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journeyman
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journeyman
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Ha, it is probably the only time all provinces agree on something. (inside joke for Canadians)I don't think I agree with that.  Ali
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Carpal Tunnel
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So far Nick, your explaination make the most sense to-- but durative? I would have thought it was a gerund--
I lit the lamp at the door, and it the lighted the way up the stairs to the door.
(but i might have used illuminated-- but as i say it, its sounds, oh i don't know, overdone? to fancy a word?)
So now enlighten me, how is durative different from a gerund? (do gerunds have to end in ing-- and lighting-- the lighting in the room was harsh-- well that not a gerund...its a noun... so what is the gerund form of light? (I am at a loss-- can lighting be used as verb? I can't think of a sentance right now...)
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Anonymous
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I'd forgotten all about the term "gerunds".
Would an example of lighting as a gerund would be something like a decription of the traditional candle lighting ceremony in a Christian wedding? "The lighting of the unity candle represents a joining of the two"
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Carpal Tunnel
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Carpal Tunnel
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ger·und
ger·und (jĕr'ənd)
n. (Abbr. ger.) Grammar.
In Latin, a noun derived from a verb and having all case forms except the nominative.
In other languages, a verbal noun analogous to the Latin gerund, such as the English form ending in -ing when used as a noun, as in singing in We admired the choir's singing.
ge·run'di·al (jə-rŭn'dç-əl) adj.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
The American Heritage® Dictionary of the English Language, Third Edition Copyright © 1992, 1996 by Houghton Mifflin Company. All rights reserved.
But isn't it a bit more complicated in actual English (rather than the Let's-Pretend-It's-Really-Latin of so many prescriptivists)? Surely lighting is a gerundial form of a word that was originally a noun that was then verbed...
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veteran
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veteran
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Mav's question about gerunds
OfTroy -- aren't you glad you asked? I gather that "durative" is a verb tense used in Asiatic languages which has no real counterpart in Indo-European languages (except maybe the aorist tenses in classical Greek).
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Carpal Tunnel
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Thanks Mav, but i would say agerund is a verb that expresses a continuing state of being--
as I can't go fishing today, I didn't go fishing yesterday, and i won't go fishing tomorrow-- our favorite fishing hole has a new sign-- No Fishing
No Fishing means no fishing now, and no fishing tomorrow, no fishing ever-- a continues state of being--
but in i won't go fishing today-- fishing is not gerund--since it is limited to "today"
So, yeah, the idea of lighting a candle of unity to commemerate joining (joined today, joined tomorrow, joined forever)-- a continues state of being! is a gerund.
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>Surely lighting is a gerundial form of a word that was originally a noun that was then verbed
Seems very convoluted. Can you give me more examples. Would the same be true for bat, batting, batting?
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fishing is not gerund--since it is limited to "today"My understanding is that a gerund is a word that has the quality of a verbal noun. In other words, it is a name for describing the state of doing something. So I would have figured: A fish = noun (name of an object/animal) To fish = verb (formed from the elided concept of ‘catching a fish’) Fishing = gerund (the continuing action of the verb-from-the-noun) That would have led me to find no difference between your two examples of ‘fishing’ – but I think it does still get something of your idea of an ongoing action, doesn’t it? (and BTW good for you with your outlook on teaching yourself – that’s just what I’m doing here!)And belM, yes, though my initial way of trying to get at this way in which we stretch one form of word into another form was convoluted, I do think bat and batting is just the same. You could trace the same effect anytime a verb has been formed from the name of an object: say, root - rooting, shoe - shoeing, ball -
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Well it Bel, bat, batting, batting works for that stuff you do with a balls, in sports arenas.. but since i am not a sports fan, when i first read it-- i was puzzled-- and a quick glance and M-W 10th didn't help--since it only gives bat/batting as some thing done in a ball field (or seperately as an mammal)
(tsuwm-- oh, wondererous one with the OED handy, please help on this!)
to me Bat is a roll of wool-- and batting is a soft mat of wool (well, acutally now, poly fil, though i do have 1 wool quilt). It is the stuff that gets stuffed into the middle of a quilt! and it never gets made into a verb-- one never bats a quilt with batting-- and quilts are never batting! (but they do contain batting)
you begin to see just how strange i am-- a three letter word, taught in a primer- and i get it wrong-- or at least different! i am sure that i learned bat (as in baseball bat) first, and later at some point in my life bat (as in a roll of wool) later became the primary defination.
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I think one of the lovely things, Helen, about the conversations on this board is that it allows us all to consider how 'strange' we each are - unique in our similarity, or vice versa! I like this a lot; never visit here without learning something (even bloody recipes !)
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