#35645 - 07/14/01 04:15 AM
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Carpal Tunnel
Registered: 08/12/00
Posts: 3409
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#35646 - 07/14/01 08:30 AM
Re: Isn't it ironic?
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old hand
Registered: 12/20/00
Posts: 1055
Loc: Berlin
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Nice Max.
Only one form/meaning of irony is discussed in the article though Max; the other has proved a much harder concept to grasp.
That song 'ironic' is perfect though, eh. I've got to give it to Alanis, she wrote a song called ironic and the only ironic thing about it, is that the woman does not understand the meaning of the word.
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#35648 - 07/14/01 10:07 AM
Re: Isn't it ironic?
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enthusiast
Registered: 01/26/01
Posts: 275
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MAX>>>
SAN FRANCISCO MAN BECOMES FIRST AMERICAN TO GRASP IRONY.
Max, where do you ever find these jewels? I love it!
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#35649 - 07/14/01 11:01 AM
Re: Isn't it ironic?
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enthusiast
Registered: 01/26/01
Posts: 275
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belligerentyouth>>>>
Only one form/meaning of irony is discussed in the article though Max; the other has proved a much harder concept to grasp.
That song 'ironic' is perfect though, eh. I've got to give it to Alanis, she wrote a song called ironic and the only ironic thing about it, is that the woman does not understand the meaning of the word.
Could she be using Socratic irony?
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#35650 - 07/14/01 12:01 PM
Re: Isn't it ironic?
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Carpal Tunnel
Registered: 11/25/00
Posts: 3439
Loc: New England, USA
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Alanis...wrote a song called ironic and the only ironic thing about it, is that the woman does not understand the meaning of the word.
Could she be using Socratic irony?
Is that irony? Or what?
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#35652 - 07/14/01 03:56 PM
Re: Isn't it ironic?
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Carpal Tunnel
Registered: 01/18/01
Posts: 13858
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And all too often irony is straightfaced sarcasm.
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#35653 - 07/14/01 04:00 PM
Re: Isn't it ironic?
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Carpal Tunnel
Registered: 01/18/01
Posts: 13858
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And all too often irony is straightfaced sarcasm.
As when the recipients of the burned steaks said: "They are well done."
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#35654 - 07/15/01 11:48 AM
Re: Isn't it ironic?
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old hand
Registered: 12/20/00
Posts: 1055
Loc: Berlin
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Could she be using Socratic irony?
You decide:
A traffic jam when you're already late
A no-smoking sign on your cigarette break
(http://www.execpc.com/~greysyt/ami.htm)
Sounds like the song should have been called 'D'oh!' if you ask me.
I doubt she was like, considering, like, that sokratic stuff.
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#35656 - 07/18/01 03:20 AM
The overused word, with the underused concept
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old hand
Registered: 12/20/00
Posts: 1055
Loc: Berlin
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>A Harvard English professor
I think he is a tad overqualified to be studying poor Miss M.'s poetic botchery under a bright light.
Compared to some of the Eurotrash on offer here, Alanis really doesn't sound all that bad. You get these French hussies singing handbag house songs, in which a full sentences would be an odd change. Mind you, English is not their first language.
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#35658 - 07/19/01 04:44 AM
Re: The overused word, with the underused concept
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old hand
Registered: 12/20/00
Posts: 1055
Loc: Berlin
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handbag house songs
synonyms:
main-stream, commercial, widely-marketed, cheesy etc.
This can be used when refering to music produced for the masses. Its use (I assume) stems from the '70s custom of ladies putting their handbag in the middle of the dance floor and dancing round it. I of course, can only fall back on heresay concerning this practice, but it seems this was only common in places where very main-stream disco music was played (I guess things like EW&F, Donna Summer, Kool&theGang etc.). Anyone partake in, or view such a ceremony?
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#35661 - 07/19/01 10:24 AM
Re: Handbag dances
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Carpal Tunnel
Registered: 11/25/00
Posts: 3439
Loc: New England, USA
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handbag in the middle of the dance floor and dancing round it .....I've never even heard of that before. Where was I in the 70s?
I was raising two boys and working. Only time I got to a bar was if there was a dead body there - and I had to cover the story!Hi Sparteye
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#35664 - 07/20/01 06:19 AM
Re: Isn't it ironic?
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old hand
Registered: 12/20/00
Posts: 1055
Loc: Berlin
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she used the term contrary to its meaning isn't that irony? Faldage, you know as well as I do that she didn't give 20+ false examples in the song just to call the entire song 'ironic' allowing for the 'metairony' you describe. But I will ask her if I meet her. It could have all made sense though; take this line for example: 'Traffic jam, when you're already late' if she'd made it: Traffic jam, and I'm already late, Go up extra early this morning, Just to avoid the delay. Isn't it ironic, don't you think? YES!!  We just call it lying or stupidity.I don't wish to start some we/us debate. I agree that a lot of remarks that attain the term 'irony' are often plain sarcasm, lying, or stupidity. Stupidity being the fitting alternative when considering that meek woman's song. Such widely used meta-language like 'irony' will always be problematic it seems. infertile@family-planning.com
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#35666 - 07/20/01 08:06 AM
Re: Isn't it ironic?
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addict
Registered: 02/13/01
Posts: 609
Loc: Portsmouth, United Kingdom
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I could care lessanother ukage/usage. In UK we say "I could n't care less" which seems more logical to me. Rod
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#35668 - 07/20/01 08:42 AM
Re: Isn't it ironic?
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addict
Registered: 02/13/01
Posts: 609
Loc: Portsmouth, United Kingdom
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rodward comments: "I couldn't care less" which seems more logical to me.
That's cuz y'all don't understand irony.Nice one Faldage, you brought it back full circle, but pointing in the other direction. Rod
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#35669 - 07/22/01 06:43 PM
Re: Handbag dances
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newbie
Registered: 11/12/00
Posts: 29
Loc: Ontario, Canada
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I'd say it began in the UK in the summer of 62 when dances that did not require a partner came into vogue -- like the twist, I guess.
Carpe whatever
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