Wordsmith.org: the magic of words

Wordsmith Talk

About Us | What's New | Search | Site Map | Contact Us  

Previous Thread
Next Thread
Print Thread
Page 1 of 3 1 2 3
#122762 - 02/12/04 04:39 AM Punning  
Joined: Jan 2001
Posts: 137
ladymoon Offline
member
ladymoon  Offline
member

Joined: Jan 2001
Posts: 137
Usually the western United Sta...
In a class that I'm taking we were told that punning was a strictly western phenomenon. English being one of the few languages in which it's possible. German and Japanese being examples given in which it's not possible. Opinions? If we were discussing in Russian would Ted be... Ted?


#122763 - 02/12/04 06:35 AM Re: Punning  
Joined: Jan 2004
Posts: 1,475
jheem Offline
veteran
jheem  Offline
veteran

Joined: Jan 2004
Posts: 1,475
California
Rubbish. I was told a Sanskrit pun by an Indian professor. Japanese and Chinese lend themselves easily to punning. (Jiguchi is the Japanese word for pun.) I've heard puns and even told one in German. The people they have teaching today. Really.


#122764 - 02/12/04 07:34 AM Re: Punning  
Joined: Jul 2003
Posts: 3,230
sjmaxq Offline
Carpal Tunnel
sjmaxq  Offline
Carpal Tunnel

Joined: Jul 2003
Posts: 3,230
Te Ika a Maui
There are several examples of puns in the Tanakh, from memory Jeremiah uses quite a few.


#122765 - 02/12/04 07:41 AM Re: Punning  
Joined: Nov 2003
Posts: 81
Jenet Offline
journeyman
Jenet  Offline
journeyman

Joined: Nov 2003
Posts: 81
I would have thought that every language in the world had punning and word-play. The Sumerians punned in the Epic of Gilgamesh.


#122766 - 02/12/04 11:23 AM Re: Punning  
Joined: Dec 2000
Posts: 13,803
Faldage Offline
Carpal Tunnel
Faldage  Offline
Carpal Tunnel

Joined: Dec 2000
Posts: 13,803
Not to mention that punning is an important element of haiku.


#122767 - 02/12/04 01:44 PM Re: Punning  
Joined: Nov 2000
Posts: 3,439
wow Offline
Carpal Tunnel
wow  Offline
Carpal Tunnel

Joined: Nov 2000
Posts: 3,439
New England, USA
In a class that I'm taking we were told that punning was a strictly western phenomenon.
Which just goes to show you ya gotta challenge everything!
Read "Mau Mauing the Flack Catchers" by the guy who wrote "The Right Stuff" and whose name escapes me at the moment. It's a very short essay thing that I recommended to all reporters.


#122768 - 02/12/04 08:59 PM Re: Punning  
Joined: Jun 2002
Posts: 1,624
Capfka Offline
Pooh-Bah
Capfka  Offline
Pooh-Bah

Joined: Jun 2002
Posts: 1,624
Utter Placebo, Planet Reebok
That'd be Tom Wolfe, methinks.


#122769 - 02/12/04 10:39 PM Re: Punning  
Joined: Jan 2001
Posts: 137
ladymoon Offline
member
ladymoon  Offline
member

Joined: Jan 2001
Posts: 137
Usually the western United Sta...
An important element of haiku, this I don't remember ever knowing. Maybe the puns have been lost on me in the translation. My japanese is limited to greetings and apologizing for not knowing japanese on the phone.


#122770 - 02/12/04 11:23 PM Re: Punning  
Joined: Jul 2000
Posts: 3,467
TEd Remington Offline
Carpal Tunnel
TEd Remington  Offline
Carpal Tunnel

Joined: Jul 2000
Posts: 3,467
Marion NC
Nope. Ted would be Fyodor, or the bad smell coming from taking an illegal bribe.

Puns are, I imagine, ubiquitous. Romans and Greeks were quite fond of them. Semper ubi sub ubi.

Some of you will remember the almost rancorous discussion we had after I posted a reward for a joke that was (a) not a pun and (b) had no butt of the humor. Humor begins with puns.

Try telling a joke to a six-year-old. The ONLY thing they laugh at it puns. It's only later, when they become aware of sarcasm, hatred, malice, etc., that they begin to understand jokes that are not word plays.

I've always maintained that the maturity of a race or ehtnic group can be judged somewhat reliably by the self-deprecation of their humor. To perhaps stereotype a bit, Jews REALLY know how to laugh at themselves and certainly do not mind others telling Jewish jokes. Until recently, the same could not be said of, for example, blacks and Hispanics.

But as these groups become more aware of themselves and more comfortable with themselves, they are able to laugh at their own stereotypes.

Note that these are generalizations based on my own empirical observations.

Parenthetically, I've noticed that the more conservative Christians aren't there yet. I made the mistake recently of telling this joke where there was such a person present:

A Texan was sitting next to a born-again Christian on an airplane. The flight attendant brought the Texan a double whiskey neat and inquired of his seatmate if he would like a drink. The Christian drew back: "I'd sooner be raped by a thousand prostitutes than have liquor cross my lips."

The Texan handed the drink back to the flight attendant. "Hell, ma'am, take this away, I waren't aware we had a choice."

The person I told this joke to told me in no uncertain terms that I was going to Hell!

Oh well. At least I'm gonna be in good company.



TEd
#122771 - 02/12/04 11:27 PM Re: Punning  
Joined: Aug 2002
Posts: 2,154
Zed Offline
Pooh-Bah
Zed  Offline
Pooh-Bah

Joined: Aug 2002
Posts: 2,154
British Columbia, Canada
And the Isrealites in old testament times used to take enemy's names and replace them with phonetically similar insults. I forget which king was renamed Dog's Vomit.
Effective resistance technique as the enemy would just think you were having trouble pronouncing his name.



#122772 - 02/12/04 11:34 PM Re: Punning in haiku  
Joined: Dec 2000
Posts: 13,803
Faldage Offline
Carpal Tunnel
Faldage  Offline
Carpal Tunnel

Joined: Dec 2000
Posts: 13,803
Puns are practically impossible to translate (I don't know how they do it in Asterix)

This is the best site on haiku I could find quickly. Check particularly the links to A few practical rules and The puns and plays of word

http://web.wanadoo.be/tempslibres/en/mode0.html


#122773 - 02/13/04 12:19 AM Re: mooning in haiku  
Joined: Jun 2002
Posts: 7,210
Buffalo Shrdlu Offline
Carpal Tunnel
Buffalo Shrdlu  Offline
Carpal Tunnel

Joined: Jun 2002
Posts: 7,210
Vermont
http://web.wanadoo.be/tempslibres/en/info01.html

from Faldage's link
some nifty names of the moons
need time to ponder.



formerly known as etaoin...
#122774 - 02/13/04 12:32 AM Re: Punning  
Joined: Mar 2000
Posts: 6,511
AnnaStrophic Offline
Carpal Tunnel
AnnaStrophic  Offline
Carpal Tunnel

Joined: Mar 2000
Posts: 6,511
lower upstate New York
ladymoon, it's nice to see you around again.

What I'd like to know is: on what authority did your teacher assert this? What credentials does s/he possess? What foreign languages does this person speak? Have you mentioned our collective response in class?


#122775 - 02/13/04 01:25 AM Re: Punning  
Joined: Jan 2001
Posts: 137
ladymoon Offline
member
ladymoon  Offline
member

Joined: Jan 2001
Posts: 137
Usually the western United Sta...
I haven't mentioned it yet because we currently have someone else teaching the class while the first is in Japan (telling them they can't pun?) He's also spent time in Germany. (I will not assume he speaks German, but I think he lived there eight years.)


#122776 - 02/13/04 01:42 AM Re: Punning  
Joined: Jan 2001
Posts: 13,858
wwh Offline
Carpal Tunnel
wwh  Offline
Carpal Tunnel

Joined: Jan 2001
Posts: 13,858
Does anyone know a term for a bilingual pun?
Such as: Why is a virgin like a sneeze?


#122777 - 02/13/04 07:20 AM Re: Punning  
Joined: Mar 2002
Posts: 1,692
dxb Offline
Pooh-Bah
dxb  Offline
Pooh-Bah

Joined: Mar 2002
Posts: 1,692
UK
I don't know, Perfesser. Why *is a virgin like a sneeze?


#122778 - 02/13/04 08:44 PM Re: Punning  
Joined: Jan 2001
Posts: 13,858
wwh Offline
Carpal Tunnel
wwh  Offline
Carpal Tunnel

Joined: Jan 2001
Posts: 13,858
When a little girl sneezed, her Dad said "Gesundheit!"
The little girl protested:"Daddy, Gesundheit hurts!"


#122779 - 02/13/04 08:49 PM Re: Punning  
Joined: Dec 2000
Posts: 13,803
Faldage Offline
Carpal Tunnel
Faldage  Offline
Carpal Tunnel

Joined: Dec 2000
Posts: 13,803
Arright. If she's a virgin, how's she know gesundheit hurts?


#122780 - 02/13/04 09:12 PM Re: Punning  
Joined: Jan 2001
Posts: 13,858
wwh Offline
Carpal Tunnel
wwh  Offline
Carpal Tunnel

Joined: Jan 2001
Posts: 13,858
Her big sister told her.


#122781 - 02/14/04 01:40 PM Re: Punning  
Joined: Jan 2001
Posts: 13,858
wwh Offline
Carpal Tunnel
wwh  Offline
Carpal Tunnel

Joined: Jan 2001
Posts: 13,858
Die ganze Welt ist mit weh voll! 'tsuris!


#122782 - 02/14/04 02:23 PM Re: Punning  
Joined: Nov 2000
Posts: 3,439
wow Offline
Carpal Tunnel
wow  Offline
Carpal Tunnel

Joined: Nov 2000
Posts: 3,439
New England, USA
on what authority did your teacher assert this? What credentials does s/he possess? What foreign languages does this person speak? Have you mentioned our collective response in class?

That's it, annaS ... mau mau them flack catchers!


#122783 - 02/14/04 08:56 PM Re: Punning  
Joined: Jan 2001
Posts: 13,858
wwh Offline
Carpal Tunnel
wwh  Offline
Carpal Tunnel

Joined: Jan 2001
Posts: 13,858
From O.Henry's "The Voice of the City":
I walked up to Broadway. I saw a cop on the corner. The cops take kids up, women across, and men in. I went up to him.
If I'm not exceeding the spiel limit," I said, "let me ask you. You see New York during its vocative hours. It is the function of you and your brother cops to preserve the acoustics of the city. There must be a civic voice that is intelligible to you. At night during your lonely rounds you must have beard it. What is the epitome of its turmoil and shouting? What does the city say to you?

Is substituting "spiel" for "speed" a pun?



#122784 - 02/14/04 10:16 PM Punning in the OT  
Joined: Sep 2000
Posts: 2,788
Father Steve Offline
Carpal Tunnel
Father Steve  Offline
Carpal Tunnel

Joined: Sep 2000
Posts: 2,788
Seattle, Washington, USA
http://academic.brooklyn.cuny.edu/economic/friedman/bibhumor.htm

This is an interesting article on the use of humour in the Hebrew Bible.



Page 1 of 3 1 2 3

Moderated by  Jackie 

Forum Statistics
Forums16
Topics13,878
Posts223,797
Members9,012
Most Online3,341
Dec 9th, 2011
Newest Members
KathrynH, Waqar_Ali, brecht, Akintola, VegasCaptain
9012 Registered Users
Who's Online Now
1 registered members (A C Bowden), 54 guests, and 2 spiders.
Key: Admin, Global Mod, Mod
Top Posters(30 Days)
Top Posters(All Time)
wwh 13,858
Faldage 13,803
Jackie 11,613
tsuwm 10,538
LukeJavan8 8,947
AnnaStrophic 6,511
Wordwind 6,296
of troy 5,400
Disclaimer: Wordsmith.org is not responsible for views expressed on this site. Use of this forum is at your own risk and liability - you agree to hold Wordsmith.org and its associates harmless as a condition of using it.

Home | Today's Word | Yesterday's Word | Subscribe | FAQ | Archives | Search | Feedback
Wordsmith Talk | Wordsmith Chat

© 1994-2017 Wordsmith

Powered by UBB.threads™ PHP Forum Software 7.6.0
Page Time: 0.019s Queries: 13 (0.003s) Memory: 2.8326 MB (Peak: 3.0590 MB) Zlib disabled. Server Time: 2017-07-28 00:54:54 UTC