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#148101 09/22/05 08:28 AM
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Faldo:

What people say and what people write (or should write) are not exactly synonymous. Certainly commas represent pauses, but what I started to say and then got distracted and forgot in my last post was that these usages were for written more-or-less formal English.

TEd



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#148102 09/22/05 10:34 AM
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these usages were for written more-or-less formal English.

Wull, y'see, 'ere's the parblem. Ain' nobody minds if y'all perscrippivis's goes round settin' no rules for no special occasions. It's when y'all starts garbigin' aroun' pulin' an' micturatin' about anybody does anyth'n differmints in any situation whatsoever.

An' ifn you checks 'at document wit all nem funny commas an stuff, they's a thang in nere says cain't bus nobudy fer doon someth'n what ain' bun made illegal yet. When did y'all start spewin out nem rules bout where y'all kin an cain't stick no commas?


#148103 09/22/05 12:22 PM
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Commas are rules, even if the rule is "pause here." Either that, or they are stray markings.

Where is the meat in the prescriptivist/descriptivist divide? So much seems the fault line of a parlor row.


#148104 09/22/05 12:46 PM
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> meat

yeah, seems to me to be skating the thin line between stagnation and anarchy.



formerly known as etaoin...
#148105 09/22/05 02:20 PM
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the thin line between stagnation and anarchy. As in "The Thin Blue Line"? The grammar police?!


#148106 09/22/05 02:56 PM
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After Deconstruction]

say Jackie, back to your original question: are you laughing yet?!


#148107 09/22/05 04:09 PM
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>>police<<

Smile

But I'm serious. Descriptivists, for example, may observe uses or 'gramars' that are not captured by the categories of prescriptivist grammar(s) which are themselves also based, in part at least, on observation. To some extent, the prescriptivists only convert observed into a rule. At the same time, descriptivists convert 'liberty' to a rule. Related is the approach to use in legal writing. It does more than pretend to accuracy, but also strategically subverts meaning.

Edit: I guess this is true of a lot of discourse. An ancillary question, then, is what distinguishes the subversive behaviors of legal speech and writing from those of other forms of discourse.


#148108 09/22/05 05:34 PM
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are you laughing yet?! Yes! I hadn't expected that what I thought was a simple question would spark off such a debate, but that's fine. But I loved eta's getting back to the opening point!


Edit: darn it, why can't I learn/remember NOT to use the same word twice in close proximity!!

#148109 09/22/05 05:44 PM
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I wish I could take credit for thinking of the Thin Blue line ref, but I was actually just sort of thinking out loud about what would happen were one scriptivist camp to win...

ok, I'll take credit anyway. <wink>



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#148110 09/22/05 09:33 PM
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At the same time, descriptivists convert 'liberty' to a rule.

Exactly. The rules are there. Even in the most illiterate speech, there are rules. What the descriptivist does is describe those rules.


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