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stranger
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stranger
Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 4 |
Sorry if this sounds like its making fun of any groups of people. But I wanted to mention the word 'ugg' and 'how' as used in early western tv shows and movies.
These words were used as exclamations by tv indians (native Americans) and far from being simple, I find them to have within them a world of beautiful meaning.
'How' with the right hand upraised palm forward is at once an openhearted gesture of greeting, peace and friendly inquiry.
And 'ugg' (sp?) spoken around the fire is a perfect exclamation of agreement or resolution at an experiential and pre-verbal level.
I offer them as examples of a kind of communication tending toward peace and congeniality, words that cannot be translated perhaps, but that need no translation.
These two words should take up residence with other favorites such as 'aloha', 'ciao', and 'dobje' (Polish)
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Joined: Jul 2000
Posts: 3,467
Carpal Tunnel
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Carpal Tunnel
Joined: Jul 2000
Posts: 3,467 |
The answer, though not so obvious, is that there is no answer. For any given English word, there may be an exact translation in some other language, but unless one knows ALL of the other languages, one cannot ascertain whether such an exact translation exists.
This is NOT the same as asking whether any word in another language has an exact translation into English. A person with deep knowledge of German, French, Swahili, Tlingit, or any other language and who also has a good knowledge of English can find a word for which there is no English equivalent.
Someone here will have a name for this fallacious logic thing. I don't.
TEd
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Joined: Jul 2000
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Carpal Tunnel
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Carpal Tunnel
Joined: Jul 2000
Posts: 3,467 |
Oh. Sorry. DH already answered the question.
TEd
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Joined: May 2002
Posts: 1,529
veteran
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veteran
Joined: May 2002
Posts: 1,529 |
Quote:
Is there a word in English which is untranslatable?
The Welsh word hiraeth, the Portuguese word saudade, the Spanish word duende, the German word weltschmerz, Han in Chinese, and others, are considered untranslatable into another language. We can give an approximate translation. "Wistfulness"; "Nostalgia"; "Passion"; "Worldweariness"; "Bitterness". But to properly understand the elusive meanings of these words—understand them in the way that they are used by the native speakers of the language they belong to— you probably have to have lived in the culture in which they are used because the meanings are a unique part of the cultural psyche.
I'd really like to know if we have any words like this in English. But I can't think of a single candidate. Maybe it's impossible to identify these words in your own language.
Any ideas?
Of course all words can be translated by lots and lots of other words in almost any human language, so obviously what Hydra is really asking is are there any "concepts" that are so culturely intrenched by standard English that they can't be translated into another language.
The classic answer is "yes". The language of the Hopi indians had their own construction of "time" that defied our attempts to integrate
our concept of time into their particular scheme of things.
To the Hopis the abstraction "time" was intertwined in the vernacular with physical distance within an omnipresent "now", and the crazy but neato Hopi language proscribed any relationship of "cause" with "effect".*
* Buy me this book and I will point out the verse and chapter to which I refer... 
http://www.amazon.com/Hopi-Time-Linguistic-Linguistics-Monographs/dp/9027933499
Last edited by themilum; 12/12/06 02:58 AM.
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Joined: Oct 2000
Posts: 5,400
Carpal Tunnel
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Carpal Tunnel
Joined: Oct 2000
Posts: 5,400 |
we interweave time and place too in english (or rather in western/european culture)
my daughter lives 20 minutes away (a more realist expression than 5 miles.
5 miles on a country road with little traffic could be 20 minutes too, (if the road is narrow and winding)
5 miles could be 30 or more minutes awawy in a small town, riddled with stops signs.
20 minutes is a much better description of the distance than 5 miles ever could be--
and in my lifetime, the world has shrunk..
at a child, on 4 engine prop, ireland was a full 12 hours away. (the flight originated in NY, but stopped at boston, before heading out to shannon, where you had to change planes to get to dublin airport.
now, with non stop jets direct from JFK airport, dublin is just 6 or so hours away.. (it's half the distance it used to be!)
We might drive miles, but we often measure distance in time.
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Joined: Dec 2000
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Carpal Tunnel
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Carpal Tunnel
Joined: Dec 2000
Posts: 13,803 |
In Texas, distance is measured in six-packs.
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Joined: Mar 2005
Posts: 500
addict
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addict
Joined: Mar 2005
Posts: 500 |
Quote:
Quote:
Eh?
Let me give you another example.
I think you've just proven my point. My point is that "eh?" is not translatable. Well, it is, but only with one of the long, rambling explanations given by several others here for other words.
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Joined: Nov 2006
Posts: 74
journeyman
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journeyman
Joined: Nov 2006
Posts: 74 |
There is an ever-evolving list of adjectives, denoting a superlative quality (cool, awesome, etc.), that are imported into other languages over the globe. What is being imported, besides the literal word, is an aura of pop culture of the American variety, that defies translation.
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Posts: 293
enthusiast
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enthusiast
Joined: Oct 2006
Posts: 293 |
I am not sure, but the longest English word with no repeating characters is UNCOPYRIGHTABLE !!
Ironic in itself, eh?
Last edited by ParkinT; 12/13/06 03:17 PM.
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addict
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addict
Joined: Oct 2005
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