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"More power to him then"Ah, yes, those were the words of the prison priest upon hearing that Clancy, who was about to be electrocuted, had gotten religion. 
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Carpal Tunnel
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Electrocution is stupid. I cannot understand why no government I know of has used carbon monoxide, which would be far more humane. The victim feels nothing, as witness the many accidents from it. Far better than lethal injections too.
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[nerve touch warning: Anti-death penalty rhetoric follows]Helen may not like the discussion of rape, but I have my own bete noir. wwh opined that the (US) government should use carbon monoxide to carry out executions. Well it had to be the US, didn't it? No one else in the semi-civilised world is executing people anymore. The Arab countries do a lot of it, of course. But I did qualify "world", didn't I? Here are some very, very American reasons (to my way of thinking) why they wouldn't use carbon monoxide to execute the guilty and innocent alike with such gay abandon: It'd take too long. You couldn't have the executions taking two hours. It's simply not sound-bite material. The prison governor or whoever needs to be able to come out within a few minutes and say "Hey, we did it again!". There's no rope, no drop and jerk, no needles, no electrodes, no clouds of potassium cyanide gas rising from the little can under the chair, no hiss as the pellets hit the water, no crackle as the power hits the electrodes, no visibile and audible punishment. Justice and injustice alike being seen to be done, and all that. The outcome: The witnesses at the execution - and by extension the rest of the nation - wouldn't get their vicarious buzz. And there must be one, since the majority of Americans seem to accept the death penalty. The prison employees wouldn't get to feel all virtuous and wouldn't be able to say things afterwards like "S/he wasn't such a bad person, but we simply carry out the sentence of the court". There's no pizzazz or razzamatazz in that kind of execution. No drama. No proactivity. No market. No potential television rights. And McDonald's, that other great killer of people the world over, wouldn't buy the advertising rights if it were possible. All of which won't be very far away now that the former Governor of Texas is the President, and the President is currently riding on a surge of popularity. Oh, I suppose you could colour the carbon monoxide, but the Supreme Court might see that as a cruel and unusual punishment and we couldn't have the death machine stopped, now could we? The moral majority would never stand for it, and think of all the unemployment it would create. Why, Huntsville in Texas might have to lose its McDonalds, it being the busiest of the death factories in the land of the free. And that could never be allowed. You can't have an insignificant thing like people's lives standing between a hamburger and its consumer, can you? Besides, the FDA might never approve the colouring agent. Could turn out to be dangerous to the health ... And worst of all in a way, no students on a journalism course would get to prove how nearly all of the executions carried out in one state for the past umpteen years had been miscarriages of justice. And one was one too many however you look at it. Better to have no executions, eh? Especially since your (in)justice system seems so ready to condemn the wrong people and to do it with such consistent regularity ...  [/rant]
The idiot also known as Capfka ...
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Dear CK: you repeatedly refer to "the system". The government simply applies the law which has been passed. People on juries make horrible mistakes. But until the people change the law, executions will take place. And I would not swap our "system" for yours.
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Bill, I used the word "system" precisely once. And you could have "ours". I don't want yours!
The idiot also known as Capfka ...
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Dear CK: when enough of the people of the US feel the death penalty should be revoked, it will be. I do not feel that the death penalty is excessive for the worst forms of murder. You bleeding hearts ought to volunteer to provide the millions of dollars it costs to keep a murderer in very comfortable surroundings for the rest of his life. I think the money could better be spent doing more to help the poor. And I'd rather get back to discussing words.
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Without jumping into politics too much, which is my historical wont, I have to comment on a few things. I don't think the general American get's a "buzz" from knowing someone has been executed. Most Americans just feel that justice has been done and the convicted has received what he deserves for committing a crime. The reason we still have the death penalty is because most Americans stand firmly by their Christian roots and conclude that "an eye for an eye" is fair. I can understand how it would be hard to feel normal if I know that the murderer of my sister is a free man. I agree with you that innocent people have unfortunately been victim to an imperfect justice system, but you can't claim that any other system is perfect. Plus, how do you purport to know more about the flaws of the American justice system than we do? I'm a product of our public schools and I know that they teach facts, not propaganda. There aren't national laws requiring teachers to say certain things.
Also, how in the world is McDonalds a death factory?
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actually Jazzo, Americans stand firmly by their Christian roots and conclude that "an eye for an eye", is fair., this is from the old testament, and (EDIT if someone, (Keiva, or Fr. Steve, or someone a better classical knowledge of the OT, (including Keiva's rabbi!) -end of edit can get us details on this particular phrase, as i recall, it is has a specific context, and most of the OT supports the idea "Vengeance is mine" sayeth the Lord.. (see the story of Cain and Abel, and the mark of Cain, etc)
one of the tenet of Christianity, is "turn the other cheek". the Christian thing to do, is to forgive. Not necessarily let them walk the street free to harm others, but there is no justification in Christianity (and almost none in Judaism) for the death penalty. i ain't much of Christian, but i am enough of one, that i can't let that slide..
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careful, ladies and gentlemen .... careful....
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Muted apologies (only muted) for my rant above. If people don't understand the place of McDonald's (and its ilk) in the growing obesity problem around the world, far be it from me to enlighten them. However, you could spare the time to read "Fast Food Nation" by Eric Schlosser.
I don't actually remember criticising any part of the American justice system other than the death penalty and the apparent American attitude towards it. And no, it's not sufficient for people to will something to change. It won't on that basis alone. Inertia is a wonderful thing.
I certainly said nothing about the American education system. I will if you like!
You would be surprised just how much people from outside America pick up about your institutions. The TV people endlessly make documentaries on them, the legal system being a firm favourite.
Neither do I favour people walking around free if they have committed murder or any other really heinous crime. I just don't think that judicial murder is a legitimate alternative when considering penalties.
fin.
The idiot also known as Capfka ...
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