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#170156 09/23/07 06:54 PM
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http://www.amazon.com/Zen-Its-History-and-Teachings/dp/0681153172

(1) Interesting from a historical perspective but doesn't it weaken much of the rest of his entire works when at the start of this book he claims, much as do the Scientologists, that vegetation thinks and feels: "Plants are telepathic" says he

(2) Osho among others claims that Zen is neither a religion nor a philosophy. What is it

(3) Is it possible they're just trying to put it over on us, that Zen is pure nonsense. As with Scientology (and arguably, almost all religion) the individual might gain a feeling of detachment if not fulfilment and happiness purely through a process of autosuggestion

In the latter connection one might also read The Varieties of Religious Experience by William James


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when trees are being attached by gypsy moths, they start to release a pheramone type substance (via leaves and roots.)

other nearby trees (of the same species) respond by making their leaves more toxic (in the case of Oaks, they produce more tannins)
this makes the near by trees less attractive as food to the moths catapillars.

is this telapathic?

why would trees communicate at all, (and why would other trees respond to the communications?

we tend to think plants just sit there, defensiveless... but..

as to xen or scientology, or for that matter, any other religious beleivies or tenets.. that subject is not up for discussion on this board.

(OH, i know, you forgot.. again!)

well the trees communicate danger.

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Originally Posted By: dalehileman
http://www.amazon.com/Zen-Its-History-and-Teachings/dp/0681153172

(1) Interesting from a historical perspective but doesn't it weaken much of the rest of his works when at the start of this book he claims, as do the Scientologists, that vegetation thinks and feels. What? "Plants are telepathic"?

(2) Osho claims that Zen is neither a religion nor a philosophy. What is it?

(3) Is it possible they're just trying to put it over us, and that Zen is pure nonsense? As with Scientology (and arguably, almost all religion) the individual might gain a feeling of detachment if not fulfilment and happiness purely through a process of autosuggestion.


(1) Of course plants are telepathic. Did you not understand the Buddha's conversation with the flower? Let me tell you about my conversation yesterday with a snake.

The snake, a young copperhead, had somehow slithered inside my house. After a chase I cornered him behind a big chair and pinned him down with a broom handle. He was beautiful. I didn't want to kill him but I didn't want him to bite me or anyone else, and, as a matter of circumspection, I didn't want to beat him to death with the broom handle because the pounding might make deep indentures into the hardwood floor. So I just stood on the handle that pinned his head to the floor and watched him writhe and writhe for several minutes and during this time we had an honest man-to-snake, snake-to-man converstion about the nature of life and what we creatures are to each other and where we are going.

Then I grabbed a nearby metal floorlamp and with it's base I sawed his head off. And I've thought many thoughts about that snake today.


(2) Listen, Osho is telling you volumes about the nature of language.


(3) Hmm, dalehillman, it seems that you've missed Sosan's main point. Listen: (from pages 56-57)

If you wish to see the truth, then hold no opinions for or against. Move naked, with no clothes, with no opinions about truth, because truth abhors all opinions. Drop all your philosophies, theories, doctrines, scriptures! Drop all rubbish! Become silent, unchoosing. Your eyes ready to see what is, not in any way hoping to see your wishes fullfilled.

And then...

But if you drop these things then it will become a choice. -- this is a paradox. You are not supposed to drop it , because if you drop it that means you have chosen for or against and you are not supposed to make a choice.

And if you simply understand, then the very act of understanding becomes a dropping. Never drop it. Simply laugh...and ask for a cup of tea.


Understand?




Last edited by themilum; 09/24/07 03:14 AM.
themilum #170159 09/24/07 03:59 AM
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<-- holding out her cup... wearing nothing but a smile.

(Hoping to drink up and retain all the wisdom of those here)

DixieRose #170165 09/24/07 10:26 AM
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Now Dixie Rose, you march yourself and that cup right back in that house and put on some clothes. Don't you know there's a passel of menfolk lurking about out there? And ain't I done tole you about menfolk? They'll put a koan in your cup and call it wisdon and expect you to do tricks in return.

And go feed the chickens!

Last edited by themilum; 09/24/07 10:26 AM.
themilum #170167 09/24/07 11:04 AM
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A koan is not wisdom; it is a light shone upon the ignorance that is disguised as wisdom.

Faldage #170170 09/24/07 03:44 PM
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Helen: Thank you for that, indeed applicable and pertinent

But it's hard sometimes to suppress related questions, in a forum where participants often post connected issues somewhat beyond the word's exact meaning

The busy participant is thus invited to read only (2), skipping (1) and (3). Admin: If I have once again violated Protocol (forgive an old coot on the threshold of Alzheimer's), feel free to delete the entire thread

them: Very enlightening indeed and thank you for that prodigious effort. Could it all be summed up by asserting that one of the benefits of Zen is that it permits you to entertain two conflicting ideas at the same time without rejecting either one


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you are a participant

why don't you self edit and delete before posting?
that way only one person has to read only Q 2?

or edit and paraphrase so at to remove specific 'religions' i.e. some, hold that plants think or are telepathic.
(any one interested in comparative religious studies, or in any specific religous beliefs could read the book for themselves)

some, hold that plants think or are telepathic. is a religiously neutral statement, and still ask the question.
what is served by stating which religions?
--------------------------------------------------------------
so what is it are you old and almost senile (and should be totally ignored by everyone because of that? [/b]

or
are you self serving and manipulative (and should be ignored for your bad manners?)

or
are you a willing, active participant, able to understand and abide by simple protocal who should be ignored be cause you refuse to?

of troy #170174 09/24/07 05:20 PM
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> my other obsession

harassing dale instead of just ignoring him....



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Helen: My No. 2 Son suggests that you may have a many as 15 cats. We have two, their names Bob (because he has a bob tail and because he looks like a bobcat) and Butters, becuse that's the nickname of our No. 1 Son Lee


dalehileman
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