Wordsmith.org: the magic of words

Wordsmith Talk

About Us | What's New | Search | Site Map | Contact Us  

Previous Thread
Next Thread
Print Thread
#138973 02/10/2005 12:18 PM
Joined: Sep 2000
Posts: 4,757
Carpal Tunnel
Carpal Tunnel
Offline
Joined: Sep 2000
Posts: 4,757
Try, as a matter of interest, jotting down a simple one line description of what you understand the word torture to mean and post it here.







Then see what glory a deconstructionist government lawyer can make it into:

http://www.slate.com/id/2113314/fr/nl/



#138974 02/10/2005 1:36 PM
Joined: Dec 2000
Posts: 1,055
old hand
old hand
Offline
Joined: Dec 2000
Posts: 1,055
Any re-classification of these kind of words is fundamentally motivated by self-interest.

The classic example is 'terrorism'. Whole books have been written about its definition, although it can easily be defined as such:

'the unlawful use or threatened use of force or violence by a person or an organized group against people or property with the intention of intimidating or coercing societies or governments, often for ideological or political reasons.'

This classification is fine, but has been rejected in the UN on numerous occasions by certain members. Prevailing powers will always define language according to their needs, this is one topic of Macbeth, btw. Thus terrorism must exempt all home-grown violence, but include convert enemy operations.


#138975 02/10/2005 2:17 PM
Joined: Mar 2000
Posts: 11,613
Carpal Tunnel
Carpal Tunnel
Joined: Mar 2000
Posts: 11,613
My one-line def.: anything that causes a person to be in agony.

Okay, I've read the article; typical rationalization technique for saying, "I can make the law say what I want it to"; very akin to doing the same thing to statistical info.

Couple of asides: I tried, with only partial success, to do some sussing on Slate. I will grudgingly for now assume that it is not made up of fictional stories.
Secondly, I finally looked up deconstruction(ism), never having learned about it before. Sorry if this offends anyone, but IMHO: how stupid.
'Nother aside: I wonder if that lawyer voted/works for Bush...
That whole thing reminded me of ...someone else; it sounded very much as though a defense were being prepared for charges that haven't even been made, yet. Gave me a distinct read-between-the-lines feeling of, "Gee, I know I/we have done/are doing something wrong; I'd better prepare something that I can point back to and say, 'Well, look right here--this says I was innocent' ."

#138976 02/10/2005 3:21 PM
Joined: May 2002
Posts: 1,529
veteran
veteran
Offline
Joined: May 2002
Posts: 1,529
Ok here's mine...

[Torture] legal - the overt act of inflicting pain and/or the deprivation of stimuli necessary to the continued mental and physical health of the imprisoned or detained.

But big deal. At the present stage of our knowledge about the semantical delimitations of the meanings in our wordings, the only restraints that can be guaranteed against the misuse of any written edit is the establishment of a civilized and reasonable culture to do the constraining.

All else is fluff.


#138977 02/10/2005 3:31 PM
Joined: Sep 2001
Posts: 6,296
Carpal Tunnel
Carpal Tunnel
Offline
Joined: Sep 2001
Posts: 6,296
I think of tortured language as language that has been spoken or written in such a way that it has suffered and been debilitated to the point that it can barely execute its function of communication.

On the other hand, I also think of such tortured language as being highly entertaining because of its very incapacitated function--kind of like laughing at things that you don't really want to happen in real life.


#138978 02/10/2005 3:43 PM
Joined: Dec 2000
Posts: 1,055
old hand
old hand
Offline
Joined: Dec 2000
Posts: 1,055
> At the present stage of our knowledge about the semantical delimitations of the meanings in our wordings, the only restraints that can be guaranteed against the misuse of any written edit is the establishment of a civilized and reasonable culture to do the constraining.


LOL! Nicely worded; fat chance though, eh.


#138979 02/10/2005 5:05 PM
Joined: Jul 2000
Posts: 3,467
Carpal Tunnel
Carpal Tunnel
Joined: Jul 2000
Posts: 3,467
torture:

The level of pain, intimidation, and humiliation that you would not want someone else to use on you.

When a government says that it must use torture to protect itself and its citizens it has regressed to the level of the barbaric and should not be allowed by people of good will to survive.



TEd
#138980 02/10/2005 6:32 PM
Joined: Apr 2000
Posts: 10,542
Carpal Tunnel
Carpal Tunnel
Joined: Apr 2000
Posts: 10,542
actually, torture is a very specific and tangible concept that can be measured by a psychological instrument called a dolorimeter, which measures pain in units called dols.

(sorry mav, I seem to be having a hard time dealing with abstractions today.)



#138981 02/11/2005 11:22 AM
Joined: Oct 2001
Posts: 1,385
veteran
veteran
Offline
Joined: Oct 2001
Posts: 1,385
I don't think a "dolormeter" measures torture, tsuwm. It only measures sad. A veximeter measures mad. And torture can be maddening.

And here's something which hasn't been mentioned yet about torture. Extreme psychological torture can result in madness, for example, schizophrenia where the personality splits itself into several personalities* to protect itself from psychological abuse.

This sort of madness is actually a pyschological defence mechanism. It presents any abuser with a multiple victim and more or less evens the odds for the victim when the victim feels outnumbered or otherwise overwhelmed by superior force.

BTW bullying in the schoolyard has been recognized as a serious form of psychological torture in recent years. And recent research indicates that girls are as guilty of it as boys.

Until quite recently, the literature on bullying focused solely on physical and verbal aggression. Since the 1990s, however, researchers have also begun to examine relational aggression. Relational aggression refers to any act that actively excludes a person from making or maintaining friendships or being integrated into the peer group--such as spreading rumors, or excluding and socially isolating a person (e.g., Bjoerkqvist, Lagerspetz, & Kaukianen, 1992). Studies have found that while boys tend to use overt forms of aggression (such as physical and verbal aggression) in bullying, girls' bullying behaviors often focus on damaging an individual's social connections within the peer group (e.g., Crick & Grotpeter, 1995; Crick, Casas, & Ku, 1999). Researchers are beginning to broaden their definitions of aggression and bullying, and to examine the consequences of relational aggression for all parties involved (e.g., Crick, 1996; Tomada & Schneider, 1997). The topic of relational aggression has also captured the attention of the general public, through such books as Rachel Simmons' (2002) Odd Girl Out.

http://snipurl.com/cpgh

Note: I tried Maverick's Shift + Enter solution to split this link to avoid wide screen. But it didn't work. So I tried tsuwm's snipurl.com solution. And it works like a charm! Thanks, tsuwm. [snipurl.com is very handy.]

* The "3 Faces of Eve" must be a different condition**:

Schizophrenia is not split personality

misunderstood disease
No other psychological disorder is as widely misunderstood as schizophrenia. The public often equates schizophrenia with "multiple personality", assuming that schizophrenic patients fluctuate between a placis, conventional personality and a monstrous, violent one as in the famous story of Dr Jekyll and mr Hyde. Nothing could be further from the truth.

Only one personality

Although the word schizo-phrenic literally means "split mind", the term refers to the fragmentation or splitting up of normally integrated psychological functioning. A schizophrenic patient has only one personality, but his or her mental activity is often severely disorganized.

http://snipurl.com/cpll

** Multiple Personality Disorder (DID)

Does multiple personality disorder really exist?

Multiple personality disorder, now officially known as dissociative identity disorder (DID), remains the object of bitter controversy. One thing's clear, though--it's not nearly as common as people thought just a few years ago.


http://www.straightdope.com/columns/031003.html

#138982 02/11/2005 2:40 PM
Joined: Apr 2000
Posts: 10,542
Carpal Tunnel
Carpal Tunnel
Joined: Apr 2000
Posts: 10,542
http://www.kzoo.edu/psych/stop_bullying/topics_of_interest
/bullying_among_girls.html


just in the interest of modern nescience again, take a look at what putting a [br]eak in your link does to the address when you click it (look to your browser's address box). your users can always edit the break out themselves, but why should they be arsed?


#138983 02/11/2005 3:09 PM
Joined: Sep 2000
Posts: 4,757
Carpal Tunnel
Carpal Tunnel
Offline
Joined: Sep 2000
Posts: 4,757
pluto > [snipurl.com is very handy.]

uranus > why should they be arsed?


yeahbut those of us who don’t like redirects and data whorehousing may not be fond of the other approach - don't you have any concern about snip? (although I have not bothered to read their Terms of Endearment...)



#138984 02/11/2005 3:30 PM
Joined: Apr 2000
Posts: 10,542
Carpal Tunnel
Carpal Tunnel
Joined: Apr 2000
Posts: 10,542
a martian writes> I have not bothered to read their Terms of Endearment

good point, ma'
http://snipurl.com/termsofuse




#138985 02/11/2005 4:23 PM
Joined: Oct 2001
Posts: 1,385
veteran
veteran
Offline
Joined: Oct 2001
Posts: 1,385
I feel like a bit of an arse 'cause I don't understand this stuff. ["So what else is new?", says themilum. :) ]



Moderated by  Jackie 

Link Copied to Clipboard
Forum Statistics
Forums16
Topics13,916
Posts230,429
Members9,211
Most Online17,319
Apr 8th, 2026
Newest Members
Boo boo kitty fu, peterreineck, Peripatetic Toad, JerryC, blvd
9,211 Registered Users
Top Posters(30 Days)
Top Posters
wwh 13,858
Faldage 13,803
Jackie 11,613
wofahulicodoc 11,244
tsuwm 10,542
LukeJavan8 9,974
AnnaStrophic 6,511
Wordwind 6,296
of troy 5,400
Disclaimer: Wordsmith.org is not responsible for views expressed on this site. Use of this forum is at your own risk and liability - you agree to hold Wordsmith.org and its associates harmless as a condition of using it.

Home | Today's Word | Yesterday's Word | Subscribe | FAQ | Archives | Search | Feedback
Wordsmith Talk | Wordsmith Chat

© 1994-2026 Wordsmith

Powered by UBB.threads™ PHP Forum Software 8.0.1