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FWIW, despite many interesting posts these past few weeks, the tone has degenerated. When this board returns to being less about "tatas"- cum-who can emit the most gratuitous posts in the shortest period of time and more about words- cum-language as it was in the beginning, I'll be pleased. For now, I'm adopting tsuwm's postaday™ m.o. There. Somebody had to say it in public.  I await private congratulations and public condemnation.
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I await private congratulations and public condemnation.
Will you accept public congratulations instead? I think that occasional reminders of why this Board is are very useful. I tend to post in spurts, and I have often gone a day without posting at all. All the same, many of those threads did start off as discussions about words, and I think that we must expect meanderings to happen. Perhaps a gentle nudge within the thread would help. For example the thread on "bodacious tatas" could have developed into a discussion of the origin and significance of "bodacious" rather than a discussion of mammary glands. I think reminders of the sort you posted are useful, as long as they do not stifle the anarchic spirit which has contributed much to the success of this Board. An occasional tap on the shoulder is much to be preferred over a moderated forum.
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Dear Anna and Max: I think that if there were more posts about words, word origins, and unusual phrases, the number of wisecracks would be smaller.Instead of the members with the most experience on the board limiting themselves to one post a day, I hope they will manage to summon up more inspiration and challenging ideas, so that boredom will prompt fewer ribald posts.
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Pooh-Bah
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In my own defense, I would like to point out that, by in large, my posts are not gratuitous. For example, my segue to the largest fungus was to one on the Michigan peninsula and which was once thought to be the worlds largest. That fungus is a "fairy circle" and the segue was from "pixy" from which the word of that day, "pixilated" comes.
I have introduced topics which, while they do not belong to the field of linguistics, are central to philosophic thought on language and, therefor belong on this board. At least as I have understood it. And I have engaged in, and attempted to extend, discussions whose topic no one could argue was not linguistics.
The odd press thread was meant to give examples of the odd usages and errors that creep up in the press and which were the topic, at one point, of another thread. I interrupted that thread with nonce words because, as a new comer, I misunderstood the thread's heading.
My reference to the Cheshire Cat was meant to draw attention to the literally fantastic logical constructions underlying Carroll's masterpiece. I believe it is this underlying sense which lends all the magic to his work. If my definition of "isis" was tortured, it was at worst a poor parody of academic writing--and, thus, also language related.
Wit, in general, is essential to language. To my mind ouble entendres and the like only draw from the depths of language. I can't apologize if some don't care for my sense of humor, although I *am* sorry they don't. Little of it, however, is gratuitous.
Finally, as to the quality of posts, I would like to point out that I actually attempted to give the very sort of shoulder tap that Max spoke of in his truly charming way. The post immediately following the first "tatas" post was mine. I wrote "Oy." I did not mean to offend anyone, but I did mean to voice my disapproval.
Unfortunately, I later fell victim to the same trap. I have deleted that post.
If I have caused certain cherished members of this board to leave it, that has certainly not been my intention and I regret their response.
If my approach is somewhat eccentric--as today's word directly suggests--it is meant to be collegial.
IP
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i, too, have noticed that the number of posts has become rather unwieldy, and have had to resort to skipping over a few threads. i've thought quite a bit about what or who might responsible for this (including some introspection) but it seems to me that the problem we are facing is simply that there are currently a lot more enthusiastic participants than existed not so long ago. it doesn't appear to me, in comparing recent posts to, say, four months ago that any of the users are posting any more gratuitously than before, merely that *more* people are doing so. that being said, the only way to bring things back to the good old days would be for all of us newcomers to take a hike. unfortunately, we like it here as much as the rest of you, and in large part *because* of the rest of you. i daresay that having anna, tsuwm and whoever else is inclined to participate in this one-a-day boycott will deprive the rest of us of much of the enjoyment we have come to expect. as for the debauchery, i'm with hyla and jackie in whatever thread it was that this issue was originally addressed; i think innuendo--cleverly brought forth--can be hilarious. OTOH, i don't care to have it belabored in a more explicit manner than is necessary. inselpeter, i can't imagine i'm wrong in thinking that anna's comments were not aimed at you. your contributions are--for me, at least--consistently worthy and enjoyable. bottom line is, i'm open to suggestions. i don't think a boycott by our 'founding fathers and mothers' is the answer, but nor do i think that cutting out all of the witty one-liners will serve our purposes. i love a good, quick pun. i think we all do. i'm game for any plan y'all come up with (BTW, i do believe this is my only post of the day, FWIW)  (edited) addendum: maybe it's just SPRING FEVER!? for the US'ns, at least
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AnnaStrophic>>
For now, I'm adopting tsuwm's postaday™ m.o.
IMHO, Clearly this is not the solution to the problem. Why should we who are innocent be punished by witholding from us the wisdom, the wit, the alacrity,of somebody like tsuwm and and many others of his kind, who are the bottomless source of information and enlightenment for us newcomers.
Please reconsider.
chronist
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First, let me say that I happen to know that both Anna and
tsuwm are busier right now than they have been, and that I hope this pull-back is VERY temporary for both. Also, we need Jo (jmh) back! (Hint, Dearest.) She always has ideas,
which is my third thing: I love Bill's idea about coming up with inspiring and challenging ideas! I wish ALL of you would! Because that is something I am not good at, which I think has been evident. I do not have a talent for seeing what isn't there. I re-act, but seldom pro-act.
The above postings are causing me some concern that there may be an "us vs. them" mentality developing. I really hope not. I personally do not adapt well to change, and am quite curmudgeonly about it (was just called an "old grouch" at choir practice for refusing to clap on Sunday
morning). But I sincerely hope that the newcomers have not been given the sweeping impression that they are not welcome if they don't conform. Everyone, old and new alike,
has their own special interests and also ways of speaking.
Also--everyone has bad days, and this may account for some of the "I'm upset" posts, at times. I, at least, am willing to grant folks the benefit of the doubt on that score. It is also my opinion that everyone has the right to say when they are upset and why, but if I may make a suggestion: if we can do it without passing negative judgments (eg. stupid post), expressing an opinion is much less likely to cause hurt feelings.
maverick, I would really like your wisdom on this, Sweetie.
I think you could do us all some good.
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This will be my final comment on this matter. It seems to me that the easiest solution for the ribaldry is for it to be moved to its own thread. I agree with inselpeter that many of his posts hav been at least tangentially languge-related, and I have no problem with posts that get one thinking. What happened the to the very language-focused thread on "Up" illustrates the ease with which my suggestion could be implemented. When the shift is made to pure banter, why not just start "Non-Word Stuff #X" and invite all who wish to post to that thread? That way, no one is having their freedom of expression stifled, and those who are looking for discussions on matters related to words can find them without having to wade through "off-topic" posts. I have been at least as guilty as anyone else in failing to do this, but shall try a little harder in future.
Salaam
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Adenoid After posting this, I felt impelled to add my voice to Jackie's in wishing for the avoidance of an "us v. them "situation developing. Remarkably, those who post here have always seemed to be much more "us" than "them" and I hope it stays that way. If someone can manage to post 15 challenging and thought-provoking posts a day, that can only be good for the board, or so it seems to me. I have enjoyed much of the banter that goes on here, and would not like to see it disappear completely, nor any of those who post it. To illustrate the alternative, I have resurrected the thread "We are not alone". A look through the archives of this "I & " forum will show that similar discussions have been held frequently, and will no doubt occur again.
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Max, I wondered who had resurrected that thread! And your add-on wasn't annoying, Sweetie, despite your best efforts. 
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Interesting how thought of moving posts seems to be at the "forefront" of suggestions, again. I'm sure someone will come up with something better... Although it takes me a bit longer(to say the least) to absorb IP's posts (certainly more than it takes him to make them) I think and feel it is exactly what we needed... someone to discuss instead of chat... isn't that what the complaint actually (tsuwm registered trademark) is? Not that quantity implies quality...by no means would I... ...nothing more "frustrating" than listening to a defense of someone who is presumed innocent until proven... Who are they? Didn't they have their adenoids removed, yet  ? It's a long recovery period.. this healing curve...
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No points for guessing the source of the question, or the reason for using it. Boycotts are double-edged swords. Buycotting trade with South Africe during apartheid: principled stand against racism, or guaranteed to worsen the lot of the downtrodden in that country? 'Boycotting' AWADtalk: liable to increase the quality of posting or liable to result in the atrophy of the Board? Moot points, eh? cheer the sunshine (not a logical objectivist) warrior ps. For what it's worth, if this ayleur is not seen much over the next month it is because I am travelling to that haven of spies, that bullying hegemonist, the underbelly of the world (if you listen to left-wing European rhetoric) - the USA. Carrier pigeon signals only, please...
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For what it's worth, if this ayleur is not seen much over the next month it is because I am travelling to that haven of spies, that bullying hegemonist, the underbelly of the world (if you listen to left-wing European rhetoric) - the USA.
Have a great time, just watch out for those sneaky subliminable messages.
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Pooh-Bah
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<<Have a great time, just watch out for those sneaky subliminable messages.>> Only someone from your side of the doldrums could imagine we're the under belly; have a wonderful time-- and don't forget to write!
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just watch out for those sneaky subliminable messages.
You mean like: "death penalties are unfair"? Or is GWB secretly a commie sympathiser?
Viva Citizen Bush!
cheer
the sunshine warrior
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Viva Citizen Bush!
It took me a while to understand - not the meaning, but in which language you are writing.
Since "viva" sounds so Italian to me.
It comes from the verb 'vivere' = to live, and to say
viva someone
literally means
(we hope that) someone (will) live.
Ciao
Emanuela
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Emanuela
What you say is perfectly true. And, I think, in English, that is the way in which it is used, though the connotation may also include the idea "long" live x.
In this context, of course, I was using it ironically (or is it satirically?).
cheer
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AnnaS, Jackie, Max and you-all, sorry to come late to this discussion – catches me at an incredibly busy time too. I believe I am only likely to have something useful to say in so far as my misdemeanours probably echo many others’ experience of this board – I have talked too much at times, laughed too much at other times, cried too much on more than one occasion. I have berated others, sometimes unfairly or too grumpily, and sometimes kept silent when perhaps I should have spoken. Bless you for out speaking, AnnaS – and let us use this positively to help us further our sense of community.Taking a fine nugget of wisdom from Jackie, let us first of all turn away from personal criticism real or imagined, and start by accentuating the positive features of what we share. One of the things about this forum that fascinates me is that it is, in microcosm, the formation of a whole new speech community. Like a group of people staggering ashore on a desert island we are making it up as we go along. We are self-selecting, self-regulating – and a natural and important part of that process seems to be an occasional re-examination of what our common values are, and how we can collectively agree things work. In other words, a discourse of what we are doing here and how we do it is a natural part of our meta-language and social bonding. In this new virtual community we are all newcomers. This process leads me to observe some shared values emerging over time, which will doubtless be an evolving and constantly moving target. The key feature of what we do here is a celebration and exploration of language by use (and abuse!). We try to do this in a diverse manner of ways, some of which range from the highly intellectual to the deeply scatological. The boundaries of taste have to be defined by our collective sense of comfort and humour – I think Max’s tap on the shoulder is an effective model, personally, but we have to remember the sensitivity of shoulders also varies! We operate this process by a general sense of shared inquiry, with contributions from a wide and diverse range of backgrounds and expertise allowing our discussions some true hybrid vigour. We govern our proceedings in a companionable spirit of banter, with all newcomers made to feel welcome as far as we are humanly able – I do not believe we need feel over-sensitive on this spot since it is a commonly remarked feature that people feed back they have been made to feel positively welcomed here in sharp contrast to many other e-forums. They are soon treated like family members – a certain rough and tumble of humorous criticism given and taken in good spirit is assumed. I note, however, the points made by Faldage and others – if a joking insider code like YART is not handled with sensitivity then misunderstandings can occur very easily. We can also perhaps all recognise the over-enthusiastic posting when newcomers first come aboard, which normally settles as a newly-adjusted camaraderie is established. When any one voice hogs the board, it can make it uncomfortable for all, no matter what the interest of the posts. If I try to sum up in one word what I believe to be the unique and endearing quality of this board, it would be this: DIVERSITYI have grown in a few short months to count some real fellow feelings and friendships here, and would not willingly lose one single voice – nor lose a single post to deletion. FWIW, my personal opinions in this ongoing debate: I have no interest in discussions robbed, on principle, of humour; this would be like fire without oxygen. I have no interest in either vulgar or prurient discussions unless the blade of humour is flickering wickedly sharp around the campfire. I recognise my sense of humour may differ from others, and if caused offence is noted, will always try to moderate accordingly. I am at varying times equally interested in serious and frivolous matters, and particularly enjoy it when these are discussed with a sharp mind, a feeling heart, and above all an obvious love of language. I recognise that others’ take on these and other matters will be different, and will try to quietly pass these by, unless they so offend a deep-seated part of my mind as to force a moral betrayal by so doing. Oh, but maybe sometimes a little wicked tease, too Finally, a big <sorry> to Jazzo for an excessively long post – practically a whole o-fence!
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Bravo, maverick!
Can't say it better, so I won't say more.
Onward!
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maverick, that settles it: you are our official genius-in-residence.
I have grown in a few short months to count some real fellow feelings and friendships here, and would not willingly lose one single voice – nor lose a single post to deletion.
FWIW, my personal opinions in this ongoing debate:
I have no interest in discussions robbed, on principle, of humour; this would be like fire without oxygen.
I have no interest in either vulgar or prurient discussions unless the blade of humour is flickering wickedly sharp around the campfire.
I recognise my sense of humour may differ from others, and if caused offence is noted, will always try to moderate accordingly.
I am at varying times equally interested in serious and frivolous matters, and particularly enjoy it when these are discussed with a sharp mind, a feeling heart, and above all an obvious love of language.
I recognise that others’ take on these and other matters will be different, and will try to quietly pass these by, unless they so offend a deep-seated part of my mind as to force a moral betrayal by so doing. Oh, but maybe sometimes a little wicked tease, too
Exactly, lovely mav, exactly!
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As the one guilty of introducing the b... t...s, let me get in my view.
Firstly, your points are well taken, for the most part, although I have some reservations. I too would like to see less mere banter on postings. I try to post only when I have something *substantive* to contribute and I think it would be for the best interest of the board if others did the same, although, of course, *substantive* is a very elastic term. Not that I would like to see the give-and-take which we have here disappear -- I enjoy it when there's something to it. But mere banter, I suggest very meekly, might be confined to private messages rather than cluttering up the threads.
I have to remind myself, and maybe some others, that we need, in common decency, to avoid giving offence to our more straitlaced members, so maybe there are subjects and expressions we want to leave out. But at the same time, I do not want to see AWADTALK conducted in the manner of an academic tutorial or a public committee hearing; I've had enough of that, thank you, and don't care for any more. I love AWAD because, above all else, it's interesting. The free give and take, often humorous, makes it what it is. So let's not get too stuffy or take ourselves too seriously.
As to the quality of postings, it would be nice if each of us could have at least one brilliant thought per day and post it and discuss it, but it's not going to happen. We (or at least, I) can't have that many deep, earth-shattering, brilliant ideas all the time, and if we limit ourselves to that, it's going to be a sparse forum. Moreover, the more we discuss, the greater our history becomes. If we limit ourselves to word- and language-related subjects, it is inevitable that, having a limited field, we will, with ever-increasing frequency, be landing on ground already covered. So, for those of you who
want to keep to the main subject only, please bear in mind that you can't insist on that and at the same time be all hot to call a YART alert.
Lastly, I suggest that some of you who have taken members to task may have been just a wee bit heavy-handed. We have lost one interesting correspondent lately whom I enjoyed even if she did have some habits which annoyed even me, but I was willing to put up with them; and I suspect we've lost others. I don't think I have seen anyone on this board regularly who is just a nuisance and whom I would really like to get rid of. Almost everyone who posts is interesting to me and I want to hear more from them. So please bear in mind that if anyone wants to give out with rebukes, you risk losing people. Is it worth it?
P.S. Added later.
Mav's brilliant post appeared, it seems, while I was composing this, as I had not seen it before I started on this. Well said, Mav. I agree completely.
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Back to language for a moment, I have only just noticed the brilliant coinage in shanks’ post: Buycott – to effect moral change by consumerism?
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Mav, I agree with your posting particularly the part posted by Jackie. Bobyoungbalt also posted, in the words I was struggling to find ; I do not want to see AWADTALK conducted in the manner of an academic tutorial or a public committee hearing; I've had enough of that, thank you, and don't care for any more. I love AWAD because, above all else, it's interesting. The free give and take, often humorous, makes it what it is. So let's not get too stuffy or take ourselves too seriously. Even in the stuffiest of meetings I have attended there have been occasional outburts of laughter. Humor is the leaven of life. To me, a serious subject is not lessened by the influence of laughter's modifying the discussion. If this board is to live and grow we must have new members of all ages, as any group must, or it will atrophy and die. It follows that topics will be re-hashed from time to time but new members will bring varying viewponts that can only enrich us. I would not like to see us become fuddy-duddies, insular in our smug self satisfaction. As for myself : for any offense I may have given I am truly sorry and I will try to stay on topic but if something strikes me funny I cannot promise not to laugh and add my two-cents-worth. wow
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Or is GWB secretly a commie sympathiser
For those who don't know, "GWB" is the acronym for George Washington Bridge.
There's no connection whatsoever, except I do think the ~president would make a greater contribution as a toll collector. Anyway, he'd soon be replaced by--you guessed it, a machine!
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Regarding the worries of some and the proclivities of others about the future of this site:
As an old timer: This site is a haven from the ill-willed wrangling and vituperativeness of some other boards. We came here because we love language or are curious about language (itself a form of love) and we equate the calm of this board with its original purpose of examining the English language. Certain topics have not been discussed except in passing reference when it is appropriate to the discussion of language. People have not attacked others for their religious beliefs or political persuasions. The fear is that we are losing that focus and, that in losing that focus we will degenerate into just another wrassling board with asbestos suits required for safe passage.
As a newcomer: This board is a community. We have all formed friendships with others on this board and have a lot of respect for other's differing viewpoints. We are all relatively intelligent people who have many things we could talk about; in fact, the wide range of perspectives is one of the strong points of this board. Certainly we are civilized enough that we can discuss other matters than language, but, perhaps there should be areas of the board set aside for non-language oriented discussion. The idea of the Non-Word Stuff #N Post Them Here threads that has been used is probably a good one as far as it goes; it clearly identifies the thread and allows those not interested to stay out. If there is a problem it is that which I alluded to in my post in the Silly Comic Quizz thread that completely independent threads would become intermingled and hard to follow. I think a better solution would be to have completely separate sections for non-linguistic threads, but perhaps even this would not satisfy everyone for various reasons. I don't know if there is a solution, but I certainly think it is something that we have to deal with.
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...soon be replaced by--you guessed it, a machine!I thought we already proved he is a machine on another post! [ducking from JazzO emoticon]
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Back to language for a moment, I have only just noticed the brilliant coinage in shanks’ post:
Buycott – to effect moral change by consumerism? Even my typos are distinguished by their serendipitous felicity, mellifluousness and appositeness. 
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Thank you, everybody, for y'all's comments. Some of you said it a lot better than I ever could. I apologize for inadvertently conveying the mistaken impression that I was engaging in some sort of boycott, or singling anyone out. And now, back to our regular broadcast.
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While I am new to this group of fora, I am a twenty-year veteran of boards, BBSs, newsgroups, etc. I am a great fan of the chaos of ideas that spill out of unmoderated, high-spirited, good-willed discussions. I have a history of displaying my fascination with words in a vulgar fashion (is it possible to be both coarse and erudite at the same time?), but have out-grown participation except for the most irresistible of straight lines. I think Max's suggestion of prefixing the subject line with "non-word stuff" or the like for divergent posts is the most practical policy.
Lance ==)--------------
Lance ==)--------------
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Welcome aBoard, Lance, anyone with sufficiently poor taste to agree with me about anything will always be welcomed by me, even as decent society shuns said miscreant.
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