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Previous Thread Next Thread Print Thread Page 1 of 4 1 2 3 4 Looking for the origin of the word "cratylic" #192405 08/12/10 01:25 AM Joined: Aug 2010 Posts: 4 O Ola OP stranger OP Ola stranger O Joined: Aug 2010 Posts: 4 Hello, will anyone in this corner of the internet know? My partner and I were looking for the word that describes self-descriptive proper names, such as the type of character names that Dickens used or that we sometimes hear in our day-to-day dealings (my accountant's surname is Pennywise) - and we found the word "cratylic". What is the origin of this word? Where was it first used? And is there a less obscure word that defines the same thing? Thank you Ola Copy Link to Clipboard Share Post on Facebook Share Post on Twitter Re: Looking for the origin of the word "cratylic" Ola #192412 08/12/10 02:11 AM Joined: Mar 2000 Posts: 11,613 Louisville, Kentucky Jackie Carpal Tunnel Jackie Carpal Tunnel Joined: Mar 2000 Posts: 11,613 Louisville, Kentucky Um--autological will do the trick for me; and welcome aBoard, by the way. I couldn't find cratylic except in some British ref.'s. I've not heard it before. Copy Link to Clipboard Share Post on Facebook Share Post on Twitter Re: Looking for the origin of the word "cratylic" Jackie #192414 08/12/10 02:17 AM Joined: Feb 2010 Posts: 655 Florida, USA beck123 addict beck123 addict Joined: Feb 2010 Posts: 655 Florida, USA We have (had?) a surgeon in town named Dr. Schnipper. (Or was he a מוהל? I forget.) Is that what you mean? "I don't know which is worse: ignorance or apathy. And, frankly, I don't care." - Anonymous Copy Link to Clipboard Share Post on Facebook Share Post on Twitter Re: Looking for the origin of the word "cratylic" beck123 #192417 08/12/10 02:49 AM Joined: Aug 2010 Posts: 4 O Ola OP stranger OP Ola stranger O Joined: Aug 2010 Posts: 4 Beck - yes! Or perhaps a seamstress (or musician) called Singer. Jackie, we found reference to the word in some online essays about Dickens, as well as in discussion about Martin Amis characters. http://www.guardian.co.uk/books/2003/sep/13/martinamis Maybe it's British in origin? Copy Link to Clipboard Share Post on Facebook Share Post on Twitter Re: Looking for the origin of the word "cratylic" Ola #192418 08/12/10 02:59 AM Joined: Aug 2010 Posts: 4 O Ola OP stranger OP Ola stranger O Joined: Aug 2010 Posts: 4 Jackie, thanks for autological Copy Link to Clipboard Share Post on Facebook Share Post on Twitter Re: Looking for the origin of the word "cratylic" Ola #192424 08/12/10 03:44 AM Joined: Feb 2010 Posts: 655 Florida, USA beck123 addict beck123 addict Joined: Feb 2010 Posts: 655 Florida, USA There were a group of these aptly-named individuals in the Reagan administration. Whitehouse spokesperson Larry Speaks, for example. And the only other I remember was the Whitehouse groundskeeper, whose last name was Greene. There were so many, in fact, that I secretly felt that it was being done on purpose. "I don't know which is worse: ignorance or apathy. And, frankly, I don't care." - Anonymous Copy Link to Clipboard Share Post on Facebook Share Post on Twitter Re: Looking for the origin of the word "cratylic" beck123 #192426 08/12/10 11:19 AM Joined: Dec 2000 Posts: 13,803 Faldage Carpal Tunnel Faldage Carpal Tunnel Joined: Dec 2000 Posts: 13,803 The term aptronym or aptonym has also been used for these names. Copy Link to Clipboard Share Post on Facebook Share Post on Twitter Re: Looking for the origin of the word "cratylic" Faldage #192428 08/12/10 11:35 AM Joined: Jun 2006 Posts: 5,295 Netherlands, the Hague BranShea Carpal Tunnel BranShea Carpal Tunnel Joined: Jun 2006 Posts: 5,295 Netherlands, the Hague Ha, how about the opposite? The American painter who's family name was Singer? Or a plummer who's called Baker? (contraptonym ?) Last edited by BranShea; 08/12/10 11:37 AM. Copy Link to Clipboard Share Post on Facebook Share Post on Twitter Re: Looking for the origin of the word "cratylic" Ola #192435 08/12/10 02:51 PM Joined: Aug 2005 Posts: 3,290 R'lyeh zmjezhd Carpal Tunnel zmjezhd Carpal Tunnel Joined: Aug 2005 Posts: 3,290 R'lyeh we found the word "cratylic". What is the origin of this word? I couldn't find it in any dictionaries I looked it up in (OED, Onelook, etc.). I assume it comes from the Greek proper name, Cratylus. He is a character in one of Plato's Socratic dialogs of the same name. He champions the idea that language is natural (physis) and not conventional (nomos). So rather than an arbitrary association of objects and words, the association between an object and its name is determined. Ceci n'est pas un seing. Copy Link to Clipboard Share Post on Facebook Share Post on Twitter Re: Looking for the origin of the word "cratylic" zmjezhd #192474 08/13/10 04:19 PM Joined: Aug 2010 Posts: 4 O Ola OP stranger OP Ola stranger O Joined: Aug 2010 Posts: 4 I love the ideas here. Faldage - aptronym is a good one. When I googled it, I also found a wiki entry for the term "nominative determinism" which included a few inventive synonyms. BranShea, we would just call those folks stubborn contrarians :p zmjezhd - very interesting. Copy Link to Clipboard Share Post on Facebook Share Post on Twitter Page 1 of 4 1 2 3 4 Moderated by  Jackie  Hop To General Topics ------  Information and announcements  Q&A about words  Wordplay and fun  Words and languages in schools  Miscellany  Weekly Themes  Looking for (writers, speakers,... (Old) Weekly themes. 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