Having been travelling across the US (in both directions), Sandra and I have noticed one very interesting linguistic trait. It's s-o-o-o-o important, I thought I'd better get your take(s) on it.
When you say "thank you" in restaurants or shops in the west, the instant response from service industry people is "You're welcome". As we move further east, this is gradually being replaced by "Mmmm - mmmm". Yesterday in Arkansas, it was about 50/50.
Any thoughts? Is everyone in the east totally syllabically challenged?
I have heard "Mmm-Hmm" as an alternative to "you're welcome," but the traditional "you're welcome" is usually the rule here in Vermont, anyway. A friend visiting from NYC last weekend was taken aback when the drive-thru attendant at a fast-food place said "you're welcome" as we pulled away. He nearly fainted when I told him that the people who work at the Department of Motor Vehicles are courteous and helpful.
Actually, NY's DMV had gotten to be very nice-- fast, effecient service.. (no thank you's yet-- but in and out in under 30 minutes-- and i don't need a thank you.. )It used to take days to get new plates or a driver licence. Really, more than once, i had to make 2 trips to get something done--combine that with travel time, and a 1 to 2 hour wait on line.. it was days.
But the Parking Violations is still g** awful! and should you ever get your car towed-- well, when you die, you will go straight on to heaven-- since you will have already serverd time in HELL!
Actually, NY's DMV had gotten to be very nice-- fast, effecient service.. (no thank you's yet-- but in and out in under 30 minutes-- and i don't need a thank you.. )It used to take days to get new plates or a driver licence. Really, more than once, i had to make 2 trips to get something done--combine that with travel time, and a 1 to 2 hour wait on line.. it was days.
But the Parking Violations is still g** awful! and should you ever get your car towed-- well, when you die, you will go straight on to heaven-- since you will have already served time in HELL!
In N.H. you hear "you're welcome" or sometimes just "welcome." In Maine I have heard the ubiquitous "Ay-yuh" as a recognition of your thanks. Alert Those not born to the use and the many inflections for the varied meanings of Ay-yuh should not attempt to use it!
Around here, if someone was thanking you perfunctorily, you'd always say 'you're welcome', but if the person was expressing sincere gratitude (eg: Thanks for picking me up; i really appreciate it) the more common response would be "No worries" (or "No problem").
"Any thoughts? Is everyone in the east totally syllabically challenged?"
Dear CK Having spent most of my life in small town New England, my impression is that the behaviour to which you refer is a fairly typical tendency to laconicism.
if the person was expressing sincere gratitude (eg: Thanks for picking me up; i really appreciate it) the more common response would be "No worries" or "No problem". Re sincere gratitude : In response : "No problem" ... or "Not a bit of it" ... or "Don't be silly" ... or "My pleasure" ... or "Think nothing of it."
Northern English dialect has a similar use of Aye to signify assent - but it also has a range of inflections that carry a host of sub-texts inside them.
I have inherited the Home-Counties-cum-West-Country affirmative form of, "Oh-arr" (the further West you go, the more "rrrrr"s there are - and the longer the "Oh" lasts!) which also has a range of tonal values corresponding to different meanings.
Come to thnink of it, you can say, "yes" in a whole range of ways,can't you?
I regret to say that more and more around here, you hear "No problem" as a perfunctory response to "Thank you" instead of the traditional "You're welcome". This is mostly from young people working as checkout clerks, or at fast food outlets, snowball stands, etc. I hate it.
CapK, when you reach the Southeast you'll see both "You're welcome" and "Mmm-hmmm" still in use but increasingly supplanted by "Y'all come back now, y'heah?"* Also notice a lot more use of "sir" and "ma'am."
Bobyb regrets to say that more and more around here, you hear "No problem" as a perfunctory response to "Thank you" instead of the traditional "You're welcome". This is mostly from young people working as checkout clerks, or at fast food outlets, snowball stands, etc. I hate it.
I hate "no problem" as much as I do "Enjoy!" And when a waitron comes to take your plate but first asks, "Are you still working on that?" I want to stand up and scream, "this is not work!!"
My first encounter with "No problem" was in an article in Reader's Digest many years ago. The author heard a young man asked to do something that was going to require his making a considerable effort. His reponse was "No problem" a suffiently gracious response that it prompted the article. Unfortunately like so many once gracious reponses it has been overworked.
Another common expression in lieu of "you're welcome" in the tri-state area of my formative experience (NJ, NY, PA) is "aw, don't even think about it!"
Come to thnink of it, you can say, "yes" in a whole range of ways,can't you?
This brings to mind the (possibly apocryphal) story of an eminent professor of linguistics who at some learned gathering or other read a complex paper describing how although many languages were known where two negative words in a sentence made a positive statement, no example had ever been found of a language where two positives made a sentence negative. When he finished, and before the moderator could ask for questions, a voice was heard from the assembled lesser lights standing at the back of room: "yeah, yeah."
"So's to be up and about." ___________________________________ And if you visit "Down Maine," you may be asked : "Do you think they'll have it?" My favorite answer : "Looks like it ...saw them with the rope."
Care to jump in ? The question is (ambiguosness encouraged) "Do you think they'll have it?"
Likewise "Can I ask you a question?" to which I always want to scream "You just did, idiot!" or "No! No! No! You cannot ask me a question, ever! Ha!" By the way, this particular waste of linguistic breath seems to usually be a New York City thang.hi, of troy
Edit: Why did the font size change in the middle of this post?
I used to spend a lot of time in bookstores, seldom with any clearcut idea of what I wanted. So there was no way a salesperson, no matter how well motivated could help me, no way I tell him anything except: "I'm just browsing, thanks."
WhitmanO'Niell thinks "Can I ask you a question?" is a particular waste of linguistic breath.
I agree that on paper, this phrase does look absurd. In fact, in real life, it is strange to hear that and really think about it. That it is a waste of breath? Hmmm.
I'm a big fan of H. P. Grice and his maxims for successfuly negoiating discourse. English speakers typically avoid confrontation and over-directness by saying things like "It's cold in here" to prompt us to close the door. Following Grice's maxim of relevance, we link the two together and understand the implicit request.
"Can I ask you a question" gives the listener an opportunity to signal that he is not currently interested in talking. I consider it a polite introduction rather than a waste of breath. Now let me ask you a question...Oh, you are leaving. I guess you must be busy...
The only times I remember this word being used "properly" was when the prescriptive grammarians were exhorting us to use it properly (but *not when they were using it in normal discourse) and in the children's game Mother, May I.
" Can I ask you a question?" Of course you can since your vocal apparatus is working. But that does not mean I need take the trouble to answer you. Perhaps a bit of courtesy might motivate me to answer.
Courtesy begets courtesy. Those who scorn courtesy need not expect to be shown courtesy. Unless one chooses to condescend to the ignorant. Sometimes I do, but sometimes I do not.
Courtesy begets courtesy. Those who scorn courtesy need not expect to be shown courtesy. Unless one chooses to condescend to the ignorant. Sometimes I do, but sometimes I do not.
Hope I fit in your second category, Dr Bill in ignorant bliss
Dear AnnaStrophic: I am not sure how you numbered the categories. Outside of our different views of what is appropriate for Miscellany, and my occasional lapses into ribaldry, I hope I have not given you offense.
Ha! Until I got to post 20-odd in this thread I started so casually, I thought that the thread might stay on topic. Thanks for ensuring that my expectations of it wobbling off course were met so promptly!
Ha! Until I got to post 20-odd in this thread I started so casually, I thought that the thread might stay on topic. Thanks for ensuring that my expectations of it wobbling off course were met so promptly!
We're all ignorant about something, Dr. Bill. We all learned our language initially (and at a level that we may even call instinctive) from listening to others using it, in the earliest stages, mostly our parents. If they had used may instead of can in the context of asking permission they wouldn't have had to berate us about our so-called misuse of the terms later. I think that treating a simple request to interrupt one's privacy for the purpose of getting what may well be critical information as a discourtesy is indicative of a greater discourtesy. Think of people's intent and don't hold them to standards that have slipped years ago. I could accept regarding "Hey pops! Tell me something." as being discourteous, but not "Can I ask you a question?"
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in ignorant bliss
