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Joined: Mar 2010
Posts: 1
stranger
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stranger
Joined: Mar 2010
Posts: 1 |
Hi all,
Given the definition of today's word, I am thinking that potlatch islikely where the more commonly used potluck comes from.
Is that a correct assumption to make?
Thanks in advance for your answers.
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Joined: Dec 2000
Posts: 13,803
Carpal Tunnel
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Carpal Tunnel
Joined: Dec 2000
Posts: 13,803 |
Sounds like a WAG to me. It's more like the luck of what's in the pot.
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Joined: Jun 2006
Posts: 5,295
Carpal Tunnel
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Carpal Tunnel
Joined: Jun 2006
Posts: 5,295 |
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Joined: Aug 2005
Posts: 3,290
Carpal Tunnel
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Carpal Tunnel
Joined: Aug 2005
Posts: 3,290 |
I doubt it. The first citation for potluck is the late 16th century (in an English work), and that for potlatch is the late 19th century (in a US government document). Potlatch is from a Native American trading language called Chinook Jargon.
Ceci n'est pas un seing.
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Joined: Aug 2001
Posts: 11,074 Likes: 2
Carpal Tunnel
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Carpal Tunnel
Joined: Aug 2001
Posts: 11,074 Likes: 2 |
I learned about the potlatch in 1959-ish, (all right, 1959 exactly) in a course dealing with (among other things) the Kwakiutl Indians, taught by one Clyde Kluckhohn, who should be authoritative. Is Chinook then the language-group of the Kwakiutl?
(The potlatch was described as an annual ritual during which the tribe gathered each year at the banks of the Columbia River to feast, and the wealthy of the tribe threw stuff into the river. Whoever threw away the most was declared the richest man in the tribe for that year. The word thus goes a step beyond Anu's posted definition -- not simply "lavish gifts," but extravagance and vanity to the point of folly, at least as seen through the filter of Western eyes.)
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Joined: Jun 2000
Posts: 724
old hand
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old hand
Joined: Jun 2000
Posts: 724 |
The word thus goes a step beyond Anu's posted definition -- not simply "lavish gifts," but extravagance and vanity to the point of folly, at least as seen through the filter of Western eyes.)
I suppose these customs appear wasteful to wastern eyes in the manner that 'food fights' appear wasteful to non wastern eyes. Not much of a difference in my eyes - yeast or waste. ":)"
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Joined: Jun 2006
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Carpal Tunnel
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Carpal Tunnel
Joined: Jun 2006
Posts: 5,295 |
The difference being that frome the Chinook waste at least the fishes could profit while foodfights are pure stupid.
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Joined: Dec 2000
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Carpal Tunnel
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Carpal Tunnel
Joined: Dec 2000
Posts: 13,803 |
The difference being that frome the Chinook waste at least the fishes could profit while foodfights are pure stupid. Tell that to the rats and cockroaches.
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Joined: Mar 2010
Posts: 41
newbie
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newbie
Joined: Mar 2010
Posts: 41 |
Does anyone know if this word related to pahaska, as in "Pahaska Tepee" which was William "Buffalo Bill" Cody's place in Wyoming?
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Joined: Aug 2005
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Carpal Tunnel
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Carpal Tunnel
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Is Chinook then the language-group of the Kwakiutl?The Chinook Jargon is a pidgin-creole ( link). As a result, it has heavy influences from more than one language family: Wakashan ( link), Chinookan ( link), and Indo-European (i.e., English). The word potlatch probably has its origin in the Nuu-chah-nulth (aka Nootka) p'achitl. (Many Native languages of the Pacific Northwest have complicated phonologies with ejective and glottalized consonants. The term Kwakiutl (an innovation of Franz Boas) has mainly been replaced since the '80s by the ethnonym Kwakwaka'wakw. Their language, Kwak'wala ( link) is in the Northern Wakashan language family.
Ceci n'est pas un seing.
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Joined: Jun 2006
Posts: 5,295
Carpal Tunnel
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Carpal Tunnel
Joined: Jun 2006
Posts: 5,295 |
The difference being that frome the Chinook waste at least the fishes could profit while foodfights are pure stupid. Tell that to the rats and cockroaches. Come on, they don't throw it at eachother and waste it for fun. That can make me real furious.
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Joined: Dec 2006
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old hand
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old hand
Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 956 |
Does anyone know if this word related to pahaska, as in "Pahaska Tepee" which was William "Buffalo Bill" Cody's place in Wyoming?
I take it you are referring to:
[From Chinook Jargon, from Nootka patshatl (to give, gift).]
From all accounts I've come across, Pahashka means 'Long Hair'
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Joined: Sep 2009
Posts: 95
journeyman
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journeyman
Joined: Sep 2009
Posts: 95 |
What I learned about this in Alaska is that the Potlatch was more about the redistribution and sharing of wealth. Our Tlingit guide told us that those invited to a potlatch we expected to reciprocate in the next 3-5 years. I has missed this string earlier today when I put my other post up. a potlatch would be marked by a ring on the family's totem pole. the more rings the wealthier the family. You can check my photos on photobucket.com and search kahrnh to view the albums.
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