#32423
06/15/2001 2:19 PM
|
Joined: Mar 2000
Posts: 218
enthusiast
|
|
enthusiast
Joined: Mar 2000
Posts: 218 |
On NPR this morning, I again heard this phrase: Fewer employees are working fewer hours...
This almost always makes my mind do a doubletake. Do they mean the average hours for all employees are dropping (could indicate less productivity), or that a decreasing number of employees are working part time (could indicate more productivity)?
Any ideas (not on this sentence per se, but on the use of fewer...fewer)?
Brandon
|
|
|
#32424
06/15/2001 2:59 PM
|
Joined: Jan 2001
Posts: 1,156
old hand
|
|
old hand
Joined: Jan 2001
Posts: 1,156 |
I take it to mean that they have reduced two things, the number of employees, and the number of hours per employee, thus drastically reducing the number of man(!)-hours. That sort of thing.
|
|
|
#32425
06/15/2001 3:04 PM
|
Joined: Jan 2001
Posts: 13,858
Carpal Tunnel
|
|
Carpal Tunnel
Joined: Jan 2001
Posts: 13,858 |
It seems to me that the phrase means that the number of employees working less that 40 hours per week has decreased.
|
|
|
#32426
06/15/2001 3:07 PM
|
Joined: Jan 2001
Posts: 1,156
old hand
|
|
old hand
Joined: Jan 2001
Posts: 1,156 |
I saw it in a more negative light - previously they had more full-time employees - now they are expecting fewer employees to do all the same work, with the additional challenge of the remaining employees only working fewer hours each. (Cynicism brought on by first-hand experience.) Without the rest of the sentence, it's hard to tell.
|
|
|
#32427
06/15/2001 3:09 PM
|
Joined: Sep 2000
Posts: 4,757
Carpal Tunnel
|
|
Carpal Tunnel
Joined: Sep 2000
Posts: 4,757 |
To say it is an inelegant construction...   But if we turn it on its head and say "More people are working more hours", I suspect we would all understand the same thing - a greater number are working overtime. As soon as such a construction makes you stop and think, it becomes self defeating as a tool of communication, doesn't it?
|
|
|
#32428
06/15/2001 3:11 PM
|
Joined: Mar 2000
Posts: 218
enthusiast
|
|
enthusiast
Joined: Mar 2000
Posts: 218 |
The meaning of the commentary was clear. They are reducing the workforce and cutting the work force's hours. But I'm troubled by the usage. There seems to be a high level of potential ambiguity.
Maybe written by an aspiring political speech-writer??
Brandon
|
|
|
#32429
06/15/2001 3:14 PM
|
Joined: Dec 2000
Posts: 13,803
Carpal Tunnel
|
|
Carpal Tunnel
Joined: Dec 2000
Posts: 13,803 |
…such a construction makes you stop and think…
And we wouldn't want that, would we.
|
|
|
#32430
06/15/2001 3:40 PM
|
Joined: Sep 2000
Posts: 4,757
Carpal Tunnel
|
|
Carpal Tunnel
Joined: Sep 2000
Posts: 4,757 |
About the form, in news reports - no! the substance: yes!
|
|
|
#32431
06/15/2001 4:12 PM
|
Joined: Dec 2000
Posts: 13,803
Carpal Tunnel
|
|
Carpal Tunnel
Joined: Dec 2000
Posts: 13,803 |
Sorry, mav. Couldn't resist (I'm weak; I deserve to be punished).
|
|
|
#32432
06/15/2001 4:19 PM
|
Joined: Sep 2000
Posts: 4,757
Carpal Tunnel
|
|
Carpal Tunnel
Joined: Sep 2000
Posts: 4,757 |
Are you hearing this, E?
|
|
|
#32433
06/15/2001 5:38 PM
|
Joined: Jan 2001
Posts: 1,773
Pooh-Bah
|
|
Pooh-Bah
Joined: Jan 2001
Posts: 1,773 |
AnnaS's packing checklist: ___ favorite chair ___ clothes ___ Grandma's linens ___ leather goods ___ whips ___ chains ___ monogrammed towels ("S" and "M"*) * Sabbath and Mabel  ?
|
|
|
#32434
06/15/2001 5:43 PM
|
Joined: Dec 2000
Posts: 13,803
Carpal Tunnel
|
|
Carpal Tunnel
Joined: Dec 2000
Posts: 13,803 |
But whips and chains excite me.
|
|
|
#32435
06/15/2001 6:32 PM
|
Joined: Oct 2000
Posts: 5,400
Carpal Tunnel
|
|
Carpal Tunnel
Joined: Oct 2000
Posts: 5,400 |
that's more than we want to know!
(unless of course you're setting up a web cam and we can all watch... free x rated internet!)
|
|
|
#32436
06/15/2001 7:02 PM
|
Joined: Mar 2000
Posts: 315
enthusiast
|
|
enthusiast
Joined: Mar 2000
Posts: 315 |
|
|
|
#32437
06/15/2001 7:21 PM
|
Joined: Dec 2000
Posts: 2,661
Carpal Tunnel
|
|
Carpal Tunnel
Joined: Dec 2000
Posts: 2,661 |
Thanks, emanuela. That's at least the second time the elusive E has surfaced. Mav...
|
|
|
#32438
06/15/2001 7:28 PM
|
Joined: Oct 2000
Posts: 5,400
Carpal Tunnel
|
|
Carpal Tunnel
Joined: Oct 2000
Posts: 5,400 |
Yes-- have you noticed, Faldage? It your love perhaps planning a vacation to wales? do we a three-some going on here? or is mav trying to steal away your lady love.. (perhaps he already has a set of whips and chains)
and the there is all the traffic in PM's.. who knows what going on in private!
|
|
|
#32439
06/15/2001 7:29 PM
|
Joined: Mar 2001
Posts: 508
addict
|
|
addict
Joined: Mar 2001
Posts: 508 |
the elusive E E as in Elizabeth? Better known here as AnnaStrophic? Currently the other half (with Faldage) of our Dynamic Duo? Just asking. 
|
|
|
#32440
06/15/2001 7:30 PM
|
Joined: Dec 2000
Posts: 13,803
Carpal Tunnel
|
|
Carpal Tunnel
Joined: Dec 2000
Posts: 13,803 |
|
|
|
#32441
06/15/2001 7:36 PM
|
Joined: Dec 2000
Posts: 2,661
Carpal Tunnel
|
|
Carpal Tunnel
Joined: Dec 2000
Posts: 2,661 |
I'll stick with my personal *assumption that E is artfully a B, and the definition of E is still around the corner and over the next horizon. 
|
|
|
#32442
06/15/2001 7:38 PM
|
Joined: Dec 2000
Posts: 13,803
Carpal Tunnel
|
|
Carpal Tunnel
Joined: Dec 2000
Posts: 13,803 |
|
|
|
#32443
06/15/2001 7:44 PM
|
Joined: Mar 2000
Posts: 218
enthusiast
|
|
enthusiast
Joined: Mar 2000
Posts: 218 |
I've been welcomed back by so many of you. Thanks.
Now, especially in light of these recent postings, I need to pay much more attention to the sexes of you all. Honestly, I think I've let my mind artificially construct genders based on who-knows-what (subconscious interpretations of things mentioned in threads) for those whose names aren't gender-obvious.
If I want to wink-wink (or even understand others winking), I'd better get on board. (this reminds me of a horrible experience I had reading a book; for several pages, the narrator's gender was not mentioned, and I unwittingly constructed a gender. When it became apparent I was wrong, I had a hard time going forward with the plot because all my mental constructions were failing me...)
Brandon
|
|
|
#32444
06/15/2001 7:54 PM
|
Joined: Oct 2000
Posts: 5,400
Carpal Tunnel
|
|
Carpal Tunnel
Joined: Oct 2000
Posts: 5,400 |
|
|
|
#32445
06/15/2001 8:03 PM
|
Joined: Dec 2000
Posts: 2,661
Carpal Tunnel
|
|
Carpal Tunnel
Joined: Dec 2000
Posts: 2,661 |
Now you've opened the flood gates... Whos gender have you misguessed?
|
|
|
#32446
06/15/2001 10:26 PM
|
Joined: Feb 2001
Posts: 387
enthusiast
|
|
enthusiast
Joined: Feb 2001
Posts: 387 |
this reminds me of a horrible experience I had reading a book; for several pages, the narrator's gender was not mentioned, and I unwittingly constructed a gender. When it became apparent I was wrong, I had a hard time going forward with the plot because all my mental constructions were failing me.
That's nothing. Once I totally mistook a narrator's species. I thought he was a dog, but then it turned out he was a human and the cat's name was Cat. The cat's name was what confused me.
|
|
|
#32447
06/15/2001 10:34 PM
|
Joined: Dec 2000
Posts: 2,661
Carpal Tunnel
|
|
Carpal Tunnel
Joined: Dec 2000
Posts: 2,661 |
|
|
|
#32448
06/15/2001 11:20 PM
|
Joined: Feb 2001
Posts: 387
enthusiast
|
|
enthusiast
Joined: Feb 2001
Posts: 387 |
Nope, this was after I joined. How did I know someone would say that?
|
|
|
#32449
06/16/2001 12:44 AM
|
Joined: Mar 2001
Posts: 4,189
Carpal Tunnel
|
|
Carpal Tunnel
Joined: Mar 2001
Posts: 4,189 |
Did you check my profile before you dubbed me "Mr." O'Neill, Brandon? ON FEWER...FEWER: Maybe written by an aspiring political speech-writer?? Sure...it's called ownership and management. They've been downsizing for years, and now that they're complaining about the decreased workforce and hourly output they want to work enough ambiguity into the statement so then can shirk responsibility for causing it! Does the word "propoganda" come to mind?
|
|
|
#32450
06/16/2001 1:46 AM
|
Joined: Dec 2000
Posts: 2,661
Carpal Tunnel
|
|
Carpal Tunnel
Joined: Dec 2000
Posts: 2,661 |
...and if the word used was 'less' instead of 'fewer'... could we make it more or less ultravague. Someone with more lingustic creativity than I (anyone ackchully) could CAT (combine appropriate threads) together a construction... I know there is one in here... somewhere... As soon as such a construction makes you stop and think, it becomes self defeating as a tool of communication, doesn't it? Is this the same form of cognitive dissonance that we enjoy when comedians are successful? NTTAWWT ps - I think you are correct!
|
|
|
#32451
06/16/2001 11:55 AM
|
Joined: Mar 2000
Posts: 6,511
Carpal Tunnel
|
|
Carpal Tunnel
Joined: Mar 2000
Posts: 6,511 |
 I leave this place for a day and you guys descend into the gutter hi Jackie!Helen, I hadn't considered a threesome, but your suggestion is under review . Brandon, what's my gender? wow,* re: packing list - are you a mind-reader? OK, enough emoticons for now. *edit: oops, rather, Sparteye!
|
|
|
#32452
06/18/2001 11:14 AM
|
Joined: Dec 2000
Posts: 13,803
Carpal Tunnel
|
|
Carpal Tunnel
Joined: Dec 2000
Posts: 13,803 |
AnnaS's packing checklist:
.
.
.
___ monogrammed towels ("S" and "M"*)
This point got me wondering, so I checked with Anna and she said that, no, they weren't labeled "S" and "M", but rather "B" and "D"*. Since this made perfect sense to me I can only assume that you got this confused with something else, Sparteye, although I am hard pressed to say what it might have been.
*For Betsy and David, of course.
|
|
|
|
|
