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stranger
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I have been wondering about the story of an expedition hurrying through Africa, whose bearers one day refuse to move, They are, they say, "waiting for their souls to catch up."
Do any of y'all happen to know where this story or expression come from? They sure do capture some wisdom.
--------- My Novels and Poetry (Romance! Theology! Tantra! and an occasional recipe) http://btwreviews.com
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It's the African way to have jetlag since even before airplanes were invented.
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wow. what a great phrase! we could all use a little of that, I think.
formerly known as etaoin...
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Yes, I've read that idea too; maybe also it was a scene from a movie, but I don't think it should be considered as an expression or story. It is a fact. I wasn't trying to be funny with my reply. There is a resemblance between out jetlag and this idea of letting the soul catch up with the body. Edit: It's a story that just runs along world wide and must be based on facts. "In the deep jungles of Africa, a traveler was making a long trek. Coolies had been engaged from a tribe to carry the loads. The first day they marched rapidly and went far. The traveler had high hopes of a speedy journey. But the second morning these jungle tribesmen refused to move. For some strange reason they just sat and rested. On inquiry as to the reason for this strange behavior, the traveler was informed that they had gone too fast the first day, and that they were now waiting for their souls to catch up with their bodies." link link
Last edited by BranShea; 07/26/2009 6:31 PM.
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After a little googling around the web, I think it's more of an urban legend than anything else. It has a lot of the earmarks of folklore: e.g., differing locales (Africa, the Americas, Australia) and participants (Africans, Native Americans, Aborigines [on walkabout]), absolutely no citations, when, where, who ... The context is a vaguely Christian one (I saw one person saying it was an Orthodox bishop's favorite saying). Here's an example: link. In it's poresent form it seems to go back no further than the '80s.
Ceci n'est pas un seing.
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Urban legend? Is that what it's called? Funny, we call this type of stories 'monkey sandwich'.
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Monkey sandwich! Is that from a particular story?
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Funny, we call this type of stories 'monkey sandwich'Thanks, Brannie. I've got my new favorite word Broodjeaapverhaal ( link).
Ceci n'est pas un seing.
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but I don't think it should be considered as an expression or story. It is a fact. it being a fact means it's not an expression? how does that work?
formerly known as etaoin...
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I thought a fact is something 'real' or that really happened and that an expression is a way of saying. But I'm no grammar or laguage expwert.
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but it's still an expression, no? or is there some sort of Capital E Expression?
formerly known as etaoin...
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but it's still an expression, no?
Yes, it is, but the little explanatory story that has grown up beside it seems like folklore to me. Moreover, I like it as a figure of speech, I just don't buy its provenance.
Ceci n'est pas un seing.
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but it's still an expression, no?
Yes, it is, but the little explanatory story that has grown up beside it seems like folklore to me. Moreover, I like it as a figure of speech, I just don't buy its provenance. and I can agree with that.
formerly known as etaoin...
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stranger
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...The context is a vaguely Christian one (I saw one person saying it was an Orthodox bishop's favorite saying). Here's an example: link. In it's poresent form it seems to go back no further than the '80s. I would like to meet the Orthodox Bishop in question, because the idea of a soul that is separable while the person is alive is more shamanistic than Christian methinks. You are right, it does have all the marks of being a folklore story. But the "letting the soul catch up" part also has the ring of truth, or matches experience, in a way that many urban legends don't...
--------- My Novels and Poetry (Romance! Theology! Tantra! and an occasional recipe) http://btwreviews.com
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But the "letting the soul catch up" part also has the ring of truth, or matches experience, in a way that many urban legends don't.
I suppose it does, if you believe in souls and such. One of the things about folklore is that one's own often seems obvious and true, while that of others is superstitious and patently obviously wrong.
Ceci n'est pas un seing.
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but it's still an expression, no? or is there some sort of Capital E Expression? I thought 'an expression' meant this: A particular word or phrase: "an old Yankee expression . . . 'Stand up and be counted'" (Charles Kuralt). , but searching the vocabularies it seems to have a less limited meaning. I still think this 'soul catching up thing' is more than an urban legend and has a serious origin in old beliefs; an acceptable 'phenomenon'.
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stranger
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But the "letting the soul catch up" part also has the ring of truth, or matches experience, in a way that many urban legends don't.
I suppose it does, if you believe in souls and such. One of the things about folklore is that one's own often seems obvious and true, while that of others is superstitious and patently obviously wrong. "Soul" to me is a shorthand for the whole phenomenology of subjective experience. Wow, what lovely jargon! But I mean, the fact that we have subjective experience at all and also the wild variety of things we experience subjectively. And whether the usage of "soul" is fair for this - is it fair to use the word for "amber" (elektron) for an invisible sometimes particle sometimes wave that carries a negative charge? And no, I think other people's folklore is often just packed with value - that is how this topic got started. Ah noble Zmjezhd, how can I bear to disagree with you twice in one post. But perhaps you will forgive me?
--------- My Novels and Poetry (Romance! Theology! Tantra! and an occasional recipe) http://btwreviews.com
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how can I bear to disagree with you twice in one post
We're probably closer in our thinking than would seem by my postings. I love folklore. It and language reveal much about people and their cultures. As for soul, élan vital, ψυχη / psykhe, anima, what have you, as a metaphor it's A-OK with me. As for electra, I prefer quarks, at least the German dairy product.
Ceci n'est pas un seing.
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but it's still an expression, no? or is there some sort of Capital E Expression? I thought 'an expression' meant this: A particular word or phrase: "an old Yankee expression . . . 'Stand up and be counted'" (Charles Kuralt). , but searching the vocabularies it seems to have a less limited meaning. I still think this 'soul catching up thing' is more than an urban legend and has a serious origin in old beliefs; an acceptable 'phenomenon'. I think the "story" about it is a legend, but the phrase itself is an expression.
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I think the "story" about it is a legend, but the phrase itself is an expression.
Yes, I concur.
Ceci n'est pas un seing.
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Guess I'm confusing expression with figure of speech.
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well, if I got real specific about it, I would say that a "figure of speech" would be some rhetoric-type thing, but if I was being less specific, I would say that expression = figure of speech.
there's no question in my mind that the story of the African bearers is a legend, urban or otherwise.
I still like the concept of "slowing down to wait for our soul to catch up" a lot.
:¬ )
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Pooh-Bah
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there's no question in my mind that the story of the African bearers is a legend, urban or otherwise. Or a couple of the bearers realized that saying "Listen, we're the ones that are carrying all the heavy stuff, how about a day off?" was unlikely to work.
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Ha, I've looked at it this way too for a couple of excuses. 
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