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#103408 05/16/2003 1:06 PM
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I question the pronunciation given. I have a clear recollection of French "puis" being pronounced "pwee".


#103409 05/16/2003 1:12 PM
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Guess it depends on whether you want to pronounce it in French or English. AHD4 offers both. M-W adds a third, im-'pyü-&- s&n(t)s


#103410 05/16/2003 1:21 PM
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AHD prefers this pronunciation, but has both. MWCD has it the other way 'round.
im-pyoo'-i-snse, im-pwis'-snse

wouldn't the French make it im-pwee-sance' ?


#103411 05/16/2003 3:30 PM
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Where are velMarduk and Rouspeteur when we need them?


#103412 05/16/2003 3:42 PM
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wouldn't the French make it im-pwee-sance' ?

Am-pwee-sance, as we were taught it.


#103413 05/16/2003 4:39 PM
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Oh, OK. Pseudo-French. Whadda buncha nit pickers.


#103414 05/16/2003 4:48 PM
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Dear Faldage: having learned it right, must we bow, and ape the idiots who merely guessed at the pronunciation?


#103415 05/16/2003 4:54 PM
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bow, and ape the idiots

Ic nat þe þu secgest.


#103416 05/16/2003 4:56 PM
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It would be more like em-pwee-sahns in Canadian French (first letter like the 'e' in 'get', Kiwis excluded). There's a difference from French French in the nasal vowels before m's and n's. I just figured this out recently. You say Moulin as Moo-lawn, we would say Moo-len, sort of. (I noticed it when I kept hearing people say the name of the movie Moulin Rouge). I've been studying the French channels (French Canadian and French French) to confirm my suspicion, and I think I'm right. 'Twould be nice to hear from a real Canadian Francophone to confirm, though.


#103417 05/17/2003 6:53 AM
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>(first letter like the 'e' in 'get', Kiwis excluded).

'Tis always thus - my poor sammarinese friend, who is learning English, has a dreadful time translating our vowels into those he was taught as being standard English.


#103418 05/17/2003 7:10 AM
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Don't worry, they'll all learn eventually. We must just have patience ...


#103419 05/17/2003 1:14 PM
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Then there is "suite".
suite - usually pronounced "sweet" but pronounced "soot" by some.
n.
5Fr: see SUIT6
1 a group of attendants or servants; train; retinue; staff
2 a set or series of related things; specif., a) a group of connected rooms used as a unit, such as an apartment b) a set of pieces of matched furniture for a given room !a

Then there is "pursuit" My dictionary does not say so, but
it seems possible it is related to French "poursuivre"
I confess to mocking a boyhood friend who pronounced it
"perswit". So many traps for the consistent.


#103420 05/17/2003 3:51 PM
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poursuivre

any relation to "persevere"?

doesn't really look it in m-w, but seems interesting enough to comment...



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#103421 05/17/2003 4:20 PM
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Dear etaoin: sounds related, I have no idea how close, or how to check it. My dictionary goes back to Latin perseverus = very severe


#103422 05/17/2003 5:13 PM
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AHD3 traces pursuit to Anglo-Norman so I guess we don't have to expect it to be all that close to any orthodox French relatives. My French dictionary (Larousse) list poursuivre in the same entry as poursuite and defines it as to pursue; to seek; to annoy, to beset… Sounds like, if not proof of realtion, at least confirmatory evidence.


#103423 05/18/2003 7:23 AM
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suivre in french is the same as in Italian seguire = to follow.


#103424 05/18/2003 11:45 AM
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and now we can segue to another subject, it will follow this....


#103425 05/18/2003 12:47 PM
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Thanks for the second opinion, Emanuela. It kinda cuts off the severus connection.


#103426 05/18/2003 1:04 PM
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Which reminds me of "pursuivant"
pursuivant
n.
5ME pursevante < OFr poursuivant, prp. of poursuivre < poursuir: see PURSUE6
1 in the British Heralds‘ College, an officer ranking below a herald
2 a follower; attendant



#103427 05/18/2003 5:04 PM
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ok. I'm confused. can someone clarify what's been found so far?
here's what I think I'm reading:
the dictionaries don't show any connection between persevere and poursuivre, but yet there seems to be.

sorry for my ignorance...



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#103428 05/18/2003 6:15 PM
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don't show any connection between persevere and poursuivre, but yet there seems to be.

Right and wrong respectively. Any connection between -severe and -suivre is purely coincidental.


#103429 05/18/2003 6:24 PM
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ah. knew I was confused. thanks! glad I stuck with it...




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