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blanshard
I are impressed, tsuwm. (I had to LIU.) I don't think I've ever had an original thought--I'm with Bill.
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addict
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I shudder to think anyone has ever thought these thoughts before! [maniacle-e]
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Carpal Tunnel
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Kiwi, I quite agree with your first paragraph, except possibley the conclusion. Surely, as you say, one's thoughts are derivative of one's experience. But if that means that every idea is "by definition derivative" -- that is, that there is no such thing as an "original idea" (that the last phrase is an oxymoron) -- then how did any ideas EVER arise?
And quite clearly they do arise from time to time -- else no ideas would ever enter the human experience, and we would have no more ideas than did our caveman ancestors.
The distinction is, perhaps, that an idea is created by adding one's insight to the underlying experience. That addition is a creative act, much as baking a cake is to create something, even though that cake is "derivative" of the flour, milk and eggs. In other words, an idea (like a cake) can be original, though it will of course derive from and extend pre-existing ideas and knowledge.
Of course, what I just said does not address tsuwm's challenging question of how often, and by what process, original ideas arise.
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stranger
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stranger
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In my opinion an original thought is a personal eureka moment. It is a thought that switches on the light (about something) in your head, and the enlightenment seems so brilliant that you feel you are the only one thinking this way. Actually every thought has been thought before. Contextually the thought is original for that time, for that person, for that instance.
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old hand
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in a parallel universe, modestgoddess suggests: I thought I'd had an original thought - is there such a thing anymore?I think the answer is YES but,  Let's quibble... original? Every particle in the universe is original if only inasmuch as each occupies a unit of space peculiar to itself. It follows that every construction built from these is therefore original so obviously that can't be the question that tsuwm is asking. thought?If a particle is real then a "thought" is a million times more real. The most minute bit of a "thought" involves billions of chemical and electrical interchanges that mathematically make each unique to each other, therefore, thats not what tsuwm was talking about. Well then, Smart Ass, what was tsuwm talking about?Mr. tsuwm, as is his wont, was talking about "words". Words are the activators of...er...action. So, tsuwm must have been talking about a series of word-thoughts that could be combined to effect new action for mankind, as well as manunkind. Original Thoughts are easy. In the nineteen word quote from tsuwm's post above, the english language allows about one billion trillion recombinations. Looks like we could find a few good ones out of that big bunch. Doncha think?
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Carpal Tunnel
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When atomic nuclei are split, does not it sometimes produce matter that isn't present in our perceptions of nature? Then, the first person to identify that element must surely have had an original thought at that point. This is the eureka, the epiphany, yet it still stands in context with what was already known, thus derivative. This is a bit of a murky muck, this means of meaning.
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to wit: "I agree with milum's post" - maxq The end I fear, is near, my dear,
All things have jumped their Phylum,
Ducks climb trees and cats swim seas,
And Max agrees with Milum.
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Carpal Tunnel
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"...tsuwm's challenging question of how often, and by what process, original ideas arise. Now there's an original thought. ...a new arrangement of or an extrapoloation of existing knowledge.I was going to make this point directly, but now that would be approaching plagerism, wouldn't it?  People ask me all the time: You are a musician, why is your recording collection so small? (No more than 50 total) I answer them: Music is a very personal experience, and I like to keep it and promote it that way. I'd rather go hear a live performance and support live performance by my pressence there. This also limits my repetitive exposure to specific acoustics. The sound coming out of your recording device is limited by the speakers, the technology, the media (broadcast/cd's/phonograph), the recording technique, the room recorded in, and finally the performer. Live music it's most often me, the perfomer(s) and a bit of a room, which I consider a step in the right direction as it pertains to quality. But this also limits my exposure to a certain quantity, and this is essential for me being a composer. It allows me to focus on melodic ideas little longer... letting them mull over in my minds ear without being bombarded by new ideas all the time. Very rarely do I have a chance here in the 'big city' to be in a place of silence. There is just too much "inspiration". Kinda makes it so your doomed to not have the opportunity to have an original thought (acoustically, that is).
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Carpal Tunnel
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The end I fear, is near, my dear,
All things have jumped their Phylum,
Ducks climb trees and cats swim seas,
And Max agrees with Milum.
That may be the most amazing snippet of writing I have ever read! Thank you!
Is it a take-off of something else (if so, what?) or entirely sui generis?
In awe,
Keiva
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