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Carpal Tunnel
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Carpal Tunnel
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Good luck if you decide on ground forces, America “There are, in Afghanistan today, more than 10 million mines. They lie in fields, on mountainsides, beside roads, around the big cities, along irrigation ditches. On average, between 20 and 25 Afghan men, women and children are blown up by mines every day…/….Mr Bush's ‘crusade’' looks more than dangerous. We are now being told that the United States is no longer afraid to take casualties. America, the President says, will have to accept losses. He'd better be right.”http://news.independent.co.uk/world/asia_china/story.jsp?story=94638
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Carpal Tunnel
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Carpal Tunnel
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Here's another that looks equally legit. Looks like it's only for US'ns http://www.moveon.org/justice/
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Joined: Sep 2000
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Carpal Tunnel
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Carpal Tunnel
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That's a calm and impressive statement. More than can be said for that fine upright Christian the good reverend Jerry Falwell this week, here introduced by the editor of Vocabula Review: Next to the despicable attack against the United States, perhaps the most hateful, unspeakable act against all of us was the words spoken by Reverend Jerry Falwell:
‘The abortionists have got to bear some burden for this because God will not be mocked. And when we destroy 40 million little innocent babies, we make God mad. I really believe that the pagans, and the abortionists, and the feminists, and the gays and the lesbians who are actively trying to make that an alternative lifestyle, the ACLU, People for the American Way, all of them who have tried to secularize America, I point the finger in their face and say, "You helped this happen." ‘
Let us all, especially now, speak thoughtfully and write carefully.http://www.vocabula.com/#Sept01sstopHear, hear to that plea for calm sense.
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Pooh-Bah
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Pooh-Bah
Joined: Mar 2001
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Jackie,
I don't understand (literally) the third paragraph of the petition proper. Gloss, please?
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Joined: Dec 2000
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Carpal Tunnel
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Carpal Tunnel
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Innocent civilians living within any nation that may be found responsible, in part or in full, for the crimes recently perpetrated against the United States, must not bear any responsibility for the actions of their government, and must therefore be guaranteed safety and immunity from any military or judicial action taken against the state in which they reside.
The phrase "that may be found responsible..." in the first line refers to the nations not the civilians, who may or may not have an active hand in choosing their leadership. The rest of the sentence, the part following "...against the United States" refers to the civilians. Does that clear anything up?
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Pooh-Bah
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Pooh-Bah
Joined: Mar 2001
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Yes, thank you, Faldage. It begins to. But I wonder if I might beg your further indulgence, I am finding this kind of reading very difficult this week: Would you mind just paraphrasing it for me. I think I would like to sign.
Thanks,
IP
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Carpal Tunnel
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Carpal Tunnel
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Disclaimer: The following is my take and is not meant to be a definitive analysis of the petition.
Para 1:
Use judicial means before attempting brute force.
Para 2:
Don't equate national governments with terrorists groups existing within national boundaries. Don't blame the govenments without producing convincing evidence of active cooperation.
Para 3:
Don't equate civilians with governments; don't blame or punish civilians for the actions of the governments
Para 4:
No Nukes. No Biological weapons. No Chemical weapons.
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Joined: Jul 2000
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Carpal Tunnel
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Carpal Tunnel
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"Innocent civilians living within any nation that may be found responsible, in part or in full, for the crimes recently perpetrated against the United States, must not bear any responsibility for the actions of their government, and must therefore be guaranteed safety and immunity from any military or judicial action taken against the state in which they reside."
So, when the terrorists use innocent civilians as shields, we just turn around and walk away rather than assaulting their barricades. When the military units that actively supported the terrorists attack our forces, driving before them hundreds or thousands of innocent civilians, we either turn tail and run or just surrender gracefully, saying just before our mass executions, "We are SO sorry we bothered you. Please torture us before you hang us, and make sure our genitals are firmly lodged in our throats."
This makes such perfect sense to me. The terrorists used more than 5000 of our innocent civilians as shock absorbers to stop the civilian planes loaded with our civilians which were aimed at our hearts.
Look at our Constitution -- what are the first three words? WE, THE PEOPLE. WE are the government of the United States. WE gave our various state, local, and national leaders all the power they have. Not one government in the world could hold power if its people did not actively or passively permit it. It takes live bodies to run a government. It takes grass roots support.
Look back at the apologists who said in Germany, "We had no idea that evil bastard was killing 6 million Jews." Bullshit. The people of Germany voted Hitler into power. Every person who voted for him knew what his feelings about Jews were.
Yes, I know that the totalitarian regimes in Syria, Libya, North Korea, Afghansitan, Iraq, Iran, even Saudi Arabia hold power basically at the point of a gun. But if enough of the people want the murdering rampages to stop they will stop, even if it means because all of the regime's efforts go into putting down internal strife.
Harsh as it is, we must and we will protect ourselves.
TEd
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Carpal Tunnel
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Carpal Tunnel
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I'm not a great signer of petitions, especially ones which say something along the lines of "this petition demands that the tide will not rise and fall tomorrow". Cnuts to that.
So, when the terrorists use innocent civilians as shields, we just turn around and walk away rather than assaulting their barricades. When the military units that actively supported the terrorists attack our forces, driving before them hundreds or thousands of innocent civilians, we either turn tail and run or just surrender gracefully, saying just before our mass executions, "We are SO sorry we bothered you. Please torture us before you hang us, and make sure our genitals are firmly lodged in our throats."
W-e-e-e-l-l, I don't think that American forces will be that nice. From memory, they weren't in Vietnam. In fact, worrying about collateral damage in achieving (or failing to achieve) an objective has never appeared to be a major and high-priority component of American military procedure once the battle has started and the bullets, flamethrowers, iron bombs, chemical agents, napalm, air-fuel cells, shells, shrapnel and claymore mines have started flying. Unless, of course, there are TV cameras around.
The idiot also known as Capfka ...
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