#10583
11/20/2000 4:07 PM
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Joined: Oct 2000
Posts: 1,346
veteran
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veteran
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clap and cheer and hoot and whistle
Well, my sea-lion impression is legendary, shanks!
I usually reserve it for bad jokes (especially for appalling puns) but I'm sure I could make an exception.
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#10584
11/20/2000 5:14 PM
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Joined: Sep 2000
Posts: 2,788
Carpal Tunnel
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Carpal Tunnel
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Tom Wolfe is a most egocentric and occasionally outlandish fellow. How DARE he call John Irving, Norman Mailer and John Updike "the Three Stooges" in his recent "Hooking Up"? On the other hand, "The Right Stuff" is a significant book and Wolfe's description of the alcoholic reporter waking up with a hangover in "Bonfire of the Vanities" is one of the great scenes in all of English literature.
This goes to demonstrate, I think, that a fellow can be flaming brilliant and extraordinarily skilled with words yet still succumb to pomposity and appear an ass.
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#10585
11/20/2000 10:49 PM
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Joined: Sep 2000
Posts: 2,891
Carpal Tunnel
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Carpal Tunnel
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Oooo, I'll go, I'll go. Sounds exactly like a movie I'd love to see/participate it. You will have to direct me as to where The Big Smoke is. I do not have a clue WHERE you are talking about.
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#10586
11/21/2000 12:26 AM
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Joined: Apr 2000
Posts: 10,542
Carpal Tunnel
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Carpal Tunnel
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Posts: 10,542 |
bel, I'd not heard this formulation before either; but having nearly asphyxiated in London one spring, I'd wager that's the place to which shanks refers.
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#10587
11/21/2000 8:05 AM
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Joined: Mar 2000
Posts: 1,004
old hand
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old hand
Joined: Mar 2000
Posts: 1,004 |
Indeed it is London. In a feeble attempt to ape the Big Apple, but finding nothing more salubrious than smoke to speak of... (and, no, it isn't my formulation either.)
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#10588
11/21/2000 10:13 AM
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Joined: Mar 2000
Posts: 1,981
Pooh-Bah
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Pooh-Bah
Joined: Mar 2000
Posts: 1,981 |
My father always calls London "The Smoke". Edinburgh is known as "Auld Reekie" for, I assume, the same reason.
Tsuwm, you must have been in your pram if you made it to London before the Clean Air Act of 1970.
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#10589
11/21/2000 1:32 PM
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Joined: Apr 2000
Posts: 10,542
Carpal Tunnel
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Carpal Tunnel
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>Tsuwm, you must have been in your pram if you made it to London before the Clean Air Act of 1970.
'twas in the mid 70s -- must have been just another Act.
besides, the Big Diesel Fumes just doesn't have the same...
je ne sais quois.
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#10590
11/21/2000 2:41 PM
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Joined: Oct 2000
Posts: 197
member
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member
Joined: Oct 2000
Posts: 197 |
On the other hand, "The Right Stuff" is a significant book and Wolfe's description of the alcoholic reporter waking up with a hangover in "Bonfire of the Vanities" is one of the great scenes in all of English literature.
Tom Wolfe, Ooh, don't get me started. Too late.
I only vaguely remember the scene to which you refer, and unfortunately, I don't actually have the book on hand to look it up. Regardless of any "great scene in English literature" that you might remember, Tom Wolfe infuriates me. That was the first of many books I have read on the American space program. When I read it I enjoyed it immensely for all its vivid imagery and exciting depiction of fighter jocks.
What irkes me now is that Tom Wolfe intentionally depicted these fellows as idiots. During his descriptions of the Mercury flights, he talked constantly about their ultimate goal of not 'screwing the pooch.' He very intentionally portrayed Gus Grissim (one of my personal heroes) as having completely "screwed the pooch." Now, there was some question about how that hatch blew prematurely. For a while Gus was assumed to be the culprit, but as NASA later learned, Gus was not at fault. Tom apparently didn't see that as a good story so he conveniently forgot to mention that after careful examination it was learned that a malfunction in the hardware, and not Gus's mistake, caused the loss of the spacecraft. I thought for a long time that Gus Grissim panicked and blew the hatch.
I'm sure that if I had a copy of the book, I could make my point more precisely. I could also cite a number of other passages in the book that are coloured to make a good story rather than present an accurate account of the history. I can't find the reference at the moment, but I know that one of those guys mentioned in his biography that Wolfe's portrayal of the events is full of exaggerations for dramatic effect.
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#10591
11/21/2000 6:11 PM
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Joined: Sep 2000
Posts: 2,788
Carpal Tunnel
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Carpal Tunnel
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Dearest Xara ~
I apologize to you and your entire circulatory system for providing an occasion for hypertension on the subject of author Tom Wolfe (who looks really, really good in a white suit, which is not easy to do). Perhaps his ignorance about the space program, coupled with his expertise about waking up hung-over, may lead one to the conclusion that he has much more experience getting drunk than flying in space capsules. The mentor's maxim is "write about what you know."
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#10592
11/21/2000 8:01 PM
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Joined: Sep 2000
Posts: 347
enthusiast
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enthusiast
Joined: Sep 2000
Posts: 347 |
Isn't 'The Big Smoke' a widespread expression for the local big city, then? That's certainly the usage I'm familiar with here in Australia. I imagine it was used initially by people living in the country, referring to their state's capital, and thence by the city dwellers referring to their own city.
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#10593
11/21/2000 10:20 PM
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Joined: Sep 2000
Posts: 2,891
Carpal Tunnel
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Carpal Tunnel
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Hmmm. I wonder why we have no nicknames for the cities in Canada. The closest we get to a nickname is when talking about Toronto; same people shorten it to T-O. There is really nothing remotely cute or representative about it.
The Big Smoke, The Big Apple, The City of Angels. Quite distinct, and most people know exactly where they are.
Does anyone have any more out there?
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#10594
11/21/2000 10:51 PM
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Joined: Jul 2000
Posts: 1,094
old hand
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old hand
Joined: Jul 2000
Posts: 1,094 |
Does anyone have anymore out there?
Well, Cincinnati has two rather contradictory nicknames: the Queen City and the Flying Pig City.
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#10595
11/22/2000 1:49 AM
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Joined: Sep 2000
Posts: 2,891
Carpal Tunnel
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Carpal Tunnel
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All right, I'm nearly afraid to ask...Flying Pig City????
I can't even imagine what would bring about such a nickname. I do remember a tv sitcom called WKRP in Cincinnati, in which turkeys were thrown out of a helicopter on Thanksgiving (the owner thought they could fly). I am really hoping this is not what brought about the Flying Pig nickname. Porcine parachuting?
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#10596
11/22/2000 2:40 AM
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Joined: Aug 2000
Posts: 3,409
Carpal Tunnel
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Carpal Tunnel
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Does anyone have any more out there?
NZ's largest City Auckland (Tamaki Makarau) is widely known as The City of Sails
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#10597
11/22/2000 4:49 AM
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Joined: Apr 2000
Posts: 10,542
Carpal Tunnel
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Carpal Tunnel
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>The Big Apple
minneapolis (when it's not clumped as the twin cities) is somewhat derisively referred to as the minnie apple.
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#10598
11/22/2000 5:29 AM
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Joined: Sep 2000
Posts: 347
enthusiast
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enthusiast
Joined: Sep 2000
Posts: 347 |
Does anyone have any more out there?
A few that would be reasonably well recognized within Australia, but probably not outside it(?) are:
Sydney - The Harbour City
Adelaide - The City of Churches
Alice Springs - The Alice
Broken Hill, New South Wales - The Silver City (probably one of several around the world)
More universally perhaps (but not in Australia!):
Motown
Tinseltown (although I guess strictly it's just referring to one part of a larger city, and the predominant industry therein)
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#10599
11/22/2000 4:12 PM
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Joined: Sep 2000
Posts: 2,891
Carpal Tunnel
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Carpal Tunnel
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Posts: 2,891 |
side note, side note...
>Adelaide - The City of Churches
I wonder how it compares to Québec. Québec is the bastion of Catholicism in Canada. You can`t spit without hitting a church.
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#10600
11/22/2000 4:33 PM
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Joined: Aug 2000
Posts: 2,204
Pooh-Bah
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Pooh-Bah
Joined: Aug 2000
Posts: 2,204 |
I claim "The Big Smoke (or just "The Smoke") for London - it was so known during at least the late C19 - I'd have to trawl through some of my deeply buried notes, but I think I have a reference from the 1880s. In the C18 and early C19, Cobbett, (that wonderfully irascible reporter who thought that potatoes were fit only for pigs and Irishmen - though perhaps a little too good for the latter!) invariably refered to Londonas "The Great Wen" - but that was before the Industrial Revoution had made London really smoky. I have a feeling that Edinbuurgh had its soubriquet of "Auld Reekie" long before that - am I right, Jo? Maybe the inhabitants could afford bigger and better fires than the Londoners - or maybe it's because Edinburgh is a damned cold place! 
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#10601
11/22/2000 8:43 PM
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Joined: Jul 2000
Posts: 1,094
old hand
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old hand
Joined: Jul 2000
Posts: 1,094 |
All right, I'm nearly afraid to ask...Flying Pig City????
I can't even imagine what would bring about such a nickname
If I remember correctly, the nickname comes from the days when Cincinnati was a major pork producing city. I assume it refers to the little piggies' souls going up to heaven.
Somewhat morbid? Yes, but I didn't make it up.
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#10602
11/22/2000 11:43 PM
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Joined: Nov 2000
Posts: 3,146
Carpal Tunnel
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Carpal Tunnel
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In reply to:
Max Quordlepleen wrote: "NZ's largest City Auckland (Tamaki Makarau) is widely known as The City of Sails"
Max is, of course, using the marketing term for Auckland. To the rest of NZ, it is almost universally referred to (or at least thought of) as Jafaland. This is thought of, in polite circles, as a reference to "Jaffas", a small, spheroid, orange-flavoured sweet (candy) which children used to throw at the movie screen or roll down the wooden floors of picture theatres.
The truth is less prosaic. "Jafa", in this instance, is a polite acronym for "Just Another F---g Aucklander". Jafaland is the natural extension of the adjective to a place name. As you do. In the vernacular, of course.
There is an endearing and enduring popular belief that Auckland, our largest city, exists solely as a repository for all the crazed, demented souls in Godzone who regard "Shortland Street" as the acme or sine qua non of New Zealand culture.
The idiot also known as Capfka ...
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#10603
11/23/2000 1:51 AM
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Joined: Aug 2000
Posts: 3,409
Carpal Tunnel
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Carpal Tunnel
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The truth is less prosaic. "Jafa", in this instance, is a polite acronym for "Just Another F---g Aucklander".Now, now, CK - you're just just getting bitter. After all you and I need to remember that since we live South of the Bombay Hills, we don't actually exist in the extremely Platonic worldview shared by all Jafas.
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#10604
11/23/2000 3:58 AM
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Joined: Nov 2000
Posts: 3,146
Carpal Tunnel
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Carpal Tunnel
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Now, now, CK - you're just just getting bitter. After all you and I need to remember that since we live South of the Bombay Hills, we don't actually exist in the extremely Platonic worldview shared by all Jafas.
No, Max, not bitter. Just delighted to know that (a) I'm not one, and (b) that to them I have an existence somewhat similar to Heidinger's cat ... I may exist, then again I may not. And - in an extension of quantum physics well-understood and much loved by Jafas, the corollary is "who cares - if you don't live in Auckland you may as well not exist"!
The idiot also known as Capfka ...
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#10605
11/23/2000 7:42 AM
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Joined: Mar 2000
Posts: 1,004
old hand
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old hand
Joined: Mar 2000
Posts: 1,004 |
For a poetic city title, how about Oxford: The City of the Dreaming Spires?
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#10606
11/23/2000 1:16 PM
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Joined: Apr 2000
Posts: 10,542
Carpal Tunnel
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Carpal Tunnel
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In reply to:
that to them I have an existence somewhat similar to Heidinger's cat...
Cap, it's always nice to have a bit of quantum mechanics thrown in to the mix, but I believe the cat was Shroedinger's (or not, as the case may be... 8^)
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#10607
11/23/2000 1:40 PM
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Joined: Oct 2000
Posts: 1,346
veteran
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veteran
Joined: Oct 2000
Posts: 1,346 |
I believe the cat was Shroedinger'sHa! Cats don't belong to anybody - they just make slightly more use of one particular human's furniture and food supplies. Actually I've just independently resolved the question "is Shroedinger's cat dead or alive?" The cat would have to be dead for it to be possible to get it into the box in the first place. 
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#10608
11/23/2000 1:46 PM
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Joined: Apr 2000
Posts: 10,542
Carpal Tunnel
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Carpal Tunnel
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...not necessarily; it's just slightly more difficult than, but done along the same lines as, getting a ship into a bottle.
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#10609
11/23/2000 1:50 PM
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Joined: Oct 2000
Posts: 1,346
veteran
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Flying Pig City... I assume it refers to the little piggies' souls going up to heaven.JazzO, does talk of flying pigs have connotations of total impossibility over your side of the Pond? Here we'd talk about completing a project with an unrealistic timescale "at the same time as building a runway for the flying pigs". Or someone says "Yes, I'm sure we can do that" and somebody else points out of the window and says "Look! A flying pig!" Interesting that fish on a bike isn't used in the same way, as on the face of it there's some kind of relationship. Which I would, of course, strenuously deny.
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#10610
11/23/2000 2:42 PM
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Joined: Mar 2000
Posts: 1,004
old hand
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old hand
Joined: Mar 2000
Posts: 1,004 |
...pears in liqueurs, perhaps they're just grown in there.
Of course, given the uncertainty of quantum physics, perhaps you don't even have to know whether or not there's a cat in there - even that would collapse some wave function. (Speaking of which, if a quantum physicist went to observe the beaches in Hawaii, would the breakers all become swells?)
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#10611
11/24/2000 3:21 AM
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Joined: Sep 2000
Posts: 2,891
Carpal Tunnel
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Carpal Tunnel
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Here, it is usually said "oh ya, when pigs fly" with a bit of a smarmy sneer and a roll of the eyes.
So if it’s o.k. with you guys, I prefer to think of The Flying Pig City as a place where the impossible can happen than - not where all those slaughtered little piglet souls are flying about.
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#10612
11/24/2000 9:43 AM
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Joined: Apr 2000
Posts: 3,065
Carpal Tunnel
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Carpal Tunnel
Joined: Apr 2000
Posts: 3,065 |
I make my average since I started posting about 1.8 per day, which means I should become an addict just in time for Christmas. So, what should I ask Father Christmas for to celebrate?
Bingley
Bingley
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#10613
11/24/2000 10:38 AM
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Joined: Oct 2000
Posts: 1,346
veteran
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veteran
Joined: Oct 2000
Posts: 1,346 |
[greenI should become an addict just in time for Christmas. So, what should I ask Father Christmas for to celebrate? Pity perhaps, Bingley? Alternatively a fine selection of distilled alcoholic beverages has appeared here: http://wordsmith.org/board/showthreaded.pl?Board=words&Number=8783Whilst you're at it, could you ask Santa if he knows anywhere I can get a Thunderbird 2 for Crimble? For my son, of course...
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#10614
11/24/2000 11:46 AM
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Joined: Aug 2000
Posts: 2,204
Pooh-Bah
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Pooh-Bah
Joined: Aug 2000
Posts: 2,204 |
Bingley, I presume the most appropriate gift for you would be cold turkey?
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#10615
11/24/2000 12:00 PM
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Joined: Aug 2000
Posts: 2,204
Pooh-Bah
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Pooh-Bah
Joined: Aug 2000
Posts: 2,204 |
you don't even have to know whether or not there's a cat in thereMaybe not - but I can assure you that no one could be near a cat in a box and not know about it. The soundproofing has yet to be invented that could drown out that noise! I believe that even profound deafness would not be proof against the sound of an incarcerated moggy. As to getting the animal in there in the first place, every cat has its price. For one of mine, it is cucumber - of which she is inordinately fond. But for all three, cheese would do the trick - two will attempt fratricide in order to get at any sort of cheese (except Parmesan) whilst the third will use any sort of confidence trick for the chance to get even a nibble of the stuff. (That's the female one, of course  ) Their best trick, of course, is to eat plenty of cheese and then sit by a mousehole with bated breath.
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#10616
11/24/2000 12:09 PM
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Joined: Mar 2000
Posts: 1,004
old hand
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old hand
Joined: Mar 2000
Posts: 1,004 |
Their best trick, of course, is to eat plenty of cheese and then sit by a mousehole with bated breath.
I suppose it would have been too obvious to say baited breath...
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#10617
11/24/2000 2:11 PM
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Joined: Oct 2000
Posts: 1,346
veteran
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veteran
Joined: Oct 2000
Posts: 1,346 |
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#10618
11/24/2000 2:44 PM
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Joined: Aug 2000
Posts: 2,204
Pooh-Bah
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Pooh-Bah
Joined: Aug 2000
Posts: 2,204 |
been too obvious to say baited breath...which is why I didn't
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#10619
11/25/2000 7:05 AM
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Joined: Apr 2000
Posts: 3,065
Carpal Tunnel
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Carpal Tunnel
Joined: Apr 2000
Posts: 3,065 |
In reply to:
the most appropriate gift for you would be cold turkey
sandwiches, salad, ...
Bingley
Bingley
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#10620
11/25/2000 1:14 PM
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Joined: Mar 2000
Posts: 11,613
Carpal Tunnel
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Carpal Tunnel
Joined: Mar 2000
Posts: 11,613 |
the most appropriate gift for you would be cold turkey
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sandwiches, salad, ...
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--noodle soup, a la king...
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#10621
11/25/2000 10:10 PM
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Joined: Jul 2000
Posts: 1,094
old hand
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old hand
Joined: Jul 2000
Posts: 1,094 |
So if it’s o.k. with you guys, I prefer to think of The Flying Pig City as a place where the impossible can happen than - not where all those slaughtered little piglet souls are flying about.
Well, Jerry Springer was the mayor of Porkopolis in the late '70s.
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#10622
11/26/2000 2:25 PM
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Joined: Mar 2000
Posts: 1,981
Pooh-Bah
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Pooh-Bah
Joined: Mar 2000
Posts: 1,981 |
>Does anyone have any more out there?
I think that Chicago is know as the Windy City, a title sometimes borrowed by Edinburgh.
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