#16015
01/18/2001 5:54 PM
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Joined: Jan 2001
Posts: 35
newbie
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newbie
Joined: Jan 2001
Posts: 35 |
This is one that gets me while traveling also...mispronouncing the name of a town.
For instance: Philadelphia to the locals is "Philla-lephia", said quickly. Or just plain "Philly". Trenton, NJ is "Treton" no "n' sound.
I was corrected for this one in New England: Haverhill pronounded "Haver(long a)ill", not "Haver-hill".
And of course, the Big Apple is "New Yawk".
"Adversity is the whetstone of creativity"
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#16016
01/18/2001 6:16 PM
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Joined: Dec 2000
Posts: 13,803
Carpal Tunnel
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Carpal Tunnel
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Wherein Schuylkill is pronounced skookle.
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#16017
01/18/2001 9:26 PM
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Joined: Nov 2000
Posts: 3,439
Carpal Tunnel
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Carpal Tunnel
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Haverhill pronounced "Haver(long a)ill", not "Haver-hill". "HAY-vrill "  is just down the road from me.  So there must be sub-regional-accent thingies. Then there is Tewksbury -- Tooks-bry and Billerica --- Bill-RICKA and the ever popular Worcester which all the Brits will be glad to help with. I was fine in England as so many of the names are the same  ..... but a trip to Ireland tripped me up with Youghal.  It's "yawl!" or, for the Southerners, "y'all." wow
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#16018
01/18/2001 9:42 PM
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Joined: Jan 2001
Posts: 771
old hand
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old hand
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Posts: 771 |
Anyone wanna wrap their lips around Puyallup? (Sort of a Seattle suburb...)
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#16019
01/18/2001 9:52 PM
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Joined: Mar 2000
Posts: 1,981
Pooh-Bah
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Pooh-Bah
Joined: Mar 2000
Posts: 1,981 |
A few Oldies for completeness, you can search on them if you want to see what has gone before, otherwise just trust me.
Before entering Britain anyone from elsewhere will impress the natives if they can say:
Reading
Leicester
Shrewsbury
Cholmondley
I'll leave the Welsh to post for themselves.
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#16020
01/18/2001 9:57 PM
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Joined: Aug 2000
Posts: 3,409
Carpal Tunnel
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Carpal Tunnel
Joined: Aug 2000
Posts: 3,409 |
ShrewsburyThis one gave me pause- I would have assumed that it's pronounced shrewsbree, how wrong am I? The others were far to easy - I had a teacher from Redding, a good friend was born in Lester, and everybody knows chumley, don't they?
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#16021
01/18/2001 10:22 PM
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Joined: Mar 2000
Posts: 1,981
Pooh-Bah
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Pooh-Bah
Joined: Mar 2000
Posts: 1,981 |
I can't find the original posting on Shrewsbury, so here is my answer:
It depends
The posh way is Shrowsbry (rhymes with throw)
- this is perceived by non locals to be correct.
Many of the locals say Shrewsbree (as you said)
but where I lived - up the road a few miles - they said
Shoe-s-bry as in shoe (search me as to why)
So it doesn't matter how you say it, you just need the evidence to prove that you are right!
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#16022
01/18/2001 10:53 PM
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Joined: Dec 2000
Posts: 544
addict
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addict
Joined: Dec 2000
Posts: 544 |
"HAY-vrill " is just down the road from me.So there must be sub-regional-accent thingies. Then there is Tewksbury -- Tooks-bry and Billerica --- Bill-RICKA and the ever popular Worcester which all the Brits will be glad to help with.
I grew up in Boston, not far from these towns, and also near Medford - pronounced Meffuhd, even though Bedford was pronounced as you'd expect. I have to differ on the prononciation of Worcester. The Boston version is Wuh-sta, which is probably different from how the Brits would have it.
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#16023
01/19/2001 8:10 AM
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Joined: Mar 2000
Posts: 1,981
Pooh-Bah
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Pooh-Bah
Joined: Mar 2000
Posts: 1,981 |
>The Boston version is Wuh-sta, which is probably different from how the Brits would have it.
Wusta sounds close enough to Wuh-sta to me, unless I'm missing something.
The big difference with a lot of those kind of names comes in the associated counties.
In the US I tend to hear Devon-shire with the shire emphasised.
For most people, all the shires in the UK are swallowed, so you get:
Worcestershire - wustersh-r
Lancashire- lancash-r
Devonshire- devonsh-r
with the accent of the first syllable, not the last. I'm sure that Shanks will know that proper phonetic spelling.
Only in the South West would you get the full devon-shire with a full shire but still having the accent on the "de".
I suppose it is because most counties were shires and it wasthe bit at the beginning that made them destintive, rather than the shire at the end.
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#16024
01/19/2001 3:11 PM
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Joined: Nov 2000
Posts: 3,439
Carpal Tunnel
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Carpal Tunnel
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Posts: 3,439 |
From Hyla re Worcester : The Boston version is Wuh-sta,Exactly! And doesn't it drive you nuts when actors who are playing Boston characters call it Woo-ster?  Another town that bemuses is Taunton -- near New Bedford, Massachusetts -- which locals pronounce TAN'n with the n sort of half-swallowed ! wow
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#16025
01/19/2001 3:32 PM
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Joined: Nov 2000
Posts: 1,289
veteran
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veteran
Joined: Nov 2000
Posts: 1,289 |
Taunton MA
and then there's Staunton VA, pronounced Stanton.
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#16026
01/19/2001 3:36 PM
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Joined: Nov 2000
Posts: 1,289
veteran
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veteran
Joined: Nov 2000
Posts: 1,289 |
In reply to:
mispronouncing the name of a town
I have to take issue with your use of mispronouncing. You, a stranger, may think the name of a place should be pronounced a certain way; but I submit that the way it's pronounced by the folks who live there is ipso facto the "correct" pronunciation.
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#16027
01/19/2001 8:49 PM
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Joined: Jul 2000
Posts: 1,094
old hand
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old hand
Joined: Jul 2000
Posts: 1,094 |
And doesn't it drive you nuts when actors who are playing Boston characters call it Woo-ster?
There's a city in Ohio actually called Wooster. It's near Akron. I would suspect that it was named from the pronunciation of Worchester.
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#16028
01/20/2001 3:26 AM
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Joined: Jul 2000
Posts: 3,467
Carpal Tunnel
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Carpal Tunnel
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>I have to take issue with your use of mispronouncing. You, a stranger, may think the name of a place should be pronounced a certain way; but I submit that the way it's pronounced by the folks who live there is ipso facto the "correct" pronunciation.
Said the man from Ball-mur.
TEd
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#16029
01/20/2001 10:58 AM
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Joined: Mar 2000
Posts: 1,981
Pooh-Bah
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Pooh-Bah
Joined: Mar 2000
Posts: 1,981 |
Another town that bemuses is Taunton -- near New Bedford, Massachusetts -- which locals pronounce TAN'n with the n sort of half-swallowed !
I'm thinking of doing some proper research into this. It will mean, several years of travelling/traveling around with a microphone. All I need is some research funding or to persuade the taxman that all my travels are tax deductable.
I think that if I interviewed a real denizen of Taunton in Sommerset they would say Tauu-n. With an elongated first vowel, a common feature of the dialect of the South West. I was wondering if "TAN'n" has a long or a short "a"? If it is a long "a" then it is not so different.
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#16030
01/20/2001 11:11 AM
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Joined: Mar 2000
Posts: 1,981
Pooh-Bah
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Pooh-Bah
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Posts: 1,981 |
>I have to take issue with your use of mispronouncing. You, a stranger, may think the name of a place should be pronounced a certain way; but I submit that the way it's pronounced by the folks who live there is ipso facto the "correct" pronunciation. I agree that the way the locals say the word is the "correct" way. In some cases, as I have mentioned before, there are a few different "correct" local versions. In fact, finding these obscure local variations is part of the fun of travelling. I think it is different in the UK where the names tend to be older and have evolved over along time without an obvious reference point. The ones I find really strange are the ones like Cairo http://wordsmith.org/board/showthreaded.pl?Cat=&Board=words&Number=12538 which you mentioned in the cultural arrogance thread and I believe was mentioned in one of Bill Bryson's books. I find it interesting that such a well known (and really quite easy to pronounce) place name got changed. I suppose that in the days before mass communication, it didn't really matter how the rest of the world pronounced a word, it just mattered that you said it the same way as your parents and your teacher.
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#16031
01/20/2001 12:36 PM
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Joined: Mar 2000
Posts: 6,511
Carpal Tunnel
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Carpal Tunnel
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Posts: 6,511 |
Y'all who responded to Chickie's post ought to give it a re-read: This is one that gets me while traveling also...mispronouncing the name of a town. ... I betcha the subject of "mispronouncing" is my, not their.
Anyway, down here in Joe-ja we have a couple of gems that immediately spring to mind:
Albany = Al-BEN-ny
Vienna = VY-en-na
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#16032
01/20/2001 5:20 PM
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Joined: Nov 2000
Posts: 3,146
Carpal Tunnel
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Carpal Tunnel
Joined: Nov 2000
Posts: 3,146 |
Georgia and Dangling ParticiplesBoy, the Klan has moved on, hasn't it? The major difference between Zild and Strine, and one that appears to be obvious only to Aunty Podeans and her offspring, is the Zild swallowing of vowels that the Striners actually lengthen. So when in the Land of Oz, I and most of my country-things stand out simply because of the way we pronounce some names. The two that spring to mind are Brisbane - which Zild has as "br's-bin" and Strine has as "breez-bayne" (a little exaggerated in both casses) and Sydney, which Zild pronounces "S'd-ny" and Strine has as "Seed-knee" - again, exaggerated a bit. For all that we understand each other except when it comes to Aboriginal and Maori place names.
The idiot also known as Capfka ...
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#16033
01/20/2001 5:30 PM
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Joined: Nov 2000
Posts: 3,439
Carpal Tunnel
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Carpal Tunnel
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I was wondering if "TAN'n" has a long or a short "a"? If it is a long "a" then it is not so different. A sort of semi-long a. OK? wow
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#16034
01/20/2001 7:31 PM
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Joined: Mar 2000
Posts: 1,981
Pooh-Bah
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Pooh-Bah
Joined: Mar 2000
Posts: 1,981 |
>A sort of semi-long a. I think the only way for me to get over this problem is to fly over immediately, all this second hand stuff is just not good enough. I have to hear the a's .
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#16035
01/20/2001 11:34 PM
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Joined: Jan 2001
Posts: 328
enthusiast
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enthusiast
Joined: Jan 2001
Posts: 328 |
>wherein Schuylkill is pronounced skookle.
Hooray! Someone who knows the correct pronunciation of Schuylkill... :-)
One way we Berks Countians immediately identify out-of-towners is their mispronunciation of Reading (which is supposed to be "Redding") or the name of our neighboring county of Lancaster. Non-Pennsylvania Dutchies tend to say "Lan-caster" instead of the proper "Lenkister."
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#16036
01/20/2001 11:36 PM
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Joined: Jan 2001
Posts: 13
stranger
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stranger
Joined: Jan 2001
Posts: 13 |
The Kentucky cities of Cadiz and Lafayette are pronounced by the locals as KAYdiz and laFAYette. (AY = long a)
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#16037
01/21/2001 1:02 AM
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Joined: Mar 2000
Posts: 6,511
Carpal Tunnel
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Carpal Tunnel
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Posts: 6,511 |
Georgia and Dangling Participles
Boy, the Klan has moved on, hasn't it?
Yep. Our participles are free to dangle now. But you: keep an eye on the trees in your backyard. Or south garden. Or whatever y'all call it down there. Roger. 10-4. Over.
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#16038
01/21/2001 1:25 AM
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Joined: Mar 2000
Posts: 11,613
Carpal Tunnel
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Carpal Tunnel
Joined: Mar 2000
Posts: 11,613 |
JEFFREY!!
My gosh, welcome. Holy cow, another Kentuckian! I was
beginning to feel like the first lone Kiwi!(sorry, Max!)
We even used to have the same boss!
As far as I know, the town you're in is HOP-kns-vull.
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#16039
01/21/2001 2:24 PM
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Joined: Nov 2000
Posts: 3,439
Carpal Tunnel
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Carpal Tunnel
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>A sort of semi-long a. jmh says I think the only way for me to get over this problem is to fly over immediately, all this second hand stuff is just not good enough. I have to hear the a's.Research "on the groud" is finest kind. I'll ready the guest room, put on the tea and warm up the scones. wow P.S. what is correct pronunciation of "scones?"
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#16040
01/21/2001 3:33 PM
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Joined: Mar 2000
Posts: 1,981
Pooh-Bah
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Pooh-Bah
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Posts: 1,981 |
>P.S. what is correct pronunciation of "scones?" The short answer is "it depends on the way the cookie crumbles". If you have a few spare hours, it may be a good idea to run it through the trusty search engine. I seem to remember a discussion about it a while ago! Oh, and I'd like a hot water bottle!
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#16041
01/21/2001 3:53 PM
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Joined: Jul 2000
Posts: 3,467
Carpal Tunnel
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Carpal Tunnel
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>Oh, and I'd like a hot water bottle!
And James also???
TEd
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#16042
01/21/2001 6:32 PM
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Joined: Jul 2000
Posts: 1,094
old hand
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old hand
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Posts: 1,094 |
Holy cow, another Kentuckian! I was
beginning to feel like the first lone Kiwi!You thought Kentucky was the only state that had only one board member? Oh wait, I live in the same state as Anu!
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#16043
01/21/2001 6:41 PM
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Joined: Nov 2000
Posts: 3,146
Carpal Tunnel
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Carpal Tunnel
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Oh wait, I live in the same state as Anu!Well, that state would have to be non-corporeal or disembodied if Father Steve's view of Anu's state is to be believed. And I beat Ted to a pun. 
The idiot also known as Capfka ...
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#16044
01/21/2001 8:23 PM
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Joined: Mar 2000
Posts: 11,613
Carpal Tunnel
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Carpal Tunnel
Joined: Mar 2000
Posts: 11,613 |
Now confound it, you guys! Of COURSE I didn't think KY was the only state with one subscriber: better watch it, or you may wind up being the only octopus with seven tentacles. My uncle on the farm had a colorful saying when someone wanted the last biscuit or piece of chicken: if someone reached for it, they were going to "draw back a nub". And just for the record, I don't like jazz, either. And as to Anu's state: he is in an exalted state, and when I think of him, I am in a state of exaltation! Speaking of people from India, I read an article yesterday by a gentleman who has been there many times, and he asked himself: "What is it that makes India so different?... It was the worldview these people lived by and projected in their daily activities, their hands held together in greeting to assert that you and I are one, in the belief that this world is maya--illusion."
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#16045
01/22/2001 9:36 PM
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Joined: Jul 2000
Posts: 1,094
old hand
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old hand
Joined: Jul 2000
Posts: 1,094 |
I don't like jazz, either
[shocked more than the shocked emoticon can describe emoticon]
how darest thou say that!?
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#16046
01/23/2001 12:16 AM
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Joined: Sep 2000
Posts: 2,891
Carpal Tunnel
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Carpal Tunnel
Joined: Sep 2000
Posts: 2,891 |
Now now Jazz, we can`t all like the same things. Don`t be tooo hurt, do YOU like Bob Denver? (she says while fleeing for fear of the oncoming storm)
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#16047
01/23/2001 1:34 AM
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Joined: Mar 2000
Posts: 11,613
Carpal Tunnel
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Carpal Tunnel
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Posts: 11,613 |
how darest thou say that!?
Why, because it's just squankings and honkings--positively
hurts my ears--and my ever-so-tender sensibilities.
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#16048
01/23/2001 3:02 AM
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Joined: Aug 2000
Posts: 3,409
Carpal Tunnel
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Carpal Tunnel
Joined: Aug 2000
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Jackie said, of Jazz (the music, not the man) it's just squankings and honkings"Squankings" - bewdiful, I'll have to remember that one. While not the most devout jazz afficionado since Bix, I am quite partial to the less strident forms of the genre. I have uploaded to my driveway acount two small pieces, both involving a "fiddle", one featuring two jazz icons, the other as a supremely altruistic gesture to our beleaguered Kentuckians. I leave you to guess which one I consider just squankings and honkings
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#16049
01/23/2001 1:10 PM
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Joined: Mar 2000
Posts: 11,613
Carpal Tunnel
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Carpal Tunnel
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Posts: 11,613 |
Dearest Max! Thank you, thank you, for putting that there! I just chortled all the way through it! Yes, I know that song very well. I've seen Bill Monroe and the
Bluegrass Boys perform several times, at the annual
Bluegrass Music Festival here in town.
Overall, I prefer the instrumental bluegrass tunes, simply because more players than not do it for love of the music, not because they have good voices. And yes, Bill sings in
true-blue Kentucky twang. Not all that pleasant, but it is
real--a true reflection of what and who we are, so I don't mind it (too much). The instrumental pieces: I double-dog
dare ANYbody to keep their toes from tappin' to the beat!
We'd sit in the sun all day at these festivals, cooler with
appropriate beverages at our side, and go home well after dark with hands and throats sore from clapping and "hollering". This was two girlfriends and me, and we got to know some of the bands rather well.
Aside: Years ago when we were young and Faldage-I-mean-foolish, we went to a costume party where a friend "wore"
the most unusual costume I've ever seen: He had a 2" square
cut out of the seat of his jeans, giving a view of his
underwear-less, blue-painted backside--he had come as
Blue Moon of Kentucky!
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#16050
01/23/2001 1:17 PM
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Joined: Nov 2000
Posts: 3,439
Carpal Tunnel
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Carpal Tunnel
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Posts: 3,439 |
Set aside any currently held bias about jazz until you watch the current Ken Burns series "Jazz." It is an education (!) and filled with terrific music, rare performance clips, all so very well done you forget it's a documantary! Covers Jazz from its beginnings to present.
On Public Broadcasting in USA -- I hope it will be available outside the country.
wow
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#16051
01/23/2001 3:11 PM
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Joined: Nov 2000
Posts: 866
old hand
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old hand
Joined: Nov 2000
Posts: 866 |
re: Anyone wanna wrap their lips around Puyallup?
In the SW of Western Australia, there's a plethora of place names that end in "up" - eg Yallingup, Yunderup, Balingup, Mullallyup. Originates from the local Aboriginal (Noongyar - pron. Noong-arr, short oo, sounds like 'u' in full) language and said to mean "place of", particularly in reference to a place of water.
So how'd Puyallup get a Noongyar name??
stales
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#16052
01/23/2001 3:23 PM
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Joined: Nov 2000
Posts: 866
old hand
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old hand
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Posts: 866 |
There's a few I've flagged before (eg Toodyay ("2-jay") & Derby (Derby - NOT Darby) in WestOz), but just thought of anotheree......Canowindra in NewSouthOz.
Can-ow-n-dra (ow as in ouch) NOT Can-no-windra. Funny name, gorgeous town but!
stales
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#16053
01/23/2001 3:52 PM
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Joined: Dec 2000
Posts: 2,661
Carpal Tunnel
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Carpal Tunnel
Joined: Dec 2000
Posts: 2,661 |
I have enjoyed the PBS "Jazz" series, and as someone who has heard this information in many forms in the past, it is refreshing to see it, as well as listen to it. It is interesting to hear (second hand) that the "fools" on public radio gave this show a "less than good" review, probably for the same reason I don't listen to them often (a bit pretentious and pseudo...a lot of things). As for "squanking and honking"... these are the sounds that some souls need for catharsis. At least it responds (somehow) to repetition (Hi Marty). Jackie - Does the name come from the actual grass variety? Is it specifically from Kentucky? I'm with you all the way on the toe tappin' challenge - but "double-dog dare", whew, that's even futher than our "double dare" - Where does the dog come from - fit in - do - what kind of dog?
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#16054
01/23/2001 4:24 PM
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Joined: Mar 2000
Posts: 11,613
Carpal Tunnel
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Carpal Tunnel
Joined: Mar 2000
Posts: 11,613 |
Ah, sweet musick to my ears! Yes, bluegrass music is named after the grass, which is our state's nickname: Kentucky is the Bluegrass State. (Interesting, since we're really a commonwealth--see past thread.) Bluegrass is found primarily around Lexington, which is horse farm country. Well, catharse all you want with your squankings, but please let me get out of earshot. I really dislike saxophone, most of the time. Not that fond of clarinet, either. For some reason, oboe doesn't grate like those 2. What kind of dog? Why, a blue-tick coon hound, of course!
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