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Online Etymolgy Dictionary says phonics comes from the Greek "phone" meaning sound. Doe anyone have info on the source for the name Phoenicia? Am wondering if it might be related to the same root since the Phoenicians were involved in the early alphabets?
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Welcome, CREHST. FWIW, your oed has this: Phoenician
1387, from M.Fr. phenicien, from L. Phoenice, from Gk. Phoinike, perhaps lit. "land of the purple" (source of purple dye). Identical with phoenix (q.v.), but the relationship is obscure.
But what I think is really needed here is a Greek scholar.
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Am wondering if it might be related to the same root since the Phoenicians were involved in the early alphabets?
Not very likely. First, Greek is an Indo-European language and Phoenician is a Semitic one. They are not related in any systematic way that historical linguists can ascertain. I'd say it was a coincidence.
Ceci n'est pas un seing.
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Right, but he's asking about a connection between the words phone and Phoenician, not about a connection between the languages.
They don't seem to be related. Phoenician is from Greek Phoinix, and my OED has two possible derivations for Phoinix: from phoinos "red", possibly from Proto-Indo-European *gwhen- "strike, kill"
or from a Semitic word for the madder plant Rubia tinctorum
Last edited by goofy; 05/22/09 04:26 PM.
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Would there be any link to the word phony too?
No.
phony (adj.)
"not genuine," 1900, phoney, perhaps an alteration of fawney "gilt brass ring used by swindlers" (1781), from Ir. fainne "ring." The noun meaning "phony person or thing" is attested from 1902.
(only to show how easily I'm tricked by words that seem to related)
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You think you're fooled. Just reading these threads
confuses me no end sometimes. Lots of scholars here.
----please, draw me a sheep----
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a connection between the words phone and Phoenician
OK, sure. I still think it unlikely that the words are related in Greek. If the root of Phoenician is Greek, you'd have to explain the variation in οι (oi) and ω (ō). If it is a Semitic loanword, is Latin Pūnus 'Punic; Phoenician' borrowed from Phoenician directly? (I assume so, since Latin also has the more learned loan from Greek Phoenices 'Phoenician'. (I was unaware of the PIE *gwhen- 'strike' posited etymology. I suppose from Greek πονος (phonos) 'murder', along the lines of 'murderous' as an ethnonym, but then you have to explain how it got into Latin and Greek: from PIE? Their own name for their country Phoenicia was knʕn with unknown vocalization (though it's Kinaḫḫu in Akkadian (and in Hurrian) and kĕnaʕan in Hebrew). Some connect that stem with purple or lowland. (There is also the intriguing coincidence of N-K and K-N in Phoenician and Canaan with the /p/ or /ph/ as some kind of prefix.)
Ceci n'est pas un seing.
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stranger
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Lots of good info here! Thanks for all the replies. My language background is pretty much limited to 2 years of high school Latin -- many moons ago!
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Lots of good info here! See there, zmjezhd: I knew you'd be good for something one of these days! ;-)
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