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I received the following via mail and thought it might interest you lot. Any opinions?
Wow, it seems a lot of you had your own opinions of where the F**K word came from. Many of you agreed with Jeff's definition. However, even more of you disagreed. The hands down winner was..For Unlawful Carnal Knowledge. Works for me.
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"I'm replying about this fact and the true background history of the word f*ck. This fact is indeed false. If people in olden days (I think around the 18th century or something of that nature) would accused or found guilty of adultery, they were put in the stocks. Above their heads was written For Unlawful Carnal Knowledge. It later became abbreviated as f*uck later on. Thank you.
~Kyrstyne Thomas
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#5 IS COMPLETE NONSENSE:
The word is derived from the Danish word "fokken" to breed cattle and Swedish "fokka" to copulate.
Jeesh! Some people will fall for anything.
-C.C.
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I have had classes on ren history and in truth yes the F-word does mean Fornication Under Consent of the King, but it was ingraved in the entry ways of brothels, it ment that the brothel was legal and paid taxes. Henry the 8th made prostitution legal and taxed it in order to make more money.
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Number 5 is total B.S. Fuck defrived from the Greman word FLickin. it means something like ouch or damnit... but thats story is a load of internet crap that has no reliable source. anyway this newsletter is cool bye
~Ben
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Actually the word "fuck" has nothing to do with Kings or their consent to have sex. Fuck is an Old English word which means "to sow a seed" (as in farming). "To sow" means to scatter seeds, similar to the process of a male ejaculating in to a female.
Man you get a lot of idiots that send you false information.
Best of luck,
-ihateriido
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and the definitive response on the "F" word......
Popular etymologies agree, unfortunately incorrectly, that this is an acronym meaning either Fornication Under Consent of the King or For Unlawful Carnal Knowledge. The latter usually accompanying a story about how medieval prisoners were forced to wear this word on their clothing.
Deriving the etymology of this word is difficult, as it has been under a taboo for most of its existence and citations are rare. The earliest known use, according to American Heritage and Lighter, predates 1500 and is from a poem written in a mix of Latin and English and entitled 'Flen flyys.' The relevant line reads:
"Non sunt in celi quia fuccant uuiuys of heli." Translated: "They [the monks] are not in heaven because they fuck the wives of Ely [a town near Cambridge]." The word was not in common (published) use prior to the 1960s.
Shakespeare did not use it, although he did hint at it for comic effect. In Merry Wives of Windsor (IV.i) he gives us
the pun "focative case." In Henry V (IV.iv), the character Pistol threatens to "firk" a French soldier, a word meaning
"to strike," but commonly used as an Elizabethan euphemism for fuck. In the same play (III.iv), Princess Katherine confuses the English words "foot" and "gown" for the French "foutre" and "coun" (fuck and cunt, respectively) with comic results. Other poets did use the word, although it was far from common. Robert Burns, for example, used it in an unpublished manuscript.
The taboo was so strong that for 170 years, from 1795 to 1965, fuck did not appear in a single dictionary of the English language. In 1948, the publishers of The Naked and the Dead persuaded Norman Mailer to use the euphemism "fug" instead, resulting in Dorothy Parker's comment upon meeting
Mailer: "So you're the man who can't spell fuck."
The root is undoubtedly Germanic, as it has cognates in other Northern
>European languages: Middle Dutch
>fokken meaning to thrust, to copulate with; dialectical Norwegian fukka meaning to copulate; and dialectical Swedish focka meaning to strike, push, copulate, and fock meaning penis.
Both French and Italian have similar words, foutre and fottere respectively. These derive from the Latin futuere.
While these cognates exist, they are probably not the source of fuck, rather they probably come from a common root. Most of the early known usages of the English word come from Scotland, leading some scholars to believe
that the word comes from Scandinavian sources. Others disagree, believing that the number of northern citations reflects that the taboo was weaker in Scotland and the north, resulting in more surviving usages. The fact that there are citations, albeit fewer of them, from southern England dating from the same period seems to bear out this latter theory.
There is also an elaborate explanation that has been circulating on the internet for some years regarding
English archers, the Battle of Agincourt, and the phrase Pluck Yew! This explanation is a modern jest--a play on words. However, there may be a bit of truth to it. The British (it's virtually unknown in America) gesture of displaying the index and middle fingers with the back of the hand outwards (a reverse peace sign)--meaning the same as displaying the middle finger alone--may derive from the French practice of cutting the fingers off captured English
archers. Archers would taunt the French on the battlefield with this gesture, showing they were intact and still
dangerous. The pluck yew part is fancifully absurd. This is not the origin of the middle finger gesture, which is truly ancient, being referred to in classical Greek and Roman texts.
For more information on fuck and its usages, see The F
Word , by Jesse Sheidlower, Random House, 1999, ISBN
0-375-70634-8. This is perhaps the most comprehensive
treatment of the word available.
~Carole
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Ansd what says the OED etymology?
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>what says the OED etymology?
in the interests of effing completeness, here it is:
[Early mod.E fuck, fuk, answering to a ME. type *fuken (wk. vb.) not found; ulterior etym. unknown. Synonymous G. ficken cannot be shown to be related.]
For centuries, and still by the great majority, regarded as a taboo-word; until recent times not often recorded in print but frequent in coarse speech.
a1503 Dunbar Poems lxxv. 13 Be his feiris he wald haue fukkit. 1535 Lyndesay Satyre 1363 Bischops+may fuck thair fill and be vnmaryit....[etc]
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they probably come from a common rootIndeed® And interesting to see the Bishops were ever thus 
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the Bishops were ever thus
Notoriously so; hence often the butt of limericks (e.g., There once were two ladies from Birmingham ... )
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So whence the euphemisms frig, friggin', and frickin' (or fricking)?...any others I missed?
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...any others I missed?
firkin'
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...any others I missed?Thanks, Keiva! I also forgot freakin'. Anything on these substitute "effers", tsuwm?
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occasionally I hear frappin'
frap, coincidentally (or not), means to strike, to beat
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'Fudge' is a common alternative too. > frap Mmmmm... Frappe. The Greeks certainly know how to make an iced-coffee. How Star Bucks came up with Frappacino is beyond me! Perhaps a churlish attempt to 'bond European cultures' .
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In my mother's idiolect, "frickin-frackin" is used particularly when she's only jokingly angry. 
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"Firkin'" is actually a unit of measure. I mean, it must be. After all, things are always too firkin' big or too firkin' small or too firkin' far away.
The idiot also known as Capfka ...
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firkin
I've always heard it as frickin'.
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a unit of measure, equal to 1/4 barrel or 9 gallonsHence the devoted staff behind the counter being traditionally referred to at closing time as drunken firkin bar stewards 
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A firkin is indeed a unit of measure, equal to 1/4 barrel or 9 gallons.Thanks Bingley. I wonder why I already knew that? Can you just imagine saying "too nine-gallons big" or "too nine-gallons too high"? Or in the case of beer, "too nine-gallons little"?
The idiot also known as Capfka ...
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"too nine-gallons big" or "too nine-gallons too high"? Or in the case of beer, "too nine-gallons little"?
Or "he went the whole nine-gallons"!
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CK wonders, misguidedly I wonder why I already knew that?
mtywtk,ial [more than you wanted to know, in all liklihood]
Casks are traditionally made from European oak or more commonly nowadays from stainless steel or aluminium. They have an opening at the front (approximately 25 mm diameter) for attachment of a tap and a second opening (shive hole) at the top (approximately 50 mm diameter) through which the beer is racked into the cask. The front opening is stopped with a wooden or plastic plug (the keystone). Similarly, the shive hole is plugged with a shive. Both keystone and shive contain central knockout sections. The cask also comes with a hard peg known as a hard spile and a soft peg known as a soft spile. Traditional cask sizes are derived from the 36 gallon barrel. They are:*
4.5 gallons - Pin
9 gallons - Firkin
18 gallons - Kilderkin (Kil or Kiln)
27 gallons - Half-hogshead
36 gallons - Barrel
54 gallons - Hogshead
*I'd quote my source, but I have no idea where I got this, I LIU when I got a question about hogshead...
the worthless word for the day is: hogshead
choose one (or more):
a) a large barrel
b) 3 kilderkins
c) 6 firkins
d) 12 pins
e) 2 half-hogsheads
f) something totally unrelated to a cask
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>The front opening is stopped with a wooden or plastic plug (the keystone). Similarly, the shive hole is plugged with a shive.
Not a bung in a bunghole??? How interesting.
TEd
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So now, I'm wondering about the etymology of "hogshead." FWIW Department: Webster's says that hogsheads are "any of various units of volume or capacity ranging from 63 to 140 gallons, ... esp. a unit of capacity used in liquid measure in the United States, equal to 63 gallons." And a source previously cited by tsuwm mentions 100-gallon hogsheads. http://wordsmith.org/board/showthreaded.pl?Cat=&Board=miscellany&Number=26394 By those standards, the aforementioned 54-gallon hogsheads seem to be more like pigletpates.
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wondering about the etymology of "hogshead."
Isn't that just like this bunch? Start off with a nice decent thread about feelthy words and it degenerates into some kind of vulgar discussion of etymology!
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and going down.....
gallon 128 oz
1/2 gallon 64 oz
quart 32 oz
pint 16 oz
1/2 pint 8 oz
gill 4 oz
1/2 gill 2 oz
gill like Jill.. but gill and half gill are almost never used.. except in old irish bars-- where 1/2 gill is a shot-- and gill is full double.. (as opposed to a standard double, which is just 3 oz.)--or at least that is the only place i have heard the word.
these being US measurement, not imperial ones..
does anyone know the scale for dry measure-- today portland cement is sold (US) in 90lb bags-- or half barrels. leading me to guess that 180 lbs is a full barrel-- but i presume that the barrel is really a volume measurement, and the 90lb is specific to portland cement--from someone, who in her time, has done way too much masonary work
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>Not a bung in a bunghole??? How interesting.
good catch, teD -- it's seemingly a Britishism for bung:
3. A thin, flat cork used for stopping a wide-mouthed bottle; also, a thin wooden bung for casks. [dictionary.com]
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an other thought-- the defination talks of casks-- and the various sizes, including barrel..
but now days, if i saw a wooden container, with straight, or slightly bowed sides, bound with hoops-- i would, no matter what its size, call it a barrel-- barrels are quite common in NY-- our water supply is for the most part, gravity feed, the water pressure is sufficient to get water up 65 to 70 feet (or about 6 floors) Building taller than that all have water barrel on the roof for counter pressure.. Usually these barrels are 500 gallon range.. they are such a common part of the NY skyline most NY don't even think about why the exist..
i never thing of a barrel as a quantity- i think of a barrel as a thing.
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another prevalent container in the US, particularly in the miliary-industrial complex, is the 55-gallon drum. I'll never forget the first letter I got from my buddy who went to Viet Nam in '67 -- it went something like this.... http://members.sitegadgets.com/kolsun/story.html
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For more measurement information than you really need, try this URL: http://www.entisoft.com/Library/Entisoft/Web_Site/Original/esunitsi.htmA unit I didn't see mentioned is Jereboam. I found three different definitions, here is one: A "jeroboam" (jereboam is a misprint) is a wine bottle that holds about 4/5 of a gallon.
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>
but now days, if i saw a wooden container, with straight, or slightly bowed sides, bound with hoops-- i would, no matter what its size, call it a barrel-- barrels are
quite common in NY-- our water supply is for the most part, gravity feed, the water pressure is sufficient to get water up 65 to 70 feet (or about 6 floors) Building
taller than that all have water barrel on the roof for counter pressure.. Usually these barrels are 500 gallon range.. they are such a common part of the NY skyline
most NY don't even think about why the exist..
i never thing of a barrel as a quantity- i think of a barrel as a thing.
of:
That's interesting. I had heard some years ago that antiquated building codes in NY required the big barrels on top of low and medium-rise buildings as fire department reservoirs. Can't remember where, but in this discussion there was a "revelation" that there are more coopers in NY than anyplace else in the country.
Having been a firefighter I have some knowledge of hydraulics. If you have a certain height the water goes to from the gravity pressure, you would need to pump it higher than that to get it into the cisterns on the roof. Then the cisterns would have to feed ALL of the building, otherwise the higher head in the cistern would push all the water down to the gravity head level.
Ted
TEd
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There's also a methuselah, which is a wine bottle holding approximately 6.5 quarts (a bit over a gallon and a half). I assume this is the American not the British quarts and gallons. I also found this at a web site: A magnum of wine is two quarts; a tappit-hen of wine or rum is a double magnum; a jeroboam of wine or rum is a double “tappit-hen”; and a rehoboam (q.v.) is a double jeroboam. http://www.bartleby.com/81/17518.html And this from yet another web site (and this one agrees with my memory about other sizes of bottles): Bottle sizes can also vary: Applying generally to wines other than Champagne: split 187.5 ml 1/2 bottle 375 ml (aka Fillette) bottle 750 ml magnum 1.5 liter (2 bottles) Marie-Jeanne 2.25 liters (3 bottles) (Red Bordeaux) double magnum 3 liters (4 bottles) jeroboam 4.5 liters (6 bottles) imperial 6 liters (8 bottles) Applying to Champagne: split 200 ml 1/2 bottle 375 ml pint 400 ml bottle 800 ml Magnum 1.5 liter (2 bottles) Jeroboam 3 liters (4 bottles) (& Burgundy) Rehoboam 4.5 liters (6 bottles) (& Burgundy) Methuselah 6 liters (8 bottles) (& Burgundy) Salmanazar 9 liters (12 bottles) Balthazar 12 liters (16 bottles) Nebuchadnezzar 15 liters (20 bottles) http:////216.254.0.2/~winepage/cellar/codedfaq.html#2.9
TEd
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Thanks TEd-- i didn't know all the details-- but yes, there is a pump to bring the water up to what ever height, and fill the barrel and keeps the water flowing. but our 100+ year old water works are still pretty spectacular-- and our water quality is one of the best in the nation, and with out any real treatment ( a bit of filtering, and a modest amount of chlorine) exceeds EPA water quality standards.. i love ny water, and have taken tours of the ny water works.. both supply side and (Ugh!) waste side treatment plants.
and yes, i have heard the same bit of trivia about NYC having more coopers than the rest of the country-- another reason is, until a few years ago, brooklyn was the largest wine producing county in the state-- which always surprised people, who expected some county up in the finger lakes area to lead the pack (and one does now, but i don't know which--Faldage might, since he is up that way)
Manashevits (that spelling looks wrong.. i am sure its wrong-i'll look it up and come back and edit.) the kosher food company, used to make all of its kosher wine in a winery in brooklyn--making Kings County NY the large wine producing county in the state.. they used a few barrels, too.
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[Edgar Bergen]
Origins A Short Etymological Dictionary of Modern English:
hogshead (a hog's head, prob from shape)
Etymological Dictionary of the English Language:
HOGSHEAD, ... Certainly derived from ME. hogges hed, "hog's head" [duh]; a fanciful name, of which the origin is not known; ... Hence were borrowed MDan. hogshoved, a hog's head, modified into Dan. oxehoved, as if it meant "ox-head;" Low G. hukeshovet, a hogshead (Lubben); also Swed. oxhufvud, a hogshead, lit. "ox-head;" G. oxhoft, a hogshead; Du. oxhooft.'
and Horsefeathers & Other Curious Words, Charles Funk:
hogshead For six hundred years, at least, this measure of liquid capacity has been in our language (and taken into other Teutonic languages, with hog sometimes changed to bull or ox), but as yet the mystery of its source or a plausible reason for the name remains unsolved. One guess, quoted by the learned W.W. Skeat, is that the earliest cooper of these casks of two-barrel size branded his product with the outlines of the head of a hog or of an ox. But Skeat also says that most of the conjectural sources are "silly." And I have nothing to add to that.
[/Edgar Bergan]
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I liked Edgar Bergen best when he was a ventriloquist.
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>I liked Edgar Bergen best when he was a ventriloquist.
That's easy for YOU to say.
Mortimer Snerd
TEd
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I liked Edgar Bergen best when he was a ventriloquist.
That's easy for YOU to say.
Mortimer Snerd
No dummies allowed here, Snerd.
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"No dummies allowed here, Snerd."
Don't try telling that to Charlie McCarthy!
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veteran
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[Charlie to W.C. Fields]: Mr. Fields, is that your nose or are you eating a tomato?
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W.C.Fields had a classic case of rhinophyma. Excessive consumption of alcohol is thought to be one of the causes, and Fields was said to have a spectacular intake of ethanol. J.P. Morgan was similarly afflicted, but his alcohol intake was apparently not excessive. With proper care such disfigurement should not occur.The
Fields anecdote I like best is the one about his very impressive vaudeville pool shooting act getting laughs in the wrong places, until he got suspicious and discovered Ed Wynne hiding under the table pantomiming to the audience. Fields applied the butt of the cuestick to Wynne's head and resumed his performance unruffled. The audience loved it, and mangement wanted to make it a regular act, but understandably Wynne declined.
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Ah! Nothin' like a good crap-burn...eh, tsuwm? (the Nam site)
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Faldage says: Isn't that just like this bunch? Start off with a nice decent thread about feelthy words and it degenerates into some kind of vulgar discussion of etymology!
Does this thread need "obscene language alert"? We do seem to have gotten off the subject.
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OK, I'll drag it back with my favoutite WC Fields anecdote Offered a scotch polluted with water, he snorted in outrage: "Water? WATER?! Never touch the stuff - fish fuck in it!"
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I am unable to think of any fish that copulate. However they surely do defecate. And the seagulls.......I used to live near a public water supply. The Water Department employees used to get nasty about people even parking beside the road on a causeway that crossed it. Once when they ordered me to leave, I pointed to the macadam surfaced road which was snow white with seagull poop, and asked why they didn't put diapers on the seagulls.
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I believe flippin' was omitted from the F-word stand-in list...which also brings up the term flippin' the bird/flip the bird, our friendly North Jersey/ New York road salutation...how'd that start meanin' the middle-finger gesture anyway, folks?
And, yeah, Dr. Bill, if it weren't for all the flippin' tourists feeding the flippin' seagulls like a bunch of flippin' idiots every flippin' season, the birds wouldn't swarm and dump their flippin' poop over every-flippin'-thing!
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My favorite seagull story is about a rich idiot who had a bunch of his employees bring him their legal bushel of herring, which he wanted to use to enrich his sandy seaside lawn. I waked by a tremendous screaming of seagulls at about 5 AM Sunday morning, and drove toward the source of the noise. When I got there there were hundreds of seagulls fighting over the partially buried chunks of fish which the roto-tiller had been unable to cover. They were dropping pieces on the neighbors roofs and putting white polka dots on all the roof shingles. I'm sure the HomeOwners Association said some unkind things to the perpertrator.
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So, does anyone have any other names for a bar or a cake of soap?
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Dear Consuelo: I am suspicious you are looking for a king size soap bar to wash some mouths out with.
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Joined: Jun 2001
Posts: 2,636
Carpal Tunnel
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Carpal Tunnel
Joined: Jun 2001
Posts: 2,636 |
Na, not really, it's just that the water was there.....
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