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In reply to:
I convinced the person to stop his action. ARGH!!! convince is to cause someone to believe something, not to coerce!
Surely convince here is being used to mean persuade, not coerce. An unnecessary extension of meaning, perhaps, but not quite as big a stretch as you make out TEd.
Bingley
Bingley
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Bingley commented: Surely convince here is being used to mean persuade, not coerce. An unnecessary extension of meaning, perhaps, but not quite as big a stretch as you make out TEd.Bingley, this is what TEd's example is showing, although grammatically it may not have been perfect. If you phrase it: "I convinced (x) that he should cease carrying out his action", then you are affecting his belief that his action is correct. In fact, "Convince" seems to be rarely used in any other context. "I convinced her that completing her degree would be to her long-term benefit" seems ordinary usage. "I'm convinced that I'm correct" is tautological, but usual usage. Problem?  CK
The idiot also known as Capfka ...
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In reply to:
Bingley commented: Surely convince here is being used to mean persuade, not coerce. An unnecessary extension of meaning, perhaps, but not quite as big a stretch as you make out TEd.
Bingley, this is what TEd's example is showing, although grammatically it may not have been perfect.
Capital Kiwi, I agree that this is what TEd's example shows, but I understood him to be saying that he objected to the example on the grounds that convict was being used in the example to mean coerce, but I don't think it is. Perhaps TEd could clarify what exactly he is objecting to.
Bingley
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>In reply to:
I convinced the person to stop his action. ARGH!!! convince is to cause someone to believe something, not to coerce!
Surely convince here is being used to mean persuade, not coerce. An unnecessary extension of meaning, perhaps, but not quite as big a stretch as you
make out TEd.
-=------
Bingley:
Let me try to be a little more clear. I am convinced of Bingley's right to believe in the deity of his choice. But it is grammatically incorrect for me to say, I convinced Bingley to leave the church of Itzenism. You have heard of the church of Itzenism, haven't you??
I can say I persuaded you to do something, or I coerced you to do something, but technically speaking convince should not be followed by an infinitive.
TEd
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*sigh* - Into the fray again ... TEd said: I can say I persuaded you to do something, or I coerced you to do something, but technically speaking convince should not be followed by an infinitive.Two things - 1. Usage changes. I personally agree with your comments here. I would say "I convinced Bingley that his adherence to the heretical creed of Itzenism was counter to the attitude of every right-thinking Boarder". 2. Others (not I) would see absolutely nothing wrong with me having said "I convinced Bingley to give up attending the High Temple of Itzenism because his adherence to the creed ... yadda, yadda". We're back to what is technically correct and what is common usage. Just remember that in experimental biology that even given a perfect environment of heat, nutrition, water and other life-related factors, the organism will do as it damned well pleases. Language is such an organism! 
The idiot also known as Capfka ...
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In reply to:
I can say I persuaded you to do something, or I coerced you to do something, but technically speaking convince should not be followed by an infinitive.
"I coerced you to do something" jars on me far more than "I convinced to do something". I would say "I coerced you into doing something" (not that I would, mind you, not being the coercive type), or is this another point where usage differs in different places?
PS. All right, what is the church of Itzenism?
Bingley
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Hi Bingley, up there in sunny Jakarta. You asked PS. All right, what is the church of Itzenism?
Frankly, I dunno. TEd would be your best resource for this. I took it as being a contraction of "It's an -ism". But then, cryptic crosswords have bored me silly for years, and this looks like a cryptic clue ...
So, go on, make my day. Coerce me!
The idiot also known as Capfka ...
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>PS. All right, what is the church of Itzenism? I was hoping you would ask [grin] Itzenism is a California church with a very simple creed: They believe in an afterlife in a heaven called Itzen. Everyone who belongs to the church goes to Itzen upon death. Period. No exceptions. I had two friends, Durward and Alexander, who were twin brothers. They grew up in the Twin Cities, married twin sisters, and went to work in California, where they were attracted to the simplicity of Itzenism. Unfortunately, they were whacked by a semi while out on a ride on their tandem bicycle. They are now buried under a single headstone that reads: Alex and Dur Souls in Itzen What the HELL happened to the last three words??? I am mortified!
TEd
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Everyone who belongs to the church goes to Itzen upon death. Period. No exceptions.
I had two friends, Durward and Alexander, who were twin brothers. They were attracted to the simplicity of Itzenism. Unfortunately, they were whacked by a semi while out on a ride on their tandem bicycle. They are now buried under a single headstone that reads: Alex and Dur Thanks, TEd, very funny. Perhaps the "Three-in-one Pun" thread should be renamed the Good Laugh Archipelago?
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In the 13 December 2000 issue of Medscape General Medicine, George D. Lundberg, MD, criticized the low rate of nonforensic autopsies conducted in America. He is pleased that a few agencies counter this trend and writes: "Fortunately, the Veteran's Administration, the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention, the Agency for Healthcare Research and Quality, the Health Care Financing Administration, and selected others still care and are efforting a turnaround."
Efforting?
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