the latter stressing the horizontal.
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built like a brick outhouse
BTW, in this phrase I've never heard anyone say outhouse -- it's invariably sh*thouse.
The first post in this thread (by mav) makes me wonder if usage may differ elsewhere in this regard. Mav, any info?
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In reply to:
bricks are stacked in storage, in building they are laid.
heh heh heh. I'm not touching THAT one for fear of the gutter police.
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And well you shouldn't Alex...especially after that brief musical interlude in your previous post. I'd say you are just this side of falling in.
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My grandmother had a name for her outhouse that I have never heard anyone else use. Skanoobie(sic). Was it just that grandmama was a little silly(that would explain a lot) or has anyone else ever heard of this?
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>A woman that is not married is 'single' (célibataire in French)
So how would you describe a woman who is single but not, er, celibate?
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well-loved? popular?
One is love; two is adventure; three is promiscuity -- and four or more is research.
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<<single but not..
célibrataire
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You do know what a single woman that is involuntarily celibate is called?She's called often, I would suppose? (or merely off and on?  )
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>So how would you describe a woman who is single but not, er, celibate?
My kinda girl
TEd
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><You do know what a single woman that is involuntarily celibate is called?
Drop dead homely???
Edited 9/27/01:
It's been brought to my attention that this was crude and insensitive. I will bring it to [bold]everyone's[/bold] attention that this is true. It was crude and insensitive and I apologize to one and all. I'll try to think before opening my big keyboard in the future.
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No, silly. She's just particular.
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Well, which is it, Consuelo? First you said horny; then you said particular. Perhaps you mean "particularly horny"?
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Are you doing research on the subject Keiva?
I thought you were involved with real estate. Or is this a sideline?
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Research, dear Helen? A gentleman never tells. (and not ) (Do forgive me if real estate has kept me preoccupied of late. I've had a lot on my mind.) Your question recalls the story where a gentleman at a cocktail party, after speaking with a young lady on an extremely friendly basis, noted his wife's acid stare. "Don't worry, dear," he assured her, "she's merely a professional acquaintance." "Really?" replied his wife, "Your profession, or hers?"
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Nosy little bustard isn't he?
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It's a three-holerFor family use?I seem to remember the Romans enjoyed(?) communal facilities seating up to 20 at a time.http://www.zoomnet.net/~petecol/service.html#bare
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In Oz we call Black Widow spiders Redbacks (or, by some oldsters, Jockey Spiders)- they're the same apecies as the North American one. They seem to share a similar preference for where they live in both continents. Thanks for that export America!
MAny years ago there was a song called "Redback On The Toilet Seat" that went really well on the charts. Don't remember all the words, but it started something like:
There was a redback on the toilet seat
when I was there last night,
I didn't see it in the dark,
But Christ I felt its bite!
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Saved by good old Google again...
THE REDBACK ON THE TOILET SEAT
by Slim Newton
There was a redback on the toilet seat
When I was there last night.
I didn't see him in the dark,
But boy I felt his bite.
I jumped high up into the air
And when I hit the ground,
That crafty redback spider
Wasn't nowhere to be found.
I rushed into the missus,
Told her just where I'd been bit.
She grabbed a cut-throat razor-blade
And I nearly took a fit.
I said, "Just forget what's on your mind
And call a doctor please,
'Cause I got a feeling that your cure
Is worse than the disease."
There was a redback on the toilet seat
When I was there last night.
I didn't see him in the dark,
But boy I felt his bite.
And now I'm here in hospital
A sad and sorry sight,
And I curse the redback spider
On the toilet seat last night.
I can't lie down, I can't sit up
And I don't know what to do,
And all the nurses think it's funny
But that's not my point of view.
I tell you its embarassing,
And that's to say the least,
That I'm too sick to eat a bit
While that spider had a feast.
And when I get back home again
I tell you what I'll do,
I'll make that redback suffer
For the pain I'm going through.
I've had so many needles
That I'm looking like a sieve,
And I promise you that spider
Hasn't very long to live.
There was a redback on the toilet seat
When I was there last night.
I didn't see him in the dark,
But boy I felt his bite.
But now I'm here in hospital
A sad and sorry sight,
And I curse the redback spider
On the toilet seat last night.
stales
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I've only heard outhouse used as a euphemistic rendering - the correct phrase is, indeed, sh*thouse.
However, I've never heard it used of a well-endowed woman - it's always used to refer to someone with excessive muscle development - another phrase is: "you know, big guy, muscles on his spit."
Do, or do not. There is no "try".
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the correct phrase is, indeed, sh*thouse. (my emphasis) Welcome, Yoda. If I have learnt anything on this board, it is this: there is no such thing as no such thing. There *is definitely a legitimate word 'outhouse' - it describes typically the outbuildings surrounding a courtyard in a mansion, and by extension almost any buildings subsidiary in function to a main dwelling. True, I used it here as a jokey leg-pull replacement for 'sh ithouse' - because there was an ongoing line of discussion about the proprieties of such blunt use of language. see the trouble you get me into, J?!
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mav--grr.
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alright, already! I'll ed*t th* bl**dy w*rd, w*ll th*t m*k* y** h*pp*?! *EG*
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Yeah, I know "outhouse" is a legitimate word. Perhaps "correct" was too strong a term, but in the context of that particular phrase, in approximately 40 years of my hearing/using it, the polite form has always been used with a touch of the "I'm toning this down" inflexion. Possibly it was originally "outhouse" and got changed by folk of a more robust vocabulary.
I stand by only ever having heard the phrase used in reference to a well-muscled personage, though.
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Very wise you may be, Yoda, but universal your experience is not. The meaning of built like a brick drithouse as synonym for well-muscled, despite its more sense making, have I never heard. For a well proportioned female only have I heard it.
Valued your input is, though.
This is the last time I'll talk like this, honest, guys.
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old hand
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ROFL Faldage!!
Kill me that you do!!
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mav, ahem--that grr was for your sentence in white...
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Kill me that you do!!
To AnnaStrophic am I pledged.
OK, so lie I did.
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You have to remember that I've been stuck in a shack on Dagobah for the last twenty years. BTW, I don't do the fractured grammar, or the Fozzie Bear voice. I was given this nickname by members of another forum, and I decided to use it whenever I could.
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mav, agree with you I do.
(or ought I to say instead, *gr** w*th y** I d*)
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[blue](or ought I to say instead, *gr** w*th y** I d*)[/blue]
Or, better *gr** w*th y** * d*
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a well-proportioned female, said faldage in a time long ago and a place far away.
amusing this is,
but more amusing than a female well-proportioned is it?
subject changed wisely have we?
Edit: or concepts combining are we of females constructed outhousely and inverted yoda-esquely?
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I thought you were going to introduce us to a naval concept, sailor! Oh, wait . I get it. One holer, head. Nah, better go down with the ship
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In reply to:
you could tell if it had been a very cold night because the pee would freeze.
He may not have been kidding. I remember travelling by car from Lancaster to London one very cold winter and stopping at a petrol station to fill up the petrol tank and go to the loo, and the dregs in the urinals were frozen over.
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yeah, I knew it was Jackie... so, do you think I should share who the scandalous original post to me was from? [whistling jauntily] And Yoda, I'm with you, bro - apart from some aberrent Merkin usage the BS phrase of course refers to a bruising alpha male built for battle
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I don't care, DM. [blowing kiss e] Um--let's see, I have lately posted about trays, tea breaks, and purposely/purposefully; again, what sorts of word posts is it that I "owe"? I hope you don't mean information-giving,
'cause compared to most folks here, I don't know nothin'.
Oh--just got inspired to make one--let's see, we're even in the right category. Here, we use the shortened-term "demo"
primarily to refer to things. That is, if you tell me your new car was a demo, I know it was one they had let prospective buyers drive. But a Brit-speaker friend uses it to mean people demonstrating, as in, "There was a demo near downtown this afternoon". Is that common, over there?Or even elsewhere in the U.S.?
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some aberrent Merkin usage
Keerful thar, mav. You gone is git them English school boys to gigglin agin.
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That's an interesting one Jackie. I suspect there is also an age factor at work: demo could well be 'a popular demonstration', but it is redolent of the sixties for me. Otherwise I would tend to hear it as 'a demonstration' of how something worked, an exemplar. But I'll be so glad to get the car I won't care if it's *your kind of demo and sorry I am for the other, F!
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I believe that "demo" is used to describe an audition tape made by musicians to send to prospective producers. If Musick is still around, he could advise.
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yes, that's true Bob - I used to get hundreds of tapes sent to me to audition acts for a theatre, and we always referred to them on the phone as "demos".
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Jack London, in one of his short stories, (To Build a Fire?) spoke about the cold in the yukon -- and spoke of informal thermometers, such as it being cold enough for a wad of spite to freeze into a ball before it hit the ground, or of urine freezing before it hit the ground.. maybe this belongs in the "how cold is it thread"..
and Mc Phee (First name?) a writer for The NYer, wrote about the cold of his childhood, and how once his diapered brother was frozen to the floor when he wet himself.
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Was there a "Susie" with you at the time? The "brick outhouse" comments do not seem to provide much elucidation, do they? But the meaning of the phrase "built like a brick s**t house does provoke interest, does it not, Maverick? BTW, what "bidding gadgets" were you talking about when you sent me your welcoming email. BTW, Pluto is a planet. I'm Plutarch.
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No way, dubbledub! The essence is not the *roof, pitched or otherwise: the sense of the simile lies in the solidity, in the slab-sidedness, in the sheer *mass of its BRICK contruction! It's gotta be a male thang! Hey, Plut, it was just an arch joke - and I thought you played Bridge? In answer to your query, no, I had a complete absence of Susie on my person at the time I was so accosted - I don't know Susie like my friend knows Susie. The phrase came out at me out of left field in Kentucky.
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Does this subject line worry anyone else?
OK, go murder the duke, and I'll escape to France and see what I can do to those infernal musketeers
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Now out here in Virginia, we only refer to these referenced structures as outhouses. The expletive part I've never heard in polite, country conversation. (Or impolite, come to think of it.)
To this ear, the former ("outhouse") is a polite and somewhat effete euphemism, the latter being the basic form.
Possibly WW and I differ on this because men are more given to euphemistic speech-forms when ladies, like WW, are present. ("When nature is calling, plain speaking is out / If ladies, lord love 'em, are milling about.") Perhaps this is a simple case of the familiar maxim, "Circumstances alter cusses."
"brick" __-house, implying: She's also got her feet firmly planted, if not on, in the ground. She's unshakable. ... Mae West comes to mind.
Here the analogy breaks down a bit. Mae's persona was unshakable but, unlike a brick structure, was emphatically not untippable.
In short, the name "Mae" was descriptive.
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Speaking of tippable or untippable in relation to outhouses, my father-in-law used to recall the dear old days of yore when the night before Holloween was called "mischief night" or "moving night" when all the youths in a neighborhood would participate in pranks such as unfastening the neighbors' gates and pitching them on the porch roof, taking away the ashcans, and tipping over outhouses, of which there were still plenty in back yards even in the city. They apparently used to get away with stuff that would land modern young people in reform school.
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That's cuz they didn't have reform schools in those days, BobY. A "mischief night" was just that. Mischief one night a year. Now we have muggers and miscreants running loose night and day.  "The good ole days" really were the good ole days, BobY.
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From my current reading:
[London cabbie discussing a bare-knuckle fighter] "Not that f***ing tall, mind you, but built like a brick sh**house and just as hard to move."
Brian Matthews: As the story goes [collection of his newspaper articles]. Text Publishing, Melbourne, 2001
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A "mischief night" was just that. Mischief one night a year. Now we have muggers and miscreants running loose night and day. "The good ole days" really were the good ole days
I guess if you consider a cold wooden seat on a sub-zero night and wading through the effluvia of animals that didn't have the luxury of that cold wooden seat to be "good" then maybe they were the good ole days.
Not to mention a zillion other things that contributed to an average life span of approximately 35 years.
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BTW, byb, [couldn't resist that phrase!] that's precisely why I chose the word "untippable".
Presumably everyone is familiar with the meaning of "a Mae West", using her name as a noun? (cross-thread to "products named for people")
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Presumably everyone is familiar with the meaning of "a Mae West", using her name as a noun?Funny you mentioned that, Keiva. I just learned the word "antonomasia" today, and was vaguely surprised to find that a Board search came up empty. Neat word, huh? .
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Neat word, Gia. Unfamiliar was I. How did you happen to stumble across it?
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Presumably everyone is familiar with the meaning of "a Mae West", using her name as a noun?
Um, no. Here a Mae West is usually
a) the actress
b) a small circular white cake about 3 1/2 inches in diameter x 1 inch high, covered in chocolate and filled with a creamy yellow vanilla frosting.
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old hand
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The night before Hallowe'en was called "gate-night" in Manitoba.
I also associate "built like a brick s**ithouse" with someone (male or female) who is big and muscular. It never, ever, ever occurred to me that it had a more specific anatomical connotation.
There was a store in Winnipeg called "The Brick Shirthouse". I don't know if it's still there.
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http://www.bartleby.com/61/32/A0353200.htmlBy def 2, it doesn't seem to quite fit the bill. Calling any actress (or any huskily sexy actress) a Mae West would fit, but I don't see it for a life jacket or a small circular white cake. I don't find eponomasia in the discredited AHD. Perhaps it's in the discredited OED. tsuwm?
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Faldage, i don't see it either for a small white cake, but a vest, that creates two large bulges on the chest, and you don't understand why it's called a mae west?
my condolences, AnnaS, i have my doubts about men,in general, but faldage (and most of the motely crew here) seem brighter than most.. it he doesn't get a mae west, then you sure have your work cut out for yourself. No wonder you haven't been able to post for a while!
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you don't understand why it's called a mae west?
I understand why the life vest is called a mae west. What I was *trying to say is that I don't see is calling a life vest a mae west as an example of antonomasia.
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http://www.bartleby.com/61/35/M0023500.htmlbut who is antonio? Helen, doubtless Faldage intention's vis-a-vis ASp are ... no, I'd better not!
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In reply to:
What I was *trying to say is that I don't see is calling a life vest a mae west as an example of antonomasia.
the term is new to me, but my inclination would be that "Mae West" could be considered a member of the class of "individuals or things which are or appear to be top heavy", in which case the term could be arguably be correctly applied, no? *must the most obvious class to which the personal name would be attributed be the *only class to which it can be antonomastically associated?
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http://www.bartleby.com/61/58/W0095800.htmlAnd in that movie, who was whose little chickadee? strictly honorable, I'm sure you meant to say.<http://wordsmith.org/board/images/icons/prim.gif>
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who was whose little chickadee?
Mae, oui?
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"Mae West" could be considered a member of the class of "individuals or things which are or appear to be top heavy"
Still it seems contrived to me. Consider this: if the life vest were not named after Ms. West, would you lump them together on a test asking you to group items by category?
The word is not as close as some other could be; if there is no word for the process of making an eponym there should be. If it's not eponomasia whatever it is is the word we are looking for.
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Mae, oui?
That's only half an answer, Keiva.
Unless you're saying that Mae was Oui's little chickadee.
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Consider this: if the life vest were not named after Ms. West, would you lump them together on a test asking you to group items by category?Well, if the items on the list were "Mae West, Twiggy, Venus, pencil, pear, life preserver", how would *you categorize them? Hrm, now that I've typed that i can see your point about being contrived. Nevermind. How about eponymy? Eponymy: The introduction of a new word into the language from the names of people with whom the things or practices they stand for were associated.
boycott from Capt. Charles Cunningham Boycott;
mesmerize from F. A. Mesmer Hey, check this out
Date: Tue Sep 21 02:01:30 EDT 1999
Subject: A.Word.A.Day--antonomasia
antonomasia (an-toh-noh-MAY-zhuh) noun
1. The substitution of a title or epithet for a proper name, as in
calling a sovereign "Your Majesty."
2. The substitution of a personal name for a common noun to designate a
member of a group or class, as in calling a traitor a "Benedict Arnold."
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Ye gads but you folks are all *young!
Mae West was an actress, playwriter and movie star amply endowed with a formidable bosom.
She was born in the late 1890s and was in the public eye for many years. Probably one of the earliest "Blonde Bombshells" and "sex symbol."
However, in the early years of WWII for some reason that now escapes me, Mae West had a chest Xray and the Xray was published in LIFE magazine ... Naturally the breasts' shadows were readily visible. Anyways, after the photo was published the American servicemen started calling their life vests Mae Wests. The expression spread like wildfire!
Now, checking OED it says a Mae West is an inflatabale life jacket originally issued to the Royal Air Force in 1939-1945.
That's all I got or could recall, folks.
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the American servicemen started calling their life vests Mae Wests...originally issued to the Royal Air Force in 1939-1945.
Hey, it almost kinda sorta sounds like it could've been a bit of [loose] rhyming slang (isn't that a Brit thing?) Or is rhyming slang a *new linguistic phenomenon?
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As I recall, Cockney rhyming slang is not new -- but it typically creates a one-word slang term out of a two-word phrase. (Mav perhaps can advise?) That process could not create "Mae West" out of "vest".
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Ah now I understand what you folks are saying - a Mae West is a life vest. NEVER heard that before in my life.
Mae West for cake: well, it was designed with her in mind. The yellow frosting (blond hair), white cake (for a look of purity) and chocolate covered (for the sinful side).
It is also used as a nickname for French people in Québec. On their work breaks French people will most often have "un Mae West pi un Pepsi" (a Mae West and a Pepsi). We were the biggest consumers of both these items in Canada for the longest time. So both these terms are used to describe French Québecers.
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it typically creates a one-word slang term out of a two-word phrase.
Well, not quite. The canonical process starts with a single word from which is derived a two word phrase (or two words linked with an AND) in which the second word rhymes with the one word being replaced. Then the second word of the two word phrase is dropped and the first word is used exclusively*. Example: Peaches and Cream for dream -- Oy 'ad the stryngest peaches last noight. This would result in a life vest being called a Mae. One problem here would be that I don't think the Brits would be likely to call the device in question a vest.
*This is not always the case; sometimes the whole two word phrase is used. This *would allow for the phrase Mae West to be used for vest, but see my objection above regarding use of the word vest to describe the life jacket. I also don't think that Cockney rhyming slang was a great source of military slang. But I could be wrong. I'm sure we have plenty of folks who can correct me.
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I don’t think that’s quite accurate, Keiva – I can think of plenty of examples of cockney that work the other way about, such as “apples and pears” for ‘stairs’. Like most argots, the key is to draw a line between the insiders and the outsiders. I am inclined to think you have hit the nail right on the head, sunny Gym – the original term would have been something quite pompous and officious like inflatable vest for which the subs titution of “Mae West” would have been a natural inflation. To put it in context you have only to imagine the class-ridden system of England in that time: if the educated officers introduced new equipment with a fancy name, it would be imperative for the ranks to make it their own by a linguistic twist. But Rhuby is more expert on CRS than I – come on in, Rhuby, the water’s quite buoyant!
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mav: IMHO, you're right, and I was mistaken, regarding the general structure of cockney rhyming slang. Thanks.
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Since this thread already has 146 posts(with mine), I invite everyone, free of charge, to move the discussion to Mae West and Buoyancy thread. See you there!
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To bring a few threads together on Cockney Rhyming slang. Growing up after WWII I knew that a Mae West was a life jacket, long before I knew who Mae West was, and even longer before I realised why. Life vests are invariably known as Life Jackets in UK so we are unlikely to have made the rhyming connection, though someone else might have. I agree with the bosom theory, though if they were officially known as Life Vests in the forces, then Mav could still be correct. On "taters in the mould" (reverting to UK spelling, I used a US dictionary looking up the meanings of mold/mould last time), my introduction to that and many other CRS phrases was via my father and grandfather, about 45 years ago. They were both from the East End of London, though not born within the sound of Bow Bells. And "taters in the mould" is listed in my 1969 CRS dictionary and on many Googled sites. Yoda is right that most CRS phrases have a natural rythmic feel though there are other examples of long and awkward phrases (tumble (down the sink)=drink) and of single words (Aris(totle)=bottle). Since the phrases are usually shortened, the original awkwardness doesn't matter that much. But many of the phrases sound contrived to me anyway. (Tumble down the sink, grumble and grunt yes, it's rude,..) You may be interested in this site: http://www.surflondon.co.uk/HTML/sections.php3?op=viewarticle&artid=211 which has other London slang as well. They (and other sites) mention multilevel CRS in which the original CRS word gets rerhymed. So Arse => Bottle and Glass => Bottle =>Aristotle => Aris => April in Paris => April. I have not heard that one in real life but I have heard Bottle => Aristotle => Aris => Plaster of Paris => Plaster (for drink) and could that be the derivation of Plastered for drunk? There are many CRS phrases which are in common use in UK English, most people are unaware of the origins.
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could that be the derivation of Plastered for drunk?
I like the idea Rod - we could play Six Degrees of CRS Separation!
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