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Carpal Tunnel
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Carpal Tunnel
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In reply to:
The English I speak is perfect for within my country but inadequate outside it. Isn't that what the article says?
PS every post I make I work on the sentence construction and words so that it "fits in" better.
Not only is your English more than adequate, Avy - I am aghast that you should want to change your English to model it more closely after another variant. It seems to me that, unless there is a potentially dangerous lack of mutual comprehension, speakers of different branches of Emglish should be happy with their "native" English. Vive la différence!
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Joined: Sep 2000
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enthusiast
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enthusiast
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Hi Avy,
All was fine and I slept well at night :), until I came on this board. I found the English I spoke was so different from the English the others were speaking. I found the sentence construction I used and the way I used words was VERY different.
I would suggest that the cross-section of people you see on this board, particularly amongst the regulars, is in no way representative of the English-speaking population at large. You're looking at a very small group here, many of whom have a passion for words, language and literature, and who have an excellent command of things like vocabulary and grammar. I often feel inadequate, but I get over it and post anyway. What I'm trying to say is that if you measured yourself by a more reasonable standard, you'd probably make a higher assessment of your English skills.
2. PS every post I make I work on the sentence construction and words so that it "fits in" better.
Me too, and still the errors (spelling, grammatical, plain old woolly thinking,...) creep in. In truth, sometimes my posts are fairly casual, more like the language I'd use speaking to or emailing a friend, and sometimes I'll put more effort into making it "correct". I imagine that I'm not alone on that point.
There are certainly a few errors and unusual constructions in your post above, and I don't know how different it would have been if you hadn't worked hard on it, but I don't think any English speaker would have any problems understanding exactly what you are saying. Which is more than can be said for some of the posts I've seen here from native English-speakers!
I think I can safely say that both (all?) of us are learning something valuable here.
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Joined: Apr 2000
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Carpal Tunnel
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Carpal Tunnel
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>every post I make I work on the sentence construction and words so that it "fits in" better.
Avy, I must say that this statement has me bemused. "fits in" with what? the queen's english? aussie english? kiwi english? canadian english, eh? american english?? (heaven forfend) english as spoken by italians... or spaniards... or?
I haven't been paying close attention to your roots (and your bio is starkly unhelpful ;) and they certainly don't come across as obvious, which says something about your success in fitting in I guess.
all I can add is "phooey" to fitting in.
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Joined: Mar 2000
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enthusiast
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enthusiast
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>>I speak English and Hindi with friends and colleagues. I speak Marathi with my family. I think in English.
Avy, in which language do you dream?
I know people suddendly going back to their native language when they are in anger - for example, when children break a glass...
Ciao
Emanuela
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veteran
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veteran
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This is what I love about this Board. There are so many times I consider an appropriate response to a post, but first (naturally) check the existing responses. What I increasingly find is that what I wanted to say has already been said, but with an eloquence and passion (think that's the right word) far beyond my original conception. This is very inspiring. I'm so proud!   Old Mother Shona (treading momentarily on Jackie's turf)
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Joined: Jun 2000
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old hand
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old hand
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Eaaooww…. That was just a comment on the article. I did not think it would generate such a response. But thank you all for your replies
Max : You are right. The word "fit in" was wrong. I should have used "to be understood." Sometimes the way we use words have a different meaning with the first language speakers of English. If I have come to know that my language is different. I have also come to like the differences. I think our English is more rhythmic and less dry. So absolutely Vive la difference
Marty : I know I speak good English. It is just that sometimes the English I speak conveys a different meaning to first language English speakers. I think the words "fit in" is an example. I meant not what you all took me to mean. And in the article the Barbara woman says just that. I work on my posts to prevent being misunderstood which is exactly what happened.
Tsuwm : Again not fit in but to be understood. All the types of English you mentioned are first language English speakers. Between the first language English speakers there is no trouble of loosing the meaning or changing the meaning in translation. With us we mean one thing and not necessarily is the same thing conveyed to monolingual English speakers with words used because of the translation. Yeah "phooey" to fitting in. Unfortunely "not phooey" to being misunderstood. (:
Emmanuela - I am not sure but think I dream in languageless thoughts… (thank god for that)
Bye
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Avy
Thanks for your posts here. Like Shona, I'm proud to be associated with a Board that manages (if such reification of a virtual entity is allowed) to respond with such warmth, passion and eloquence.
In keeping with the subject of this thread, I wonder if the globalisation of English might be less confused if words and grammatical idiosyncracies from nations like India could be introduced to 'mainstream' English, much as vast swathes of Amercian English become the norm (thanks Hollywood).
For me, for instance, common Indian English terms like morcha and, of course, 'eve teasing' are just crying out to be used in mainstream English. Given a choice, I'd also introduce (though their history, even in Indian English, is not spectacular) hungama, and rada.
What are your favourite Indian English words or grammatical (syntactical purely?) innovations that, in your opinion, would help enrich global English?
cheer
the sunshine warrior
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Carpal Tunnel
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Carpal Tunnel
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Dearest Avy, my sweet-- but to be understoodYou have just stated the ultimate aim of every person on the planet. So, I think that means that you "fit in" perfectly with the rest of us! Shona, thank you for acknowledging that the gutter is not my only 'turf', and you are indeed welcome upon it.
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member
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Eaaooww?. That was just a comment on the article.
Between the first language English speakers there is no trouble of loosing the meaning or changing the meaning in translation.
Avy,
I think you're wrong about first language speakers not loosing their meaning in their posts sometimes. I have noticed often enough that when I post a comment that I expect to draw little attention or response, the reaction seems never ending. Similarly, I have posted things that I thought would spark discussion which were completely overlooked. In some way, I believe that the reason for this may be poor wording on my part. Some of my meaning does get lost between my brain and my keyboard. English is my first language, and I still have to work to make myself understood by such an attentive audience.
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old hand
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Hi Xara
"Eaaaooww" is what happens when the spotlight suddenly turns on you, when you have to explain the words you have been mumbling in the shadows. Yes. I too get surprised by unexpected reaction. Perhaps that is collective subconscious - one that is hard to predict, or maybe as you say the writing was not clear enough - definitely in my case.
Hi Shanks
I don't know about enrich, but one grammatical usage that would make the language howl in pain is "We are like that only" (: (Used to mean that is the way we are, whether you like it or not)
What I do like are some Urdu words which have sensuousness, impossible to capture with any English substitute. Some of these words are :
Afsos - a very gentle word - meaning regret pronounced ufsource
Ijjazat - meaning permission pronounced e-jaa-zut. I like phonetics of this word
Kanoon - meaning law and justice pronounced kaa - noon.
Of course these are not Indian English words, of which I like the ones you mentioned and the swear words. The most often used being "Saalaa" (Sorry Jackie. That is very mild swear.)
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