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Joined: Jun 2007
Posts: 18
stranger
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OP
stranger
Joined: Jun 2007
Posts: 18 |
limit ourselves...." or "We need not to limit ourselves...."
Concerning sentences similar to these, which is correct?
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Joined: Mar 2000
Posts: 11,613
Carpal Tunnel
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Carpal Tunnel
Joined: Mar 2000
Posts: 11,613 |
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Joined: Mar 2000
Posts: 6,511
Carpal Tunnel
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Carpal Tunnel
Joined: Mar 2000
Posts: 6,511 |
Need is a strange little modal verb. "We need not go", yet "we don't need to go." Other modals (could, would, should, etc) are much more clear-cut. That's not much of an explanation, just an observation.
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Joined: Aug 2002
Posts: 2,154
Pooh-Bah
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Pooh-Bah
Joined: Aug 2002
Posts: 2,154 |
Took me a minute to see which to you referred to Jackie.
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Joined: Mar 2000
Posts: 11,613
Carpal Tunnel
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Carpal Tunnel
Joined: Mar 2000
Posts: 11,613 |
Took me a minute to see which to you referred to Jackie. Talk about your clear-cut statements!  (Man, these smileys are weird-looking!)
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Joined: Dec 2000
Posts: 13,803
Carpal Tunnel
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Carpal Tunnel
Joined: Dec 2000
Posts: 13,803 |
The problem is in the ignorant English-language assumption that the infinitive is always of the form "to base verb form" unlike other closely related languages where there is a distinct infinitive form. In BC's example the limit is an infinitive and, as Jackie stated, doesn't need the "to".
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Joined: Mar 2000
Posts: 1,027
old hand
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old hand
Joined: Mar 2000
Posts: 1,027 |
limit is an infinitive and, as Jackie stated, doesn't need the "to".
But what do you make with a sentence like: We wouldn't have needed to limit ourselves.. ? "limit" is infinitive here as well, or isn't it?
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Joined: Mar 2000
Posts: 6,511
Carpal Tunnel
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Carpal Tunnel
Joined: Mar 2000
Posts: 6,511 |
Yes, it's an infinitive. Like I said, *ahem* -- need is a modal exception that sometimes takes the to form of the infinitive and sometimes doesn't. It may indeed be the only one. I'll try to find a link to an expert who can explain it better than I, unless Nuncle Z decides to take on the mission...
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Joined: Mar 2000
Posts: 11,613
Carpal Tunnel
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Carpal Tunnel
Joined: Mar 2000
Posts: 11,613 |
Well I certainly need (to have) an expert. I know these are correct, but I sure couldn't say why:
We need to limit ourselves.
We don't need to limit ourselves.
We need not limit ourselves.
We have to limit ourselves.
We don't have to limit ourselves.
We must limit ourselves.
We must not limit ourselves.
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Joined: Dec 2000
Posts: 13,803
Carpal Tunnel
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Carpal Tunnel
Joined: Dec 2000
Posts: 13,803 |
"We need limit ourselves" would also be standard, but not in many USn dialects.
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