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Today's New York Times used the term bully pulpit in a headline: Schwarzenegger's Bully Pulpit: Muscle Magazineshttp://snipurl.com/gaokMerriam-Webster defines bully pulpit as a prominent public position (as a political office) that provides an opportunity for expounding one's views; also: such an opportunity. But what is the origin of the term? Not "bully boy", but perhaps "bully for you!" is a relative. Encarta bully boynoun [C] INFORMAL a rough and threatening man, especially one paid by someone to hurt or frighten other people: bully-boy tacticsCambridge "bully for you!used to express approval (dated) used ironically"
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stranger
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Why is nobody answering this wonderful post? The person who wrote it is so obviously erudite and full of wisdom at the same time.
Is this man or woman going to have to talk to the mirrors to have a meaningfule discussion? After all, there may actually have been a person out there who had no idea what a bully pulpit is.
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stranger
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"Churl Pat" is an anagram of "Plutarch". Does this give you your jollies?
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enthusiast
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In reply to:
"Churl Pat" is an anagram of "Plutarch". Does this give you your jollies?
Be fair, Te Tari Taake. Self-praise may be no recommendation, but it's the only sort of praise the sad, pathetic loon is ever going to get. As cries for help go, such unsubtle self-lauding is up there with a 747 for volume.
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journeyman
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After all, there may actually have been a person out there who had no idea what a bully pulpit is.
It looks pretty much like an unquestioned answer...
The Lone Haranguer
The Lone Haranguer
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Carpal Tunnel
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The notorious roles among Usenet participants, the Flamer, the Troll and the Ranter are recognized for their negative behavior in newsgroups. That they share a general goal of disruption is likely responsible for their popular conflation; the category “troll” is often used to define any disruptive behavior, overt or otherwise. In the scholarly literature (e.g. Donath 1998; Herring et al. 2002), however, trolling is defined more narrowly, as being about a deception in which the Troll feigns honest participation. Here we examine their strategy differences – the blatant, brute-force disruption tactics of the Flamer (a commonly used category), and the honest participation of the Ranter (a category of our own devising) – to further elucidate distinctions among categories of disruptive participants. The Flamer is known primarily for his aggression; he adopts intimidation as his primary strategy. Even having no reputation in a community, a Flamer is identifiable from his first post. He does not seek to become a legitimate part of the community, so establishing communicative competence is not an issue for him. His key behavioral strategy is intimidation through very aggressive language, yelling and controversial speech. ........ Like the Flamer (i.e. the traveling sense), the Troll and the Ranter are social deviants whose relation to the social community is, on the surface, generally negative. Their strategies are similar, in that they both engage in what is designed to appear to be topical debate. However, they are also known to engage in flame-like behavior and use intimidation when their more topical debates wane (Donath 1998) but the victims are already baited. It is important that the victims are indeed baited before the Troll engages in intimidation, because an established relationship is necessary for intimidation to be most effective, so that the intimidated does not simply give up and leave (Goffman 1969). The Troll’s early conversation builds that initial relationship through deception, and only later uses it as leverage for intimidation. The Troll is a master of “identity deception” (Donath 1998). He makes others believe he is someone he is not. A Troll attempts to pass as a valid member of the social community and begins to subtly provoke other members by writing messages that outwardly appear as honest attempts to start conversation but are really designed to “waste a group’s time by provoking a futile argument” (Herring et al. 2002). Herring et al. further posit that a Troll’s formula for success is to make a show of willingness to engage in legitimate discussion while “refusing to acknowledge” or “willfully misinterpreting another’s point” in order to perpetuate conversation. For the Troll, then, communicative competence is the most important trait. He must be adept at understanding and using the styles of speech a community deems acceptable, so as to not appear as an outsider. The Troll is dangerous precisely because his identity as a Troll and therefore his true motive is not known until it is too late. Donath (1998) considers the Troll’s actions to be part of a “game” he is constructing and forcing the others to play against their will and without their knowledge. His conversation begins innocently enough; this is how the trap is set. For many Trolls, this trap is for Newbies especially. If the Flamer attacks like a bomber, seeking to harm everyone, the Troll does so like a sniper, seeking the especially vulnerable Newbies. Because they are less familiar with the community’s standards and practices, Newbies are more likely to fall for a less-than-perfect performance by a would-be Troll. Goffman (1959) notes that, “a single note off-key can disrupt an entire performance.” For this reason, more experienced participants in the group are likely to “out” the Troll by noticing the “off-key notes” and posting a response to the Troll’s, directly accusing him of being a Troll. The more competence one has in the register of the community, the easier one will be able to identify a Troll’s deviant behavior. .......... Like the Troll, the Ranter seeks to stir up pointless debate. A prolific writer, the Ranter posts with great frequency on a particular issue or issues and is unique in his or her lengthy posts and single-mindedness. Ranters exhibit some Troll-like characteristics, in that they feign participation in a legitimate debate in order to goad others into responding. Unlike a Troll, however, a Ranter has an agenda. For the Ranter, the topic of discussion is of utmost importance. The FAQ of the alt.troll newsgroup, where Trolls gather to discuss their art, draws a distinction between Ranters, which they call “mission posters,” “nuts” or “net loons,” and “trolls” because the latter engage in what they are doing for fun, whereas the characters described by these three terms actually believe what they are saying. SOCIAL ROLES IN ELECTRONIC COMMUNITIES Scott A. Golder and Judith Donath Sociable Media Group, MIT Media Laboratory For the Association of Internet Researchers (AoIR) conference Internet Research 5.0 September 19-22, 2004, Brighton, England. http://web.media.mit.edu/~golder/projects/roles/golder2004.pdf
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Thanks Churl Pat for the kind words. I'm not into anagrams myself so I would never have picked up on that.
If I was going to pat myself on my own back for one of my own posts, I think I would have picked my "diggrifier" post [iggri/y - Miscellany] as that was a sincere attempt to improve the climate around here for the benefit of everyone.
I can't really make a claim for any "erudition" in this "bully pit" thread, Churl Pat. I just posted 3 different "bully" terms thinking it might attract the attention of some newcomers. Looks like it has. At least one anyway.
Without a steady stream of newcomers, AWADtalk can never grow. We are a very small community now, but I'm sure Anu, our generous host, envisioned a much larger community. I'm not quite sure how we can accomplish that.
My own approach is to post less for the existing posters and more for potential posters.
Most "Strangers" who come hear seldom stay. Not because they are treated rudely. You are the exception. I think it is because most of the regular posters here know one another in real life and the forum is a little 'clubby'.
Of course, this 'clubbiness' doesn't suit everyone's taste. Some people just come here looking for intellectual discussion and they have no interest in becoming part of a "club".
After all, AWADtalk isn't billed as a "social club". It's billed as a "talk forum".
Anyway, that's my theory why AWADtalk has never grown, Churl Pat. I'm sure the regulars will disagree. But they're regulars. What we need are more irregulars. The more posters we have, the more ideas, the more perspectives, the more healthy debates, the more opportunities we will all have to learn and to grow ourselves with the forum.
My personal emphasis on attracting newcomers, rather than courting old-timers, may sound revolutionary to some of the people who come here primarily to keep in touch with their existing friends. But it wouldn't sound novel at all, much less revolutionary, if the newcomers on AWADtalk outnumbered the old-timers.
Of course, a strong and continuous stream of new posters might result in a new group of leading posters, but that is as it should be.
A forum which attracts the brightest and most creative minds will grow more and more attractive all the time. It will not stagnate as AWADtalk has stagnated for so long.
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Been lurking around here sporadically for about six months before I decided to join.
My only comment on your self-serving garbage is that I joined in spite of you and your many trolls, not because of you.
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Carpal Tunnel
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> the people who come here primarily to keep in touch with their existing friends
Your ignorance is exceeded only by your arrogance - yet again you have the stupidity to assume you know what others think.
The majority who post here have indeed come to know each other quite well, and have welcomed many newcomers into that fold too - but they also have at least three or four other means of keeping in touch with social chat and jokes and less language-orientated material, and these means are used on a regular basis. It is therefore more realistic to suppose that those who have not been driven off by continuous troll rants are here for the purpose of discussing language, and just find it endlessly nauseating to wade through the midden of self-serving, self-adulatory, small-minded crap that serves only to terminate many otherwise interesting threads.
I shall not bother to come back to this thread again and wil make no further response to dignify your endlessly foolish behaviour. I only post this here so you can have at least one mirror telling you the truth, but I don't realistically expect it to have any effect since you have shown yourself to be way beyond the bounds of reason.
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My only comment on your self-serving garbage ...
Well, now we know your kind words were just a ruse, an attempt to inflame sentiment against the originator of the thread, whose thread had previously been ignored, just at the moment when it seemed peace was in danger of breaking out.
I'm sure there is a name in the troll lexicon for a devious warmonger like yourself, Churl Pat.
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I only post this here so you can have at least one mirror telling you the truth
Oh, never fear, Maverick. There will never be a shortage of Carpal elites to share with me their version, and yours, of the Carpal 'truth'.
Paramount among such Carpal 'truths' is the creed that the Carp can do no wrong, and, therefore, anyone who attempts to engage in honest, mature, intelligent discussion or debate regarding the Board's failure to attract and keep newcomers, is a heretic and must be derided, and denounced, and defamed and driven out at all costs.
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Carpal Tunnel
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Oh --why don't you attempt to :
engage in honest, mature, intelligent discussion or debate regarding the Board's failure to attract and keep newcomers, is a heretic and must be derided, and denounced, and defamed and driven out at all costs.
then maybe Jheem and others (who did) would still be here.
YOU claim to champion the 'Newcomer' but when YOU drove hime off (not my opionion, but rather Jheem's stated reason for no longer posting on this board was to avoid you) you said--oh to bad, he can post any where he wants.'
IT is YOU- and your drivel that is destroying conversation here.
You and YOUR threats.
YOU and YOUR LIES.
YOU.
YOU destroy, and claim to be creating. YOU create nothing but disharmony, and then blame others.
YOU carp agaist the carps. why don't you shut up, or take your own advise and engage in honest, mature, intelligent discussion and not mindless conversations with your self via your sock puppets?
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You and YOUR threats.
YOU and YOUR LIES.
YOU.
YOU destroy, and claim to be creating. YOU create nothing but disharmony, and then blame others.
Of course, there will be some who do not wish to make peace. There will be some who cannot put the past behind. That is perhaps inevitable.
But let's not diggrify anyone who chooses continued animosities and provocations over peace by confusing them with genuine peacemakers. Diggrifier, ["iggri/y" thread - Miscellany] July 18/05
Q.E.D.
In Summary:
Anyone who hurls an insult or innuendo at anyone else without just cause from this day forward is an "iggrifier". Those who demonstrate the maturity to refrain from insults and other provocations in the best intersts of the Board at large are not "iggrifiers", that is, they are "un-iggrifiers" or "non-iggrifiers".
This makes it very easy for everyone, in particular, for newcomers, to keep score, etaoin. I hope you will agree.
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Carpal Tunnel
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getting pretty ugly, folks. why doesn't everyone take a day (or two) off from the board, and come back ready to discuss words, and the foibles of language. let's just forget about what who did to whom...
formerly known as etaoin...
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may I also suggest that when one edits a post, they make some indication that they have done so?
formerly known as etaoin...
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Fair enough.
I added the full extract from Diggrifier's post uner the heading "In Summary" immediately after posting the first part of my post concluding with "Q.E.D."
My post was made in 2 separate, uninterrupted, planned steps. It happens that you composed your reply and posted it while I was composing and posting my "Summary" and before I had the chance to read your reply.
I regret any unintended inference that you had read my "Summary" before posting your reply.
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lets not forget you lie by ommision-- you failed to note that i quoted, in my post, your words (now deleted) YOU edited your post--after i responded to it plutarch--a common ploy you often engage in--and you didn't note an edit, either in the (1)orignal post or in (2)your later comments.
you claim to be a peace maker, but you are instead a liar and troll.
IT IS YOU who threatens, bullies and trashes.. It is YOU who edits their comments, (after they have been responded to) and lies about it. NO one is fooled. (unless of course you fool your self)
YOU claim their are "CARP" out to get you--who are they?
I am not a carping. I am pointing out facts.
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In reply to:
getting pretty ugly, folks. why doesn't everyone take a day (or two) off from the board, and come back ready to discuss words, and the foibles of language. let's just forget about what who did to whom...
formerly known as etaoin...
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"I am not a carping."
You are probably the only one who believes that, Of Troy.
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stranger
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>You are probably the only one who believes that, Of Troy.
There you go again. Your arrogance shows through like a carbuncle under a silk blouse.
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like a carbuncle under a silk blouse
Well, now we know you are a lady [altho you don't talk like one].
You act like a troll even as you accuse me of being one.
You are insensitive to those who urge an end to insults and other provocations disrupting the peace of the Board, even when some of those who urge it are your fellow Carpal Tunnels.
And your attacks coincide with Of Troy's attacks, a pattern we saw repeated often not so long ago.
Hmmm. I wonder who Churl Pat could be?
Has Of Troy paired up with a new attack partner, or has she got the same old partner wearing a new handle?
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You are insensitive to those who urge an end to insults and other provocations disrupting the peace of the Board, even when some of those who urge it are your fellow Carpal Tunnels.
Uhhh, excuse me...but Churl Pat is a stranger...if you noticed.
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stranger
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Uhhh, excuse me...but Churl Pat is a stranger...if you noticed.
You do have a deft sense of humor, W'ON. [I've never doubted that.]
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stranger
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TYGA (there you go again).
The best defence is a good offence, apparently.
I didn't accuse you of being a troll. You've admitted it over and over again. Your use of pejorative words is not becoming.
I am very sensitive to the pain you have caused here, and have decided not to tolerate it.
I wish I were of Troy, that lady has class you can't even dream of possessing.
I am no more and no less than what I have said I am. Certainly a shame that you cannot say the same.
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I wish I were of Troy, that lady has class you can't even dream of possessing.
You're right about that, Churl, although you and I wouldn't choose the same adjective to describe it.
You and Of Troy make a great team. Keep up the good work.
Obviously, you and Of Troy know what is best for the Board.
And you're such a quick study! You've only been lurking here for 6 months and posting for a few days.
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