French words that are now anglicized

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#205327 - 04/03/12 12:01 PM French words that are now anglicized
tiberall stranger Registered: 04/20/09 Posts: 3 Loc: CA	This has been a topic I've thought about ever since I took a Teaching Company course on the History of the English Language. I got to thinking about the fact that much of the English language is French based due to the Norman conquest in 1066. Much of our legal vocabulary is of French origin (appeal, plea, justice, evidence, etc). But these words sound English to us. Others don't even though they are part of English now, like a la carte and art nouveau. What I'm wondering is what is the last French word that has been absorbed into English that no longer sounds French to us? How long does it take for a word to lose its foreignness?
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#205342 - 04/05/12 07:30 AM Re: French words that are now anglicized [Re: tiberall]
BranShea Carpal Tunnel Registered: 06/23/06 Posts: 5248 Loc: Netherlands, the Hague	That would be really hard to trace. And I think it never looses it's foreignness, only we no longer notice it.
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#205343 - 04/05/12 08:29 AM Re: French words that are now anglicized [Re: BranShea]
gooofy newbie Registered: 01/19/12 Posts: 37	Originally Posted By: BranShea And I think it never looses it's foreignness, only we no longer notice it. What is the difference?
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#205344 - 04/05/12 08:58 AM Re: French words that are now anglicized [Re: tiberall]
zmjezhd Carpal Tunnel Registered: 08/13/05 Posts: 3268 Loc: R'lyeh	I'm not quite sure how one would even measure the "foreignness" of a loanword. Perhaps have a text for people to read out loud and see how they pronounce some loanwords, or if they hesitate before the words or phrases. If people pronounce a word by naturalizing its "foreign" pronunciation into something more accommodating to English phonetics, that word has probably been "anglicized". Although some words never seem to lose their "foreignness", e.g., deja vu (even if it has lost its accents), schadenfreude (part of whose definition seems to include the German language or the German people). _________________________ Ceci n'est pas un seing.
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#205347 - 04/05/12 02:36 PM Re: French words that are now anglicized [Re: gooofy]
BranShea Carpal Tunnel Registered: 06/23/06 Posts: 5248 Loc: Netherlands, the Hague	Originally Posted By: gooofy Originally Posted By: BranShea And I think it never looses it's foreignness, only we no longer notice it. What is the difference? And I think it never looses it's foreigness, only we got used to it. That any better gooofy?
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#205348 - 04/05/12 03:57 PM Re: French words that are now anglicized [Re: tiberall]
Faldage Carpal Tunnel Registered: 12/01/00 Posts: 13653	Beef might be a good example of a loanword having lost its foreignness. It's taken on the good English plural beeves.
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#205351 - 04/06/12 03:46 AM Re: French words that are now anglicized [Re: Faldage]
BranShea Carpal Tunnel Registered: 06/23/06 Posts: 5248 Loc: Netherlands, the Hague	Ha, beeves and beverages. We're used to the word 'beverages' but just give beverage one second look and it makes you laugh. It's taken on the good English plural beeves Do you really consider words that passed from English to American as loanwords too? It's all English to me.
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#205352 - 04/06/12 07:31 AM Re: French words that are now anglicized [Re: BranShea]
Faldage Carpal Tunnel Registered: 12/01/00 Posts: 13653	Originally Posted By: BranShea It's taken on the good English plural beeves Do you really consider words that passed from English to American as loanwords too? It's all English to me. Beef is from the Old French buef, (Modern French boeuf). The f > v in the plural is from the Old English voicing of unvoiced consonants between vowels, cf. wife/wives, knife/knives.
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#205353 - 04/06/12 07:40 AM Re: French words that are now anglicized [Re: Faldage]
BranShea Carpal Tunnel Registered: 06/23/06 Posts: 5248 Loc: Netherlands, the Hague	And in France when you want a steak you can order a 'steak de boeuf' but more often it's just 'bifteck'. That's what makes languages an amusing thing.
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#205366 - 04/06/12 02:31 PM Re: French words that are now anglicized [Re: tiberall]
tedstoddard stranger Registered: 03/10/12 Posts: 1 Loc: Chevy Chase, MD	Re etymology of mayday/m'aidez: I think the "m'" stems from "moi", as in "aidez-moi", not from "me", tho the meaning's the same ...
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#205390 - 04/07/12 08:13 PM Re: French words that are now anglicized [Re: BranShea]
gooofy newbie Registered: 01/19/12 Posts: 37	Originally Posted By: BranShea Originally Posted By: gooofy Originally Posted By: BranShea And I think it never looses it's foreignness, only we no longer notice it. What is the difference? And I think it never looses it's foreigness, only we got used to it. That any better gooofy? No, it's pretty much the same.
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#205417 - 04/09/12 03:09 PM Re: French words that are now anglicized [Re: gooofy]
BranShea Carpal Tunnel Registered: 06/23/06 Posts: 5248 Loc: Netherlands, the Hague	Doldrums.
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#205431 - 04/11/12 12:00 AM Re: French words that are now anglicized [Re: tiberall]
LlamaLadySG stranger Registered: 09/08/10 Posts: 3	An anglicized word I often see in e-mail group posts is "wala" meaning an expression of surprise when something good happens with little effort on one's part. From the French "voilà." I was attributing it to ignorance, but I guess it's just anglicization.
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#205432 - 04/11/12 12:32 AM Re: French words that are now anglicized [Re: LlamaLadySG]
tsuwm Carpal Tunnel Registered: 04/03/00 Posts: 10463 Loc: this too shall pass	or it could be anglicization from ignorance.
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#205440 - 04/11/12 10:35 PM Re: French words that are now anglicized [Re: tiberall]
Jackie Carpal Tunnel Registered: 03/15/00 Posts: 11578 Loc: Louisville, Kentucky	Hmm--smacks of Araby or India to me. Though I suppose they could have borrowed it from French...?
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#205445 - 04/12/12 07:02 AM Re: French words that are now anglicized [Re: Jackie]
Faldage Carpal Tunnel Registered: 12/01/00 Posts: 13653	Or either you're thinking of wallah.
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#205454 - 04/12/12 09:36 PM Re: French words that are now anglicized [Re: tiberall]
Jackie Carpal Tunnel Registered: 03/15/00 Posts: 11578 Loc: Louisville, Kentucky	I was, yes.
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#205458 - 04/13/12 07:08 AM Re: French words that are now anglicized [Re: Jackie]
Tromboniator addict Registered: 05/10/10 Posts: 690 Loc: Alaska	I've seen the wallah spelling, as well as wala, walah, and walla, when voilà was clearly the intended meaning.
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#205465 - 04/13/12 11:08 AM Re: French words that are now anglicized [Re: Tromboniator]
zmjezhd Carpal Tunnel Registered: 08/13/05 Posts: 3268 Loc: R'lyeh	I've seen the wallah spelling, as well as wala, walah, and walla, when voilà was clearly the intended meaning. All these spellings indicate a change in pronunciation from /'vwala/ to /'wɑlɑ/. _________________________ Ceci n'est pas un seing.
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